Amtrak Auto Train Discussion

Gotcha, thanks. Yes, the ideal train to try various airline style sleeper lite ideas on.

Backshophoss wrote:A second section could work on the current route for the Auto Train...

And so would, Mr. Backshop, many another route.

While such likely does not appear on paper anywhere, I think a "gentleman's agreement" is in place between Amtrak and the Class I's of "we will get you over the road with the understanding that you will not seek to add new routes or frequencies".

I think that the "passably sane" advocacy groups such as NARP, are "Kubler-Ross Phase V" with such.

Gilbert B Norman wrote:While such likely does not appear on paper anywhere, I think a "gentleman's agreement" is in place between Amtrak and the Class I's of "we will get you over the road with the understanding that you will not seek to add new routes or frequencies".

At least in the case of the Gulf coast service this is not true. Amtrak is also working with the Southern Rail Commission on studies of service that would traverse the Meriden Speedway enroute to Dallas. Both of these routes would be significant new additions. Naturally there will be requirements for track improvements (which may never get funded ...) but the route stagnation of the early 2000s appears to have ended.

Messrs. O'Keefe and Norman, I guess there are exceptions to every rule.

Say CSX was tired of Amtrak messing with its railroad. Could it set up a subsidiary whose sole product was an all-inclusive ticket to fly a person from EWR to ORL and put them up in a hotel, even gave them a rental car, while their auto takes a regularly scheduled auto-rack train south from Oak Island to the TDAI Auto Distribution Yard in Orlando? I know most Auto Train travelers don't care for flying, but if the price was right, its an extra day in Florida and a closer drive for New England, New York, and New Jersey.

mtuandrew wrote:Say CSX was tired of Amtrak messing with its railroad. Could it set up a subsidiary whose sole product was an all-inclusive ticket to fly a person from EWR to ORL and put them up in a hotel, even gave them a rental car, while their auto takes a regularly scheduled auto-rack train south from Oak Island to the TDAI Auto Distribution Yard in Orlando? I know most Auto Train travelers don't care for flying, but if the price was right, its an extra day in Florida and a closer drive for New England, New York, and New Jersey.

It takes about a day to ship the car south to Florida by train. What are you going to do without the family car the day before flying, or the day after flying that distance within hours? Not everyone has two cars?

Additionally, what's the likely chances the freight train companies will be interested into providing such a service to so many small entities? If you aren't going to fill an entire rail car, will they even be interested in doing business with you? The freight railroads have long abandoned customers with partial shipments.

Re: the first, I proposed that a rental car be included until such time as your own car arrives.

Re: the second, I also proposed that it be a subsidiary company essentially acting as a freight forwarder and working with the public, then contracting with CSX for the right number of auto racks. That said, it's less a matter of making money and more a matter of ridding themselves of another Amtrak train, for a modest sum through a throwaway subsidiary.

Why would CSX go through all that trouble?

CHTT1 wrote:Why would CSX go through all that trouble?

It sounded more imperative in my head, but I'm imagining EHH trying to clear Amtrak off his system one train at a time.

I was under the impression that the AutoTrain was the least troublesome of the LD trains for Class 1s, given it's freight-train like speeds and schedule

mtuandrew wrote:

CHTT1 wrote:Why would CSX go through all that trouble?

It sounded more imperative in my head, but I'm imagining EHH trying to clear Amtrak off his system one train at a time.

Although it might be easy to imagine Mr. Harrison that way I doubt it's true. Fighting with Amtrak produces undesirable political problems and attention galore. Not to mention that CSX is one of only two eastern Class I railroads and very visible in Washington DC. I am certainly aware that all of the railroads have the same legal and regulatory standing but CSX runs quite literally under Capitol Hill. That is a completely different proposition than "one of the big railroads from Chicago". CSX also has at least eight Amtrak long distance routes on its system where most of the Western transcontinental railroads have at most two or three. I am going to guess that with the very reasonable Mr. Moorman running Amtrak (who certainly would know Mr. Harrison quite well) that Auto Train should do quite well for years to come.

Believe Mr Moorman fought off EHH a few times during EHH's attempt of a hostile takeover of NS.

At this rate, it might be easier to run out the clock on on Mr. Harrison....

mtuandrew wrote:

CHTT1 wrote:Why would CSX go through all that trouble?

It sounded more imperative in my head, but I'm imagining EHH trying to clear Amtrak off his system one train at a time.

It sounds like a lot of work to kill one train each way. How do they kill the next train? Start an airline that serves endpoints and all points in between? An endpoint only train such as the autotrain may be the easiest to replace for passenger service. But a train with several stops or travels on other rails?

The airlines (companies that make their money and are experts at air passenger service, despite recent headlines) have not managed to kill rail passenger service. Why would a railroad do better?

Also, when you look at a railroad boss that prefers unit trains and does not like loose car services - do you expect them to transfer individual vehicles? And be able to perform the service cheaper than the auto-train (even if the overall goal would be to operate at a loss to kill the auto-train then presumably shut down the service). Sounds expensive.

bdawe wrote:I was under the impression that the AutoTrain was the least troublesome of the LD trains for Class 1s, given it's freight-train like speeds and schedule

I recall reading a report once that if the Auto Train gets to follow the Tropicana Juice train northbound, they both run smooth and easy all the way with no delays or problems!

Tropicana Juice Train was just discontinued. Now combined with a double stack or pig train, I forget which. Decreased OJ sales resulted in shorter trains which didn't justify a
separate train.