Acela II (Alstom Avelia Liberty): Design, Production, Delivery, Acceptance

It's interesting that this basically explains why retaining them for regional service is impossible - they're full of unsupported hardware and software. Either way, Alstom-BBD has really let themselves go to shit.

If they really implode Amtrak might end up holding an empty bag. Did they take on debt when they merged with Bombardier? Is this "cash flow" thing going to require them to borrow money at the new high interest rates? / issue junk bonds? The real problem is probably price competition from the Chinese.

I read the report. Oh boy! Here are some of my questions:

What type of computers are in the Acela 1? What processors? What operating system and version? How do they make the controller boards, with Programmable Logic Devices? Do they use industry standards, backplanes, etc?

Says that Amtrak ("The company") stopped paying Alstrom for Acela II in March 2023. So Alstrom has no revenue from Amtrak in six months while operating their factory and supposedly fixing defects?

Why are so many numbers redacted? It's not like Amtrak has competitors who will steal their financial information. It will come out eventually in court during the future lawsuits.

Why is there no "drop tables" at Bear which is supposed to be a heavier maintenance base than Ivy Yard? [OT] China Railcar (CRRC) had to use rare MBTA blacksmiths to make certain parts to repair defects in the new subway cars.

As for the legacy Acelas:
Why is the brake equipment from the four donor trainsets seemingly thrown about a storage trailer? If those are the only rare spares they should be resting on shelves with golden pillows. Is that the magic computers stacked on the floor in the same trailer? Those are probably literally worth their weight in gold.

These magic computers - did they only really make 20 of them? Did they not use the same computer modules in all Alstrom trains? Why were adequate spares not ordered while production lines were still open? Did they keep the drawings for the Printed Circuit Boards? If so it should be easy to make new ones. As for the semiconductors from 25 years ago, good luck finding them! Imagine if they have to build replacement computers, work-alike computer module boards, and certify them for 150 MPH operation, just to use them for a couple of years! Still probably worth it. There should be few problems using old software that has been proven to work.

For once I have a tiny bit of experience dealing with certain issues that you are bringing up there. Even if Amtrak was to say make a contract to maintain that equipment, it's probably obsolete.

Working at a aerospace facility, we are having trouble with some aircraft part supplies as the government isn't making any new orders of certain aircraft. By contract the company is obligated to supply the spare parts, but because there are no new vehicles there is no new demand on the horizon existing suppliers are eying the exits and offloading production. Frankly why should they stay on? To have their guys and resources tied up in an obsolete bespoke system with few units? They would rather pivot towards a guaranteed production line with a future which is what I suspect is whats happening here.

To what extent this development will affect the Aviella/Acela procurement, is unclear, but it certainly will not enhance such:

https://www.reuters.com/business/alstom ... 023-10-05/

Fair Use:

Oct 5 (Reuters) - Alstom's (ALSO.PA) shares closed 37.5% lower at 13.3 euros ($14.00) on Thursday after the maker of France's iconic TGV trains slashed its full-year free cash flow (FCF) target, fuelling concerns over its debt levels as interest rates rise.

The company's worst one-day share fall in more than 20 years wiped some 3 billion euros ($3.16 billion) from Alstom's market value.

On Wednesday evening, the company cut its full-year FCF guidance, pointing to order delays and a production ramp-up that weighed on cash.

The group said it now expects a cash outflow of 500-750 million euros over the full year, after a preliminary first-half outflow of 1.15 billion euros, well above the consensus for a 152 million euro outflow cited by Jefferies.

"Some time ago when interest rates were at zero, making no cash was not a big issue for a company. Now it is and the market has no mercy," said Angelo Meda, portfolio manager at Banor SIM in Milan.

While this development. could be considered "Cookie Jar Accounting" (a term I often used with my clients when I was in practice), now that $$$$ Is no longer "free" owing to the dramatic rise in interest rates, this could have resulted in "corners being cut" with appropriate testing of the components that seem to figure in the Amtrak IG's report.

BandA wrote: ↑Fri Oct 06, 2023 1:10 am I read the report. Oh boy! Here are some of my questions:
.....
Why are so many numbers redacted? It's not like Amtrak has competitors who will steal their financial information. It will come out eventually in court during the future lawsuits.
.....

Good points. With respect to the redacted numbers becoming public, it is common in civil litigation for a non-disclosure order to be issued by the judge in the discovery process. Such allows the parties to have the redacted information but the parties must not use for their business or disclose the information to anyone else or face potentially severe sanctions for contempt of court and other damages.

