Ethan Allen Discussion, including Expansion (Burlington)

It is my understanding that the whole line will be CWR before AMTK service starts. The CWR locations listed are for this year only, the next few years will see additional rail/ties installed, along with bridge and roadbed work. If the state can keep up the 10-ish miles a year rate for CWR, then the 2017 start date is realistic. Once this rail is in, there will be roughly 26 miles of bolted rail left to replace between Rutland and Burlington. The B+R will need 42 miles of CWR, plus significant roadbed and bridge work to get brought up to snuff. That one will be awhile!

We studied the line from Charlotte to Middlebury too back then. As I recall, the
jointed rail portions were actually in decent shape; I recall them being available
for 50-60 mph speeds on most of them.

Well, I got re-assigned to the Burlington switcher today, so I didn't get to travel along the rails and check out the new rail. However, I did talk to the engineer who worked the rail train and he said they dropped rail in the spots indicated on the map, and if fact almost made it to New Haven before it ran out. Here are a couple links to a few quick grabs I got with my cell on my way home.

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPi ... id=3941407
http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPi ... id=3941418

Thanks for the pix! I'm afraid that more than pix, I need maps for these exotic places in deepest Vermont

rovetherr wrote:...I did talk to the engineer who worked the rail train and he said they dropped rail in the spots indicated on the map, and if fact almost made it to New Haven before it ran out...
http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPi ... id=3941407
http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPi ... id=3941418

That's New Haven *Vermont*, right ? ..a town south of Vergennes--about 1/3 of the distance between Vergennes and Middlebury-- and therefore if the CWR stopped short of New Haven VT, it pretty much coincides with the southern end of the new CWR promised by the southernmost "purple" segment on the map (re-linked below).

So can we sum up by saying that they've dropped CWR at *all 3* the purple by now? And that the "grey triangle" on the map, just south of where purple ends and in "skinny red" "jointed rail" territory is a culvert near the US7/VT17/ in the place called New Haven Junction?

Perhaps not directly related to the Ethan Allen extension itself, but when and if the train gets re-routed via N. Bennington it will be interesting to see if either VT or NY decides to 1) keep the *current* Ethan Allen round trip under a new name or 2) re-instate it as a new NYP-Saratoga Springs/Rutland round trip using existing Empire Service runs. When/if the re-route goes online Saratoga Springs and Ft. Edward will lose that round trip that augments the Adirondack -Castleton will in fact lose their only round trip- and I have little doubt those communities will be clamoring for an additional/restored Amtrak service when/if that time comes.

Arlington wrote:Thanks for the pix! I'm afraid that more than pix, I need maps for these exotic places in deepest Vermont

rovetherr wrote:...I did talk to the engineer who worked the rail train and he said they dropped rail in the spots indicated on the map, and if fact almost made it to New Haven before it ran out...
http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPi ... id=3941407
http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPi ... id=3941418

That's New Haven *Vermont*, right ? ..a town south of Vergennes--about 1/3 of the distance between Vergennes and Middlebury-- and therefore if the CWR stopped short of New Haven VT, it pretty much coincides with the southern end of the new CWR promised by the southernmost "purple" segment on the map (re-linked below).

So can we sum up by saying that they've dropped CWR at *all 3* the purple by now? And that the "grey triangle" on the map, just south of where purple ends and in "skinny red" "jointed rail" territory is a culvert near the US7/VT17/ in the place called New Haven Junction?

Yes, all the purple spots got rail. New Haven is about halfway between Vergennes and Middlebury by rail.

Ha, related question, way back when in the 00s, Amtrak proposed replacing the Genesis with a DMU, but Colorado railcar imploded, leaving no maker of US FRA standard DMUs. Now with the GTWs running all over the country, wouldn't a GTW running semi local (Albany to Burlington) be a viable way to replace the potentially lost train traffic, since they can run at 79, and are FRA compliant for running with freight cars?

Since when are GTWs FRA compliant?

Nippon Sharyo on the other hand:
http://urbantoronto.ca/forum/attachment ... 1407702515" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Any service to succeed on either the Vermonter or Ethan Allen route would have to run through to (at least) NYC. Having people change trains, regardless of whether or not its a guaranteed connection, would most likely hurt ridership on such a medium-distance route such as the Vermont service.

Time to bring this one back from the dead! Tie installation has begun on this years segments, starting from MP 77 (Just north of the old Leicester Jct) and heading south. We should be seeing the welded rail train soon, and the rail gang is supposed to be arriving before the end of Sept. If you look at the interactive map from VTrans it has all the work listed for this year. It is for Budget Year 2015, so some of the projects listed are in reality completed, such as the welded rail from New Haven (MP 95.5ish) north, and some of the crossing improvements.

http://rail.vermont.gov/engineering/projects

I still don't think there will be any extension of the existing Rutland trains to Burlington UNTIL they are able to run via North Bennington. I doubt very much if it would be practical to turn a train of passengers on the wye at Rutland and it would cost a lot of time as well. If and when the service runs via North Bennington then it would be very practical and relatively easy to run the train right through to Burlington and this I would love to see happen.
Noel Weaver

I think running through North Bennington would be a HUGE win for a VT train.

Granted, still faster in most cases for folks to simply drive to ALB from Bennington, but I'm sure there are many that would opt for the convenience of a quick ride to North Bennington for a trip.

There is also the issue of turning the train at Burlington. They could turn the locomotive on the VRS turntable there,
but probably would require Amtrak personnel to detach and reattach the numerous cables, etc. They could deadhead
the train to and from Essex Jct. and turn the entire trainset there on the wye, but that would require operating over
NECR trackage from Burlington to/from Essex Jct.

And, of course, they would be running on PAS (or maybe NS by then) between Mechanicville and Hoosick Jct. if they
ran via North Bennington VT.

rovetherr wrote:Time to bring this one back from the dead! Tie installation has begun on this years segments, starting from MP 77 (Just north of the old Leicester Jct) and heading south. We should be seeing the welded rail train soon, and the rail gang is supposed to be arriving before the end of Sept. If you look at the interactive map from VTrans it has all the work listed for this year. It is for Budget Year 2015, so some of the projects listed are in reality completed, such as the welded rail from New Haven (MP 95.5ish) north, and some of the crossing improvements.

http://rail.vermont.gov/engineering/projects

This is a super cool map. Is the idea that "projects" are the yellow icons, the numbers are mileposts, and the colors are owners? Is there a more-detailed key somewhere?

Arlington wrote:This is a super cool map. Is the idea that "projects" are the yellow icons, the numbers are mileposts, and the colors are owners? Is there a more-detailed key somewhere?

I don't think there's a more detailed key anywhere, but white dots are every 10th mile, black are every 5th mile, diamonds are bridges, triangles are culverts, yellow-orange lines are RoW improvement (thicker than the other lines), and crossbucks are obviously grade crossings. The lines are color-coded by operator; but note that not all of the lines shown on the map are operable railroads, as this does include corridors converted to trails (and in this case whoever maintains the trail would be the operator).

But yeah, Vermont's government has one of the best GIS systems in the country; I wish other states would follow suit with similar programs. There's a number of other GIS resources from VTrans here.