Question about ACSES-equipped CSX engines

This was the source of a discussion on the Metro-North forum, and am coming here to ask this, with hopes a CSX employee or someone knowledgeable on CSX equipment assigned to Oak Point Yard and Cedar Hill Yard would be able to make clear and assist.

Two classes of engines I have seen appear on CSX locals at Oak Point Yard and Cedar Hill Yard are the 2700 numbered-series GP38-2s and the 6200 numbered-series GP40-2s, an occasional 6200-series has appeared at Oak Point, and 2700-series have appeared on the Cedar Hill locals, and I am trying to find out if both the 2700-series GP38-2s and 6200-series GP40-2s are equipped with Amtrak's Automatic Civil Speed Enforcement System (ACSES) cab signal equipment for operation on the NEC east of CP 274 (New Haven, Division Post - Amtrak). Does anyone happen to know?? This is for not only my knowledge bu to enlighten those making mention on the Metro-North forum posts. Any and all help is appreciated, be it from fellow rail buffs and/or railroaders. Thanks!!

I know the 6200 series are equipped with cab signals because those are the units used on the Amtrak line up here in Boston and the Cedar Hill Yard connects to the NEC.

atsf sp wrote:I know the 6200 series are equipped with cab signals because those are the units used on the Amtrak line up here in Boston and the Cedar Hill Yard connects to the NEC.

I figured that the 6200-series would have them, so thanks for confirming that!! I know I have seen the 2700-series show up at Cedar Hill (B-747) as well, and they commonly hang out at Oak Point and Croton West (Metro-North Hudson Line), so I am very curious about them!! Thank you for the confirmation of the 6200s!!

i will try to look tonight if i remember,just to double check.i believe the CS box it self has 2 switches,1 marked RF&P-NEC-CS ONLY.i cant remember what the other said for the life of me,(on-off maybe).also here's a list of what i have personally seen at oak point yard.

2700 series gp38-2 (random units are not CS equipped)
2800 series gp38-2
5800 series b36-7 (have not seen these in a while and hope never to see them again)
6200 series gp40-2 (some of these units have taller fans and horns and cant run on MNRR Harlem line)
8700 series sd60m
8800 series sd40-2 (may be nearing the end as for oak point)

CS=cab signals

atsf sp wrote:I know the 6200 series are equipped with cab signals because those are the units used on the Amtrak line up here in Boston and the Cedar Hill Yard connects to the NEC.

Not all of the 6200's have A.C.S.E.S. I don't even remember if the 2700's have cab signals, but even if they do, they don't have ACSES. ACSES wouldn't be required out of Oak Point, nor would it be required working out of Cedar Hill towards The Mets. ACSES is only in service on the Shoreline from just east of Mill River INterlocking to just west of Cove Interlocking.

CSX Conductor wrote:

atsf sp wrote:I know the 6200 series are equipped with cab signals because those are the units used on the Amtrak line up here in Boston and the Cedar Hill Yard connects to the NEC.

Not all of the 6200's have A.C.S.E.S. I don't even remember if the 2700's have cab signals, but even if they do, they don't have ACSES. ACSES wouldn't be required out of Oak Point, nor would it be required working out of Cedar Hill towards The Mets. ACSES is only in service on the Shoreline from just east of Mill River INterlocking to just west of Cove Interlocking.

Thanks regarding the 6200s!!! As for the 2700s, I understand they have MNR's cab signal apparatus (required since MNR no longer uses wayside automatic signals, except at interlockings), and the MNR cab signal unit, US&S, consists of "N" (Normal Cab), "L" (Limited Cab), "M" (Medium Cab), and "R" (Restricted Cab). If the 2700s were not so equipped, they would have to operate at Restricted Speed on MNR territory at all times, which would be sheer agony for B-749/750, who normally nets the 2700s, not to mention they also have led, from what I have seen a few times on the Hudson when working there after hours, leading Q-430 and Q-431.

The 6200 series units have PHW Cab Signals that go into Cab Signal Only, NEC and RFP. A big part of those units are equipped with ACSES. As far as the GP38-2 units go, the series of 2700 thru 2716 does not have Cab Signal, these units came from the Seaboard side of CSX. 2717 and up came from Conrail and they have Cab Signal on them. Some of them have what is know as the old EL system and some of them have EL/LSL and I believe some of these units that have EL/LSL was upgraded to the PHW ICAB system. The PHW ICAB will also go into NEC, RFP & CS Only.

