Pan Am/GTI profits

I was searching the net today and couldn't seem to find a good answer to this: how profitable has GTI been since its inception back in the mid-80s?

I don't have any official figures, but I would expect that Guilford has been doing worse in the past few years after losing the Ford contract in Ayer. From what I recall, that contract generated some 5-10% of Guilford, and B&M's, profit (I do not know if it was 5-10% of GRS' profit or income, it can make a huge difference).

The other thing to note is that GTI includes the Boston-Maine Airways dealio and the Pan Am Clipper Connection, while GRS is the railroad.

Keep in mind GTI is a PRIVATELY owned business,and does NOT have to publish P&L statements like "publically held"(corporate entities)!

I have "heard that union(s) have been trying to get GTI's accurate figures for years.

Since GTI has creative and cunning lawyers,I would think their CPA's would be likewise!

Bud

outinindiana wrote:I was searching the net today and couldn't seem to find a good answer to this: how profitable has GTI been since its inception back in the mid-80s?

GTI was incepted in the early 80's, 1981, I believe, when they bought the Maine Central. Purchase of the B&M in '83 and D&H in '84 followed.
GTI is now Pan Am Systems. They are privately held. The only recent financial information they have revealed is to the federal government concerning the fitness of Boston-Maine Airways to opereate "wide body" aircraft. They stated that the airline had a line of credit with the railroad worth around 7 million dollars. Obvioulsy if the railroad is capable of loaning the airline money they must be financially solvent to some extent.

FWIK, Guilford does earn a profit. Only one has to look to see how
frugal they are. They never buy new motive power, they just
by used locos and fix them up.

If one of you has access to Dunn & Bradstreet, you can pull their report. Even privately held companies have a fair amount of information listed in most cases. If nothing else you can see how they pay accounts and corporate info. Many times though the revenues are listed in the D&B.

What about federal tax paperwork. They can get the president's tax return, why not a corporation's?

Guilford has PLENTY of money. From hauling freight and from Real estate. The Ford yard closing i assure you has not "hurt" the company. People assume the railroad is in dire $$$ straights because they spend very little if any money on infrastructure. You see old engines, run down yards and sad mainline track. But you need to understand it's not lack of money, it's lack of wanting to SPEND the money. BIG difference.

Trains wrote:What about federal tax paperwork. They can get the president's tax return, why not a corporation's?

Private companies have private tax returns. The closest you can get that I know of is D&B.

The loss of the Ford

mick wrote:The loss of the Ford contract absolutely hurt Guilford's bottom line. It did not put them out of buisness, but it was significant. The railroad is given a certain amount for it's budget every year, and they must stay within that budget no matter how much the company makes as a whole. " They are doing the best they can with what they have".

Believe what you want. But i have seen first hand the $$ pulled in vs the $$ spent. I am not even going to get into it.

Guilford is but a small subsidary of their parent company Mellon which is a multi billion dollar entity.

NRGeep wrote:Guilford is but a small subsidary of their parent company Mellon which is a multi billion dollar entity.

Think you're confusing Mellon family heir Tim Mellon with Mellon Financial. While Tim Mellon is a principal at Pan Am, Mellon Financial does not own it. It's no longer clear that the Mellons even have any direct connection with the corporation that bears the family name.

[quote="SKMD01"][quote="mick"]

cpf354 wrote:

NRGeep wrote:Guilford is but a small subsidary of their parent company Mellon which is a multi billion dollar entity.

Think you're confusing Mellon family heir Tim Mellon with Mellon Financial. While Tim Mellon is a principal at Pan Am, Mellon Financial does not own it. It's no longer clear that the Mellons even have any direct connection with the corporation that bears the family name.

Well, then it's still Mellon money that's behind Guilford/"Pan Am."