Why MP15's for passenger power?

lirr415 wrote:

break the seals wrote:

DutchRailnut wrote:with the DE/DM history its not a waste but redundancy

The engines reliability issues are no longer an issue anymore dutch.. The real problem these days are the cabcars...

And that also goes along with why they have 2 locomotives for the short trains, cab car issues.

Correct. Right now there's a 4 car set with 2 DMs on the Oyster Bay branch..

I'm not sure if it also helps with the slip-slide issues? Better braking plus the ablility to sand?

braking should be same both ends, unless the C3 cabcars have no sanders.
but were diverting of original topic.

One negative comment I heard from a veteran engineman about the MP15s. This was at Jamaica one evening when he was about to go east to OB. He said, "I hate these things." Primarily because when operating 'short hood' (actually 'no hood') forward there was nothing between you and whatever you hit except a handrail and glass. Good reason.

Did they ever make a rule that the MP15s must operate long hood forward in passenger service? Seems like as time went on I seldom saw one operating no hood forward.

As a fan i liked them run either way, but for safety i can definitely understand an engineer preferring them hood first.

WB freight at Bethpage,NY. on the Central Branch, just east of B Tower. 10.22.1985

I remember seeing those B&O boxcars with the wheel-assisted doors at Hicksville Yard every now and again back in the mid-80's, right around the time of the above photo. I remember the yard full of them one Saturday morning in particular, along with North Louisiana & Gulf, Illinois Central Gulf and Norfolk & Western boxes. The 150 & 160 were laying over too, along with a hack. Behind them, also on the track closest to the freight house were Alco C420 222 and the 154. That was the first and only time I ever saw 4 locomotives together in Hicksville Yard at the same time. Pretty cool.

Also when you run an MP15 backwards, it's very drafty, which really sucks in the dead of winter. They're drafty when you run them normal too, but not as bad as when the B end is leading.

I don't think there was ever any rule regarding which direction you could run an MP15 in passenger service, but it was required with the gp38s that you shall not be required to operate one long hood forward in passenger service. In fact, it's still in the contract booklet, even though I doubt we'll ever see a gp38 pulling a passenger train on the LIRR.

The NYA has, on occasion, run their GP38-2's long-hood forward. I guess that proviso does not matter in freight service with that company.

Wrong. Read the BLE contract a little closer. They were run backwards quite often.

Didn't he say "shall not be required" to run LHF? That would make sense, almost too obviously to be a rule.

In the industry a GP-38 or any other road switcher could be operated in either direction without restriction. Most freight
railroads in through freight operations would not run them long nose first but they always could. Usually with a local freight
it was absolutely necessary to operate them long nose first and this was done without any speed or any other restrictions.
It was generally understood and accepted that they would operate short end first whenever it was possible.
Noel Weaver

The C420s were run LHF. Why would there be a beef with the Geeps?

Crabman1130 wrote:The C420s were run LHF. Why would there be a beef with the Geeps?

Because the C420s were set up with the control stand located on the right hand side as you looked forward along the long hood, so the engineer was positioned correctly to read wayside signals and be able to see station platforms, etc. The Geeps were set up with the control stand located so that the short hood was the front. Thus, running long hood forward, the engineer was sighting along the long hood on the wrong side!

keyboardkat wrote:

Crabman1130 wrote:The C420s were run LHF. Why would there be a beef with the Geeps?

Because the C420s were set up with the control stand located on the right hand side as you looked forward along the long hood, so the engineer was positioned correctly to read wayside signals and be able to see station platforms, etc. The Geeps were set up with the control stand located so that the short hood was the front. Thus, running long hood forward, the engineer was sighting along the long hood on the wrong side!

Thanks for clearing that up. I was under the impression that the long hood was the reason.

This is why some roads, such as the CRR of NJ and the Southern Railway (later Norfolk Southern) ordered their hood-type diesel units with dual control stands, so that the engineer would be on the right-hand side of the cab, regardless of which hood was leading.

But with the Alco C420s, the last steam-equipped passenger diesels on the LIRR, the BLE insisted that the long hood be on the front because they said that, if the short hood was in front, in the event of a collision, the engineers would be in danger of scalding from the steam generator in the short hood, regardless of whatever other damage or injuries resulted.

Since the GP-38s had no steam generators, this was not an issue.