• 33 years ago today (Mar 27, 1976-Mar 27, 2009)

  • Discussion related to DC area passenger rail services from Northern Virginia to Baltimore, MD. Includes Light Rail and Baltimore Subway.
Discussion related to DC area passenger rail services from Northern Virginia to Baltimore, MD. Includes Light Rail and Baltimore Subway.

Moderators: mtuandrew, therock, Robert Paniagua

  by Sand Box John
 
WMATA opened the 4.5 mile (7.24 km) Phase I of the then planned 97.2 mile (156.42 km) metrorail system.

  by CHIP72
 
One can only imagine what the city of Washington would be like had the Metro not been built. There's no doubt in my mind the city wouldn't be doing anywhere near as well as it is right now if the Metro wasn't there. The museums and whatnot on the National Mall would probably be virtual ghost towns a lot of the time too.

  by walt
 
CHIP72 wrote:One can only imagine what the city of Washington would be like had the Metro not been built. There's no doubt in my mind the city wouldn't be doing anywhere near as well as it is right now if the Metro wasn't there. The museums and whatnot on the National Mall would probably be virtual ghost towns a lot of the time too.
You'd be standing on Georgia Ave. NW at 4:00pm while 15 full buses pass you by!

  by Sand Box John
 
"CHIP72"One can only imagine what the city of Washington would be like had the Metro not been built. There's no doubt in my mind the city wouldn't be doing anywhere near as well as it is right now if the Metro wasn't there. The museums and whatnot on the National Mall would probably be virtual ghost towns a lot of the time too.

I seriously doubt your predictions would have become reality. The National Mall was not a ghost town before metrorail. The market share for transportation by transit in the Washington Metropolitan area is just under 6 percent, inside Washington DC it's something under 15 percent. With a few exception most of the economic development in the region has taken place outside the corridors established by metrorail. The way the city is administrated under home rule I doubt things would be much different then things are today development wise. Their would likely be a hell of a lot more busses on the streets now, though operating under a different operating authority or authorities.

  by CHIP72
 
I somewhat disagree in that the Metro has a much higher number of riders than heavy rail systems in similar-sized and even larger U.S. cities, such as Chicago, San Francisco/Oakland, Philadelphia, and Boston, much less a place like Los Angeles. A lot of those riders are people working for the federal government, but a decent chunk of those riders are tourists. With DC being in my eyes being a very difficult city to get into and out of by highway, at least when you're talking about the National Mall and surrounding areas, a lot of development in the center of DC wouldn't have taken place without the Metro, because the core would have been much more inaccessible. A greater number of federal jobs may have also been relocated outside the District itself without the Metro.

I admittedly was probably overstating things when I said the museums and other attractions on the National Mall would be a ghost town; what I really meant is those attractions would probably have gotten significantly fewer visitors than they do now. I DO believe that would be true.

  by Robert Paniagua
 
Wow, in 31 years has this system grown and attracted all new business and made thigs easier for everyone. Happy Anniversary to WMATA!! Now, I hope they continue their improvement.

  by walt
 
CHIP72 wrote:
I admittedly was probably overstating things when I said the museums and other attractions on the National Mall would be a ghost town; what I really meant is those attractions would probably have gotten significantly fewer visitors than they do now. I DO believe that would be true.
A more likely scenareo would have been almost total grid lock. That "15 bus" comment I made in my earlier post was a somewhat exaggerated version of what used to actually happen on Georgia Ave. in the days immediately prior to the opening of the Metrorail system. The tourist trade in the Federal portion of DC would probably not have suffered very much since, in the pre Metro days, most people arrived from out of town on tour buses. I remember being "downtown" in those days, and there were significant numbers of tourists in that area even without Metro. Driving, on the other hand, would be much worse than it is now, and it's pretty bad now. What you would not have seen is the extensive development which has occurred in the vicinity of Metro stations, both inside and outside of the District.

  by Sand Box John
 
"CHIP72"
I somewhat disagree in that the Metro has a much higher number of riders than heavy rail systems in similar-sized and even larger U.S. cities, such as Chicago, San Francisco/Oakland, Philadelphia, and Boston, much less a place like Los Angeles. A lot of those riders are people working for the federal government, but a decent chunk of those riders are tourists. With DC being in my eyes being a very difficult city to get into and out of by highway, at least when you're talking about the National Mall and surrounding areas, a lot of development in the center of DC wouldn't have taken place without the Metro, because the core would have been much more inaccessible. A greater number of federal jobs may have also been relocated outside the District itself without the Metro.

I admittedly was probably overstating things when I said the museums and other attractions on the National Mall would be a ghost town; what I really meant is those attractions would probably have gotten significantly fewer visitors than they do now. I DO believe that would be true.


