Septa's Doomsday Budget 2013-2023

loufah wrote:

Clearfield wrote:What would happen if we based some of the highway tax money on miles driven by each vehicle, verify it at state inspection time and roll it into the registration fee?

Some states are looking into this. Problem is, it overtaxes the PA driver who vacations in Florida a couple times a year, and doesn't tax the non-PA truckers who wear down I-80. Yet another alternative is to install a GPS tracker in each vehicle, but there's a fair amount of resistance to that.

It's a USE TAX. Use the road, pay as you go. Use Public Transit, pay as you go.

What's good for the goose is good for the gander.

Clearfield wrote:It's a USE TAX. Use the road, pay as you go. Use Public Transit, pay as you go.

That's an interesting point, one I meant to ask about in the NPT thread when people were discussing the price of a transfer.

Would it be reasonable, given that SEPTA knows the cost-per-mile of each mode of transportation (and even each route), that a fair fare would be based not on zones travelled or transfers taken but on the total mileage spent on each vehicle, pro-rated? NPT can do this if everything is tag-in tag-out. The RRD does this to some extent (with a high minimum fare), of course. But this could mean that a trip on the NHSL from 69th Street to Haverford would cost $1.75 and a trip to Norristown would cost $5.50, instead of a flat $2.75. And I see plenty of people on the 101 trolley that travel less than a mile. Maybe they should pay 30 cents and people travelling all the way to Media should pay $4.50.

loufah wrote:Would it be reasonable, given that SEPTA knows the cost-per-mile of each mode of transportation (and even each route), that a fair fare would be based not on zones travelled or transfers taken but on the total mileage spent on each vehicle, pro-rated? NPT can do this if everything is tag-in tag-out. The RRD does this to some extent (with a high minimum fare), of course. But this could mean that a trip on the NHSL from 69th Street to Haverford would cost $1.75 and a trip to Norristown would cost $5.50, instead of a flat $2.75. And I see plenty of people on the 101 trolley that travel less than a mile. Maybe they should pay 30 cents and people travelling all the way to Media should pay $4.50.

Definitely interesting, but I wonder what complexities it might introduce for the average rider. A lot of businesses wrestle with the dilemma of "make it simple" versus "prices should reflect true costs"; the direction seems to be towards simplicity even if it doesn't make economic sense. I guess airlines remain at the opposite end of the spectrum, where pricing algorithms take into account all sorts of factors and produce a crazy-quilt of choices that are the bane of many flyers. Given how many pricing anomalies result, not to mention the mini-industry that's sprung up to guide people though that maze, I can't help but wonder if a fully distance-based fare scheme would turn out similarly for SEPTA. Just speculating...

The other end might be the Postal Service, where the same stamp sends a letter from Philly to Media or to Honolulu. Unfortunately SEPTA's been trending that direction with their attempts to flatten fare zones even if it produces inequities like the Phantom Zone 1 or the P&W's surcharge on trips below Bryn Mawr. I have no specific answers, just the thought that there has to be a balance between totally granular and completely flat fares.

sammy2009 wrote:Is this bill signed yet ?.

Per the second 'graph of http://www.delcotimes.com/general-news/ ... ons-on-tap" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; , Corbett will sign the bill on Mon. 11/25.

motor

What does this mean for levittown & bristol station rebuilds?

25Hz wrote:What does this mean for levittown & bristol station rebuilds?

Great question

I would expect the SEPTA operating and Cap budgets to be revised based on the new funding formulas depending on when the finds are made available. That would be the place to look when issued.

Gov. Tom Corbett signs transportation bill in West Norriton
http://www.timesherald.com/general-news ... t-norriton

With more than 100 local officials, union construction and PennDOT workers and media in attendance, Corbett said, “We’re here to celebrate in our effort to keep people safe. After a great deal of debate we have a transit bill that will help people on every work day travel. There are about 1.5 million people who ride a bus, train or bus to work. Every rider on a SEPTA vehicle means one less vehicle on the road.”

He called the bill an “investment” in transportation.

“This is the path to success,” Corbett said. “There isn’t a corner of the state that will not be touched by this bill.”

Corbett thanked the former Pennsylvania governors for their work on transportation issues.

And on that note ... I'm flagging this thread for a mod as closed.

Probally the best place to continue the conversation would be here ...