Amtrak Diner and Food Service Discussion

Gilbert,

I was just on the Coast Starlight last month and at lunch our tablemate paid by credit card as she was a coach passenger. Did I miss something above in the conversation about trying to move to a cash-free system? I don't know if cash was an accepted form of payment or not.

I will add that while had appropriate expectations and enjoyed both my burger and steak my wife did not take my advice ordered some of the other culinary delights. I think they would have been a disappointment to just about anybody even with appropriately low expectations although our table mate did seem to enjoy hers. We were rather surprised, and dismayed, that at both lunch and dinner the kitchen was out of several selections. That just shouldn't happen.

Finally, why isn't a stronger effort made on the website to upsell coach passengers on meal service? Just as airlines will try and sell you checked bags in advance and their bottom lines have grown nicely as a result Amtrak should be doing the same with meal service. All diner equipped trains should encourage pre-purchase of meals by coach passengers along with seating reservations and sleeper passengers should be able to reserve their dining times at the time of reservation. Going through the cars from front to rear taking seating reservations puts passengers in the second and third sleeper at a distinct disadvantage especially when the kitchen is prone to running out of food. Why should I suffer a late (or early) seating and limited menu just because the serving staff chose to go room by room making reservations starting at the front and my compartment was in the second or third car? It would have been so much more pleasant being able to make my reservation on line at the same time I booked my room and then not be disturbed by the attendant taking the reservations at all.

andegold wrote:I was just on the Coast Starlight last month and at lunch our tablemate paid by credit card as she was a coach passenger. Did I miss something above in the conversation about trying to move to a cash-free system? I don't know if cash was an accepted form of payment or not.

Mr.Gold, If cash is no longer accepted on-board, hallelujah; but I don't think that the case.

While I haven't, or ever will have, a debit card, I think the same standard applies as having a bank account. Air travel is no longer a pastime for the rich - passenger or other sponsor - and, now that anything beyond a soda pop is for sale, passengers evidently accept "no plastic, no in-flight purchases" (I'm not even sure if you can still pay with cash for tickets and baggage checking).

Passengers of municipal transit systems accept "no cash"; now there's a demographic that can be below that of an Amtrak Coach LD passenger.

So all told, if Amtrak eliminated on board cash transactions, they would hardly cause the same social upheaval as would such a move forty years ago.

Finally, your ideas regarding prepaid vouchers has merit. Even more to Dinner reservations when booking. For my '16 NB Auto Train journey right after "Snowmagedon", all they offered me was 9PM seating, I had to listen to "people began showing up at 10 and by Noon 7PM was filled". "Good grief", says me. "I was just leaving Miami at 10 to get here".

Gilbert B Norman wrote:This is Diners Mr. Smith.
It doesn't appear Amtrak is moving any closer to a cash-free Diner, I'm sure that my fellow CPA colleagues around here have wondered same; in fact I know several have.
Airlines have eliminated in-flight cash; what's holding up Amtrak?
Revised thoughts, Messrs. Gold, JP, anyone?

I'm thinking that the goal of cashless dining cars (and lounges) is impossible to achieve. I am friends with several individuals that have neither a credit/debit card nor checking account. Part of the reason for their situation is having a criminal record and in one case, the child support payment system that even takes money from Social Security Disability income. They have no choice but to pay cash when they wish to travel anywhere, which is rare, but still happens.

From the 'snobbish' point of view of a sleeping car passenger, take a look at the crowds boarding coach some day. All too often I've seen passengers with cardboard boxes, brown paper shopping bags and even 40 gallon trash bags as luggage. How many of those passengers are likely to have a credit card?

And how can the airlines go cashless? Simple. It would be difficult to find any commercial flights under $100 these days. I just checked the Amtrak website for CHI-STL tickets on July 19...$27 coach, $91 roomette. Travelocity shows cheapest air fare on 7/19 of $101. Credit-card-less travelers can usually come up with $27. $91? Probably not so easily unless they are dope dealers.

Gilbert B Norman wrote:This is Diners Mr. Smith.

It doesn't appear Amtrak is moving any closer to a cash-free Diner, I'm sure that my fellow CPA colleagues around here have wondered same; in fact I know several have.

Airlines have eliminated in-flight cash; what's holding up Amtrak?

Revised thoughts, Messrs. Gold, JP, anyone?

Other than simply not having to deal with accounting for cash, what is the advantage of a cashless diner, cafe, or lounge on Amtrak? Why should this be an objective in the first place?

Although speculation, I would imagine there are greater numbers of person who do not have a credit or regular debit card on the train than those found on the airlines; Amtrak can ill-afford to neglect their business. While absolutely anyone can get a pre-paid debit card at most any retailer or corner convenience store, that doesn't do you any good if you show up at the station with cash only.

It was only a few months back that Amtrak announced that Acela - and only Acela - would indeed switch to credit cards only. They soon backed off that plan and it was never implemented - and the clientele on Acela is generally more likely to have a credit card than many long-distance passengers.

OrangeGrove wrote:Other than simply not having to deal with accounting for cash, what is the advantage of a cashless diner, cafe, or lounge on Amtrak? Why should this be an objective in the first place?

