• New Hudson Tunnel article (NorthJersey.com)

  • Discussion related to New Jersey Transit rail and light rail operations.
Discussion related to New Jersey Transit rail and light rail operations.

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  by railtrailbiker
 
New Hudson tunnel is linchpin of $6B in rail improvements

Sunday, January 9, 2005

By D
ANIEL SFORZA
STAFF WRITER

A $6 billion plan that would give North Jersey rail commuters a one-train ride to Manhattan has gained support on both sides of the Hudson River and could be completed within 10 years.

The plan hinges on building a new train tunnel under the river that would be fed by a sprawling network of new rail lines in Bergen, Passaic, Hudson and Essex counties. The tunnel is estimated to cost $5 billion, with the additional projects costing $1 billion or more.

Funding would come from the federal government and the Port Authority of New York and New Jersey. The bi-state agency could commit up to $2 billion, Chairman Anthony Coscia said.

"This represents a comprehensive transportation solution that is completely consistent with what we see as our mission," Coscia said. "It's a lot, but for 40 or 50 years we've chosen the status quo. Our job is supposed to be to move people and goods throughout the region."

The Port Authority has already funded a $10 million engineering study that will examine how to expand the platforms at Penn Station to handle longer trains.

Federal money will also be a key to getting the project done.

"We just have to provide access to Manhattan for public safety reasons," said Rep. Bill Pascrell, D-Paterson. "You could shut down the whole process of moving in case, God forbid, there is an attack in New York."

Pascrell said funding would be spread out over the length of construction, and that makes it likely the project will go through. In essence, lawmakers would be approving chunks at a time, not the whole $5 billion nut.

No dollar amount has been set in the next federal transportation budget, which is still under debate.

"We need this tunnel as soon as possible," he said.

Old tunnel at capacity

Aside from terrorism concerns, a new tunnel is needed simply because the 100-year-old tunnel that brings commuter trains between the states is at capacity.

In 1994, 88 trains each day made the trip to Manhattan from New Jersey during the morning rush hours. That jumped to 124 in 1999. And to 186 in 2004.

"The rate of growth has been significant over the past decade," NJ Transit Executive Director George Warrington said. "If you look at where demand is going, where jobs are going to be created, it's clearly midtown Manhattan. It's clear that the way to allow that growth to continue is through rail."

NJ Transit estimates that once the tunnel is built, it would create 16,000 jobs and $3 billion worth of personal income. Ten years after completion, projections show that $100 million each year in additional taxes would be paid as a result of the economic growth created by the tunnel.

"We really have two choices," Coscia said. "We decide we are going to deemphasize the region ... or, alternatively, we find ways to expand the system. The tunnel project is really the only viable solution we have."

Jeffrey Zupan, senior fellow with the Regional Plan Association, said the project could change the entire region for the better.

"The fact that New Jersey is right across the river and has had a barrier all these years from Manhattan will be much less so," he said. "The ... project has an opportunity to transform the state and particularly the relationship with New York, which will not be as distant."

The project would be done in stages, with the earliest already under way.

The draft environmental impact statement is expected to be completed this summer, when preliminary engineering would begin. A final environmental impact statement is due by mid-2006, with construction starting later that year. The project could be finished by 2014.

A feat of engineering

The tunnel would be bored through the earth using a gigantic drilling machine that can produce a tube with a diameter as large as 40 feet.

It would begin just west of Tonnelle Avenue in North Bergen and continue under Union City and Weehawken before reaching the Hudson River silt.

The tunnel would rise out of the silt at a grade of 1.9 percent and curve north to Penn Station. The tracks would continue beyond Penn to a new station at 34th Street.

The location does not interfere with Penn Station, but rather complements it, Warrington said. And tracks would extend underground beyond the new station, providing storage for trains during the day.

The retail possibilities were also viewed as a plus.

"There is a lot of interest in working with us," Warrington said of real estate developers and retailers such as Federated Department Stores, which owns Macy's. "They are very excited about the possibilities."

The 34th Street station was key to getting leaders on both sides of the river to agree to the plan.

"The Port Authority, NJ Transit and the Metropolitan Transportation Authority are in real fundamental agreement," Coscia said. "The priorities are completely interconnected. We've gotten over the notion that each of us, independent of the other two, can be successful."

