Non-Amtrak passenger routes after Amtrak creation

I was just reading that the Southern Crescent remained part of the Southern Railroad into the 80s before finally being absorbed by Amtrak. I didn't know there were any major private lines left at that point. Were there any other holdouts on that scale?

Yes, I think the Denver & Rio Grande Western continued running passenger trains into the Amtrak era. I'm guessing they ran what is now Amtrak's California Zephyr route, more or less.

Railroads that did not join Amtrak and opted to continue ruinning intercity trains for their own account;

Southern
Denver & Rio Grande Western
Chicago Rock Island & Pacific

In the case of the SRY and the RI, both roads realized considerable "self help' in eliminating money loosing trains between the Calendar 1969 measuring period and May 1971 A-Day. They simply would not have received same "bang for the buck" that would have a road that was unable to discontinue any appreciable number of trains during the period.

In the case of the D&RGW, not only were they able to reduce the frequency of the Zephyr from Daily to tri-weekly subsequent to the measuring period, they also had adopted a philosophy of "run em short fast and frequent'. They were concerned that Amtrak would impose the existing Daily schedule over their lines and that would interfere with their "short fast & frequent" operating philosophy.

Two "almosts" out there were Santa Fe and Seaboard Coast Line. Both roads were making a "cookie jar' profit on passenger trains, but they realized that when it was time to replace the equipment, that "profit' would be history. The SCL was further concerned that Amtrak could retaliate and break the interchange oftrains at either Wash or even Richmond. Such a break would simply have sent the business 'down the hatch".

Of interest, the Reading Railroad was also invited to join Amtrak as well, given that it was still running its "Wall St/Crusader" RDC service from Reading Terminal in Philadelphia and Newark's Pennsylvania Station (diverted after April 30, 1967 from Jersey Central's Jersey City Terminal).

The Reading being in a precarious financial situation (it declared bankruptcy in 1971) did not opt to join.

Forgot the RDG, Mr. CNJ.

Now lets turn the table and discuss railroads that DID join Amtrak, but were not "awarded' a contract to run an Amtrak train.

Boston & Maine
Chicago & North Western
Union Pacific (well, almost)
Central of Georgia

Roads such as the Katy, KCS, and Frisco were all out prior to A-Day, and did not have any reason to join. However, there was one road that was OUT prior to A-Day that DID join. That was the SP subsidiary, Northwestern Pacific. NWP was out prior to the 1969 measuring period, so their entry fee (i.e. 200% of 1969 out of pocket or 100% of ICC fully allocated loss) was $0. They paid $1 and were IN.

Since they were an intrastate carrier, they were concerned that a California regulatory agency could impose a train upon them. In the RPSA 70 was a provision stating that Federal law would "trump" State law in any such manner.

At one time, I actually saw a Xerox of the voucher NWP sent to Amtrak.

Memo to GBN, I think the posting about the Reading was correct, they
ran trains that were not at the time considered commuter although that
was basically what they were. Similiar to the situation with the Harlem
Division of the Penn Central (at that time) between Dover Plains and
Chatham.
I think the south Shore was another one that could have but did not, the
service to South Bend was in question but was eventually subsidized.
The Georgia Railroad was another one but by then, all that they were
actually running were mixed trains that barley could be considered
passenger trains, I rode it in the summer of 1976 and it was a rough ride
to put it nicely.
The Boston and Maine and the Central Vermont were also odd cases, I do
not think that they originally had to or did join Amtrak but they both ended
up with Amtrak trains starting in 1972.
Noel Weaver

At the time of Amtrak's creation, the Central Vermont was freight-only and the Boston & Maine operated only subsidized commuter service, nothing of an intercity nature. I believe that when the "Montrealer" started up in the fall of 1972, Amtrak entered into a separate purchase-of-service contract with both railroads to cover its operation. This became an issue as regards the B&M about 15 years later when the Guilford management reduced speed limits on the Connecticut River Line, which in turn led to litigation.

the georgia railroad also ran a passenger train until 1983 or 1984

it was a once a day mixed train which was really just one coach on the back of a freight

but still...

On the head, Nip, please

crazy_nip wrote:the georgia railroad also ran a passenger train until 1983 or 1984

it was a once a day mixed train which was really just one coach on the back of a freight

but still...

The incredible thing about this train was that it was actually listed in the
Amtrak system timetable for a while. When I rode it in 1976, we had a
Budd built coach at the end of from 145 to 212 freight cars. I still can't
believe that any railroad would handle passengers in that manner. It was
hotter than h--l that day and the crew took pity on myself and the one
other passenger and ushered us into their caboose, at least we were a
little more comfortable there.
As stated above, it was mercifully put to rest in the early 1980's.
It seems to me that the fare was $5.92 for the trip one way and one way
was enough.
Noel Weaver

The reason the COG ran the Freight was because of major tax breaks. Question with Mr. Norman's 1st post why did he say UP almost got one but didn't.

The Georgia Railroad ran the mixed train because its state charter, dating from the 1830s or so, required it to run passenger trains. This charter also gave it either a tax break or a total tax exemption. Anybody know how they managed to get out of this obligation in later years?

NS bought them out.

AmtrakFan wrote:NS bought them out.

The NS didn't buy them out, CSX got control and bought them out.
For some years before the end the train really did not provide any kind of
useful passenger service. It departed when it was made up which was
usually much later than shown in any timetable, ran from a freight yard to
another freight yard and I remember after arrival in Atlanta, walked to
the yard entrance and the hotel where I was staying wasn't far away.
Another thing that I recall was that the crew was very friendly and
pleasant on this horrible train.
Noel Weaver

Gilbert B Norman wrote:Forgot the RDG, Mr. CNJ.

Now lets turn the table and discuss railroads that DID join Amtrak, but were not "awarded' a contract to run an Amtrak train.

Boston & Maine
Chicago & North Western
Union Pacific (well, almost)
Central of Georgia

The Grand Trunk Western also joined Amtrak as they were operating a Chicago-Detroit and Chicago-Port Huron-Toronto service at the time. But the Chicago-Detroit service went to PC and the Toronto service was discontinued

In fact GTW was one of the four or five railroads that held Stock in Amtrak as part of their payment terms in joining. And with GTW being part of Canadian National (owned by the Canadian Government at the time) made the Government of Canada a Amtrak shareholder.

GTW/CN did eventually operate trains for Amtrak.