The 6200's can also run on MNRR. Also, the 8800's (SD40-2's) run on MNRR's Hudson Line.

The 6200 and 5800 are former RF&P sub leaders, they were equipped by CSX to run on the acquired RF&P which had cab signals. CSX took great pains to make sure the RF&P CSS and CR/AMTK CSS would be the same by changing the RF&P from 100HZ to 60HZ. There are a few 639x GP40-2 that are ex RF&P that should be still equipped as well. You will recognize these, they have no dynamics.

The 5800s are soon to be retired, just like the 3100s were

Just about ALL former Conrail units had some sort of Cab Signals. CSX has removed a TON of the cab signal equipment however, and I know for a fact that not all the 2700s are equipped any longer. Some of the 8800s have had their CSS removed. ALL the ex CR GP15-1,GP40-2, and SD50s should have their CSS gone.

All new power ordered by CSX has cab signals too, but most of that is way to big, and way to important to be on MNRR. Anything ex CR that is an SD60M or newer will have fully functional CSS. Rumor has it that CSX wanted to send ex B40-8 CR units instead of SD60M but the truck dampeners would not clear the third rail.

As for ACSES, there should be only a fraction of them with it. I think about 4 units, the ACSES system is expensive for a loco that's a switch engine

Personally I think CSX is shooting itself in the foot by removing so much CSS equipment from it's locos. ex CR NS units all still have it.

[quote="Alcochaser"]As for ACSES, there should be only a fraction of them with it. I think about 4 units, the ACSES system is expensive for a loco that's a switch engine[quote] There are only about 20 6200's that have ACSES for working on the NEC.

I dont think that Amtrak requires freight units to have ACSES. On the southern part of the NEC more specifically, from Ragan to Prince interlockings is ACSES territory and NS runs a fair amount of locals and main line freights on that stretch and they arent ACSES equipped nor does Amtrak require them to be. Hell, on any ACSES sections of the NEC that I run on between NYC and DC, AMtrak doesnt even require NJT or Septa at this time to be ACSES equipped. Of course we know changes are in the air for these requirements.

Amtrak requires ASCES on the shore line only. If ASCES fails, on the Shore Line, freights are restricted to 30MPH.

MNR's #1 Conductor wrote:Amtrak's Automatic Civil Speed Enforcement System (ACSES) cab signal equipment

Just to clarify, ACSES stands for Advanced Civil Speed Enforcement. Not Automatic.

Secondly, as has been mentioned, currently, ACSES is only in place from Mill River going east. For now. Because of that, CSX does not need ACSES on loco's operating out of Oak Point or Even Cedar hill. CSX units operating out of Readville MA typically do have ACSES since they operate on the Corridor. CSX does need cab signals though since Metro North does not have wayside signals except for at interlockings. But these can be a simple 4 aspect system. But they would only be required on the lead unit of a consist.

The P&W has all there good (and i use that term loosely) road units equipped with ACSES since they run on the corridor daily and it would be too much of a hassle to not have the sytem and be restricted to 30mph.

ACSES will be coming to the Hell Gate line and ultimatley all the way to Washington in the near future. But it's still a few years away.

NV290 wrote:ACSES will be coming to the Hell Gate line and ultimatley all the way to Washington in the near future. But it's still a few years away.

Why the Hell-Gate if the max is 100 between Manor & Pelham Bay and cab signals drop to Approach Limited westbound at cat pole H174 (Just west of MP 17). Seems like a waste of money to put ACSES on the Hell-Gate.

CSX Conductor wrote:Why the Hell-Gate if the max is 100 between Manor & Pelham Bay and cab signals drop to Approach Limited westbound at cat pole H174 (Just west of MP 17). Seems like a waste of money to put ACSES on the Hell-Gate.

There is alot more to ACSES then simply cab signals. ACSES is not just a cab signal system. It also enforces permanent and temporary speed restrictions and enforces stop signals. Something Cab Signals alone cannot do.

Waste of money or not, just remember that by 2015 PTS will be required on all routes carrying passenger trains.