Here's some more information:

https://www.oleantimesherald.com/news/a ... c511b.html

First, to GBN,

WRT the SDP40F and the subsequent F40PH, the 16-645E3 prime mover is the same. That’s a significant assembly right there. That took 132 of the SDP40Fs straight into hanging the heavy parts on a new frame with Blomberg trucks.

There’s a significant difference between that and the two generations of electrics.

With regard to computing, we had a fair to middling clue of the future when Acela 1s rolled out. I’d like to see the IT specifications. If Amtrak did not require going forward compatibility of the software to future hardware, someone in Amtrak’s procurement shop needs to go to prison for fraud, waste and abuse. In my now (former) employment at IRS, our major computing system is older than dog snot, yet it can be run under a Win 11 network environment.

Finally, Modelling? Suck it up, Almstom. There are excellent computer systems modelers out there. The equipment, and the NEC, can be modeled with great precision. You just lowballed your bid.

Interesting..... that might explain why Sen. Shumer was out shilling to have Alstom be the Brighline and CAHSR supplier less than a month back..... they knew they needed to be propped up ahead of the OIG Report.

Can't wait to see this all happen again with the potential Superliner replacement and the Corradia rollout.

Sent from my SM-S911U using Tapatalk

Well. hopefully, Mr. Olesen, the METRA Board will have an "out" from those 200 cars enabling them to order equipment suited to the "new normal" that RTO5X is in the history books.

To me, that would be three car DMU sets much as I have ridden overseas in recent years. The existing METRA fleet that has been placed in service this century would be assigned to the "rush hour" trains. The '60's vintage carbon steel from the C&NW and RI would meet the torch.

Now back on Amtrak, I thought that when Bombardier was bought out by Alstom, that a whole catalog of HSR equipment built for the SNCF (and RENFE?) would be available and that sufficient "on-shore" assembly capacity would be available to meet existing "buy American" requirements. The same analogy applies to Siemens AG who have built the DB's ICE equipment as well as the conventional locomotive hauled (and pushed) OBB and CD Rail Jets, which having ridden many Klicks in both, should be the standard for H(er)SR (in Austria, they can run at 220 kph over conventional rail).

So it just seems to these European builders, they can "get away" with "junk over here, perfection back home".

Who would've predicted that after decades of building TGVs and Pendolinos in Europe, Alstom would have such a hard time combining the two into a single product, even if it is a new iteration of the long established TGV family? Is it a case of US assembly being not up to par? (Much like my Lafayette, Indiana assembled Subaru Legacy perhaps being a half a notch below the Japanese assembled Subarus in build quality? Can't complain too much, it's at 17 years and 178k miles despite a few headaches along the way and a second set of blown head gaskets.)

For years I suggested Amtrak really should have taken the option on the extra 70 cars. There were several arguments against the idea (and some I'll admit had some merit).

One such argument of course was how poorly CAF screwed up the original order. I can't dispute that, but eventually Amtrak got its sleepers. My argument was, since the kinks had been worked out, might as well go with a now known quantity and get more.

Of course when the Avelia order was made, a lot of folks talked about how at least Alstom was a known quantity and all. We all know how that worked out.

Seems like in general it's just hard to get new equipment working on Amtrak's rails.

I guess besides being on a soapbox, I'm saying, despite the teething woes, I do expect eventually we'll be riding in new Avelia trains and that if anything, once the kinks are worked out, Amtrak should consider keeping the manufacturing line open a bit longer just in case of increased demand.

It's not just an Amtrak problem, Ottawa is having problems with their LRV, Boston with Rotam cars, GP40 rebuilds, and subway cars. The Midwest is having problems with their Amtrak Purchase, California had problems Nippon. I'm sure there are even more issues . So who's the problem with multiple different agencies working with multiple different manufacturers and tons of problems.

Mr. Red Wing, this malaise seems to spread amongst all transportation equipment.

Whenever the UAW strike against the auto industry ends, you can be sure that supply chain disruptions will affect anyone "in the market" (Mr. Johnson, Subarus are darned good autos, but isn't it time?).

Aircraft deliveries to the airlines have had "one thing after another" starting with Boeing and their "quality control issues" at their (non-Union) Charleston plant. The Pratt & Whitney engine issue affecting Airbus aircraft (B-787's appear to belong to "The Generals") is, if anything, "a bit scary".

So no wonder Amtrak and various other agencies have their delivery and QC issues with their vendors.

disclaimer: author Long RTX

And yet, Brightline rolls on without any of this drama....