Handling costs, etc. There's usually a processing charge on credit/debit payments of a couple of points; I'm not sure what the annual cost of cash handling is as a percentage of cash sales, but I'd expect it to be fairly high, given that it's a fixed cost that doesn't vary with sales as credit transactions do. I.e. you make 1 cash transaction, you have to do the same cash reconciliation, deposits, tracking, audit, etc. that you would if you had a hundred such transactions.

As for those without debit/credit cards, I think that's more of a preference than a necessity. Most benefit payments these days are deposited onto EBT cards that are licensed under MC/VISA. Any deductions are taken out earlier. In my last job, I would occasionally get furloughed for lack of work; it was mandatory to receive U/I if not direct deposit than onto an EBT card. If someone is receiving SSI-Disability, I'd imagine that's an option. Any garnishment is going to come out before the deposit no matter what.

That said, I like that there's a cash option for payment, and would NOT recommend eliminating it.

Wow Mr. Smith, after you set forth all good and cogent reasons for Amtrak to "get rid of that crap", you contradict your entire argument.

Even folks who "get checks" (I think that's the phrase I've heard on Judge Judy for public assistance) often have them credited to a debit card. In some jurisdictions that IS how they will get their "check".

There is simply no reason Amtrak cannot follow suit with airlines and get that "sinister stuff" away from the "sticky fingers" they have in their employ.

I applaud India for taking strong action for getting rid, or at least minimizing, the amount of that crud infecting their economy.

And finally, even if my score is >800, I neither have, or will have, a debit card. If I get hacked, the "perp" could clean out my bank account - and there I am with nothing - and outstanding checks to make like a "Red rubber ball". If a credit card is hacked and maxed, I still have something, and will deal with the issuer. But life could still go on until the matter is resolved.

I've been saying for at least a year or so that dining cars should have a lot more online ordering.

There is no need to have a whole entourage of Amtrak personnel walking through the sleeping cars, taking dinner reservation times. That is a waste of labor costs.

On American Airlines, I can pre-order my entree online (and I think I get an email about it before my trip). Benefits? Less food waste, less labor cost in taking orders and a happier customer (since I don't have to worry about getting something I don't want).

Amtrak should have that (and it could also add in the option to reserve a specific time for dinner).

Surely the Amtrak app could do that, or Amtrak could team up with Open Table or an existing website to do it.

Amtrak already takes advance online and telephone reservations for special dietary meals. However, accurate delivery to the dining car is not always in the Commissary's job description.

OrangeGrove wrote:Other than simply not having to deal with accounting for cash, what is the advantage of a cashless diner, cafe, or lounge on Amtrak? Why should this be an objective in the first place?

Mr. Grove, from the captioned quote, it would appear that your profession is something other than Accountancy.

Cash is an asset that is readily transportable, easily concealed, and universally desired. Why any commercial enterprise has any more of it around, save an imprest cash box, than absolutely necessary to conduct business simply escapes me.

With all the means that Mr. Smith carefully outlined in his last posting, there is simply no reason that any commercial transportation company cannot conduct any in-transit transactions by means other than cash.

Besides, how can one travel about today without some form of EFT card. You must have such to go to a hotel, rent an auto, and I think purchase an airline ticket.

Once I recall attending a seminar in Vegas, and when it was time to check out, I was in line behind some guy who was settling a many paged folio with cash. While so long as less than $10K unless Form 8300 is filed by the recipient, he was not breaking any law. But here is me behind him wondering "what's he hiding and from who?".

But then, what goes on in Vegas, stays in Vegas.

Gilbert B Norman wrote:This is Diners Mr. Smith.

It doesn't appear Amtrak is moving any closer to a cash-free Diner, I'm sure that my fellow CPA colleagues around here have wondered same; in fact I know several have.

Airlines have eliminated in-flight cash; what's holding up Amtrak?

Revised thoughts, Messrs. Gold, JP, anyone?

Not all airlines, Gilbert. The other day, I rode American Eagle [Envoy Airlines] out of DFW and an announcement was made that the flight was cash only.

I think its has to due with the customer base...Alaska Airlines for example, went to all cashless on board the aircraft for food service in 2009 and it hasn't slowed them down; my understanding was that a good majority of all transactions for food was on plastic. However if you insist on cash, you can get pay cash for a voucher that can be used on board.

Mr. Rockingham, when things go wrong, you punt, and I guess that is what Envoy Airlines did.

I had the opposite experience with Republic. On an ORD-HPN flight (sorry volks, whatever desire I had to "be one of the boys" around here and take the Lake Shore on my semi-annual journeys to visit family has long since "evaporated"), I wanted my glasses of grape juice (at least an hour before Mr. Hertz put me in the driver's seat). The Attendant said her card reader wasn't working. so "they're compliments of the Captain". I offered to give her billing information, but she declined. When she had a few minutes of downtime, I asked her, "we'll I guess United will be without their drink money". "Not quite sir; they give us their worn out card readers, yet WE pay them to cater our flights".

If true, likely the first and last time I ever had an ounce of sympathy for a puddle jumper airline masquerading as a major.

I was surprised to hear the "cash only" announcement. A malfunctioning card reader would certainly explain it. I'll be riding several times over the next few months. It'll be interesting to see what the payment situation will be.

Gilbert B Norman wrote:Mr. Rockingham, when things go wrong, you punt ...

Its been a while, but I know at with Gate Gourmet who handles Delta, the card reader is apart of the food order.

Admin Note:

Let's talk about Amtrak, shall we?