Warrington said it was important that New Jersey take into account the needs of New York. For instance, he said, an earlier proposal called for using a rail yard on the west side of Manhattan, where a Jets football stadium could be built, for train storage.

"I came to the conclusion that that is a battle we do not need," Warrington said. "I took it off the table."

Instead, the yard will be in New Jersey.

Warrington said there wasn't just one turning point, however.

"I think it's been an evolution," he said. "Historically, there's not an appreciation for the role New Jersey plays in the New York economy. I think we've been successful in educating New York that we do play an important role."

Working in N.Y.C.

There are some 250,000 New Jersey residents who work in Manhattan, and that number is expected to grow by 200,000 over the next 20 years, Warrington said.

Many of those workers will be coming from North Jersey, so a comprehensive system of rail links is needed to feed the tunnel.

Warrington wants to take the $1 billion needed to bring the Hudson-Bergen Light Rail from Ridgefield to Tenafly and redistribute it to other projects. The light rail would still be built - and even extend out to Hawthorne in Passaic County - but at a much reduced cost.

To get the plan rolling, the Bergen County portion of the system - essentially an electric trolley - would be replaced with a self-powered diesel train.

The "diesel multiple unit," or DMU, would run from Ridgefield to Tenafly on Bergen's Northern Branch, a freight line. It would also stretch from Hackensack to Hawthorne on a freight line operated by the New York, Susquehanna & Western Railway.

The DMU is a new type of train that does not need to be pulled by a locomotive. Instead, small diesel engines mounted near the wheels power the passenger car, which can pull two additional cars.

This line to Tenafly could be built for $500 million and finished by 2010, Warrington said. The Passaic County link would cost $75 million to $100 million and could also be completed by 2010.

Those riding these new rails could reach the proposed Xanadu retail and entertainment complex in the Meadowlands through a transfer at a Tonnelle Avenue station in North Bergen, which is expected to open later this year. From there, riders could also continue directly to Manhattan or transfer onto the light rail to head south through Bayonne.

Warrington said creating all these connections is critical to the vitality of the region.

"If we don't do it, we will have an increasing paralysis of the transportation network," Warrington said. "What happens over time, almost invisibly, is economic growth slows. You wake up one day and find all the economic indicators are moving in the wrong direction."


E-mail: [email protected]
(From NorthJersey.com)

  by Irish Chieftain
 
Suddenly everyone can get their hands on a whopping $6 billion to get this project underway, when all agencies involved (Amtrak, NJT, MTA) are scrambling for funds? Yeah, sure. Warrington's "Big Dig"? He won't be at NJT's helm ten years down the road, never mind two...

The article is selling this in the light of all trains on all NJT lines from North Jersey being able to get a one-seat ride into Manhattan—deceptive. Also, mentioning DMUs is redundant, since they will never be allowed into NYP unless they are of the more expensive dual-mode variety, or if they are designed to MU with the Arrows (which IIRC would take a more extensive Arrow III rebuild or new Arrows altogether).

  by JayMan
 
If the design a new EMU (Arrow IV) and MU it with a DMU, provided each car has enough HP to drag the weight of the other type in the other's territory I suppose it could work. But, as in the NYU report I posted this is just what is necessary. But, where are is the $$$ going to come from? If they can figure out a way to spread out the project, and the cost, I suppose they can swing it. But then, that's just how the SAS is structured and that's going nowhere, fast...

  by Lackawanna484
 
This is innovative, out of the box thinking, with some nice aspects.

I like the idea of not having the station in Penn Station, but somewhere around 42nd street would be much better for commuters. Even at 34th street, the new tunnel and station would have to be under the 8th avenue, and 7th avenue subway tunnels, as well as LIRR, etc.

I like the idea of a new set of tunnels not parallel to the current set. But, how do you get the Bergen-Passaic people into it, without bypassing the multi-hundred million dollar palace they just opened at SEC?

Also, do I understand GW is OK with giving LIRR access to the current tunnels so they can put a new West Side Yard in NJ?

Of course, this should be on the fantasy thread...

  by Nasadowsk
 
I don't understand why any new tunnels wouyld have to go to Penn. IMHO, a sepperate NJT terminal in NYC might not be a bad idea - a great 'relief valve' for when amtrak screws up Penn. I'd say put it around 14th, or up by 42. 42 has the subway access going for it, 14th is a few stops closer to downtown. *shrug*

  by Guest
 
Equipment would be triplex, dual-mode MUs. i.e., three cars with one having a pantograph and associated equipment, one having a diesel engine, and one trailer.