The alternately to metrorail would have been the DeLeuw, Cather Associates plans from the 1950 and 1960 prepared for District of Columbia Department of Highways and Traffic. It is described in the Washington D.C. Interstates and Freeways page at roadstothefuture.com

Much of the growth in the housing of federal administrative facilities has been outside the downtown federal enclave. The Internal Revenue Service has a building in New Carrollton, The Department of Agriculture expanded their administrative offices on their properties in Beltsville, The Archives built an annex in Collage Park, The Census Bureau is located in Suitland, The Social Security Administration is on the west side of Baltimore, Bureau of Standards now National Institute of Standards and Technology moved there facilities out of DC to Gaithersburg. Social Security and National Institute of Standards and Technology opened their new facilities before metrorail carried it’s first paying passenger. The former Bolling Air Force Base across the Potomac River from National Airport is home to numerous federal agency annexes. . . .

  by Robert Paniagua
 
And also the NRC Nuclear Regulatory Commission (NRC) building is in Rockville, and yes, I am very familiar with the NIST facilities in Gaithersburg (bus accessible) and the Department of Energy is in Germantown, MD thus WMATA and Ride On accessible.

  by walt
 
This is one of the problems that is surfacing now with regard to future metrorail and transit planning. The idea that the District would be the somewhat exclusive home to the federal agencies and those entities which "feed" off of the Federal Government has long been rendered obsolete. The current Metrorail system was designed primarily to funnel passengers into downtown DC which it does very well. The problem now is the increasing amount of traffic from one suburban location to another, without the kind of convenient transit service, particularly rail service, that Metrorail provides for travel into the District. This is resulting in the kinds of controversial plans like the Intercounty Connector and arguments about whether the Purple Line should be rail or some form of "Bus Rapid Transit" and whether a Dulles expansion of Metrorail should be built over or under Tyson's Corner.

  by Sand Box John
 
"walt"
This is one of the problems that is surfacing now with regard to future metrorail and transit planning. The idea that the District would be the somewhat exclusive home to the federal agencies and those entities which "feed" off of the Federal Government has long been rendered obsolete. The current Metrorail system was designed primarily to funnel passengers into downtown DC which it does very well. The problem now is the increasing amount of traffic from one suburban location to another, without the kind of convenient transit service, particularly rail service, that Metrorail provides for travel into the District. This is resulting in the kinds of controversial plans like the Intercounty Connector and arguments about whether the Purple Line should be rail or some form of "Bus Rapid Transit" and whether a Dulles expansion of Metrorail should be built over or under Tyson's Corner.


The is a dilemma that is not exclusive to the Washington metropolitan area. Transit planners around the nation are having to deal with fact that their downtown cores are no longer the primary employment centers. Major metropolitan areas around the nation are dotted with "edge cities". The Washington metropolitan area has a large share of them.

I believe I have pointed out in this forum in the past that the Tysons, Dulles Loudon county extension will likely generate significant numbers of boardings that will be going to other destination along the extension and others that are not outside Virginia.

  by MACTRAXX
 
Everyone: Metrorail has come a long way in 31 years! I first visited Washington to use and travel on METRO in February 1978. At that point the Red line from Rhode Island Avenue to Silver Spring had just opened weeks before. The system was open from 6am to 8pm weekdays only. I visited WAS on a somewhat regular basis from then into the late 80s. The system began to come into its own with the opening from Stadium-Armory to National Airport Blue Line section in 1977. Later that year-11/20/1978 the New Carrollton Orange line opened-the first METRO line to reach a planned terminus. In a map collection I have access to here at NRHS National, METRO would update the ALL ABOUT METRO map and guide with every station and line opening. We have the original from'76 and eight subsequent revisions between then and 4/1983. Later in the mid 80s it was changed to read "ALL ABOUT THE METRO SYSTEM". I remember that the idea was to build the planned 101-mile system and then extend outward. Today the Blue Line goes to Largo Town center and perhaps the Orange Line may eventually get to Dulles Airport. I cannot help but wonder what the DC area would have become without Metrorail-it has made Washington and the area much more appealing to many. As an example of change I recall is the Silver Spring METRO station-I remember how it was in the 78-79 time period and with all the development in that area what it has become. I would like to know if anyone has now and then photographs of pivotal METRO stations? The TTC in Toronto published a booklet showing how much change occured after TTC subway lines began operation and boosted the economy and local property values. Good rail transit is always helpful for a variety of reasons! Observations and memories from MACTRAXX
  by Robert Paniagua
 
Well folks, it has now been 32 years ago this morning since the first revenue run in WMATA unlike NYCTA or MBTA wich opened more than 100 years ago, but it's here.

32 years afterwards and now, looks like things have improved a bit, hopefully things will get better and better.

  by Sand Box John
 
In other news:

Group Ends Suit to Block Planned Metro Line to Dulles

By Bill Turque
Washington Post Staff Writer
Thursday, March 27, 2008

They think the project is dead. I happen to believe otherwise.

Cash-Strapped Metro Needs Millions in Repairs

By Lena H. Sun
Washington Post Staff Writer
Thursday, March 27, 2008

This same basic story is not new. The only difference is the laundry list of things that need to be repaired or replaced has changed.

  by Robert Paniagua
 
Oh boy, I hope that the can get those tiles and concrete fixed soon, especially at my entry/exit point, Shady Grove Station.