The stupid part, of course, is having to make a 5 minute trip around a loop and pass through Secaucus Transfer twice. Why can't they just make the new tunnels like this - http://mysite.verizon.net/scheurle/tunnels.gif

  by JoeG
 
If they are not going to have the new tunnel go to NYP, why not have it go to 42 st instead of 34?
Also, I see they are now saying it might be done by 2014. That means what, 2020 in reality? I also cant see the "one seat ride" stuff. DMUs wont be able to go through the tunnel. They wont get more EMUs. Is this a really thought-out plan, or just another trial balloon? And finally, where is the money to come from?

If they are going to use a giant boring machine to drill a tunnel, why not make it a 4 track tunnel like the 63 st Manhattan-Queens one, to allow for expansion, so we won't have to wait another century for a new one? With the price of gas likely to skyrocket, I have to think trains will become more popular in the decades to come.

I only hope I live to see the tunnel finished.

  by JayMan
 
Bob Scheurle wrote:Equipment would be triplex, dual-mode MUs. i.e., three cars with one having a pantograph and associated equipment, one having a diesel engine, and one trailer.

The stupid part, of course, is having to make a 5 minute trip around a loop and pass through Secaucus Transfer twice. Why can't they just make the new tunnels like this - http://mysite.verizon.net/scheurle/tunnels.gif
I agree with you. And hey, where did you get that map you drew on?

  by Nasadowsk
 
<i>With the price of gas likely to skyrocket, I have to think trains will become more popular in the decades to come. </i>

Forget the price of gas. There is simply nowhere to put additional cars in NYC, and more people are comming. Lower Manhattan WILL rebound, eventually the economy will get going. It's amazing right now you see any open air parking in Manhattan - the real estate is just too valuable to waste like that.

EMU/DMU triples? Stop thinking dual mode and start thinking like a Flexiliner - the ability to MU EMUs and DMUs together. This adds a LOT of new ideas in terms of service. Imagine a Long Branch train where the first 6 cars are DMU, the last 6 are EMU. At Newark, or wherever, the train makes a normal stop, but the first 6 cars pull away immediatelty and run express to the end of electric territory, leaving the EMU as a local.

Dual mode sucks. It's a stupid idea on the very face of it. It always was. The ability to MU EMUs and DMUs is a LOT better, easier, and more achiveable. It's already been done overseas.

DMUs make sense for new lines - for existing lines, I think you're going to see more electrification - the advantages overall are worth it.

MU operation? NJT should pretty much be all MU now. Nobody in their right mind operates locomotive hauled trains in the kinds of service NJT runs. It's just plain stupid and pointless. Low HP diesels are good for moving boxcars accross the US at 30mph. High HP electrics are good for going 125mph for 1/2 an hour to the next city. MUs are great for that start and stop life that is a regional RR.

  by ryanov
 
If they spend my money on that loop, I'm moving out of the country. That has to be the most asinine idea to ever come across the boards. Why? So some lazy people don't have to walk up the escalator at SJ? Jesus christ.

  by JayMan
 
Nasadowsk wrote:<i>With the price of gas likely to skyrocket, I have to think trains will become more popular in the decades to come. </i>

Forget the price of gas. There is simply nowhere to put additional cars in NYC, and more people are comming.
Exactly. In a mega-city like NYC, heavy rail transit is a necessity – and as the number of people moving around grows, so must rail capacity.
EMU/DMU triples? Stop thinking dual mode and start thinking like a Flexiliner - the ability to MU EMUs and DMUs together. This adds a LOT of new ideas in terms of service. Imagine a Long Branch train where the first 6 cars are DMU, the last 6 are EMU. At Newark, or wherever, the train makes a normal stop, but the first 6 cars pull away immediatelty and run express to the end of electric territory, leaving the EMU as a local.
Wow! Amazingly creative concept. Only thing is that passengers boarding the train need to understand that if you're heading for the ends of the line, board in the first set of cars – heading for the local stops, board in the last half of cars. Would it work with the transit savvy of the average commuter, though? And of course, the EMU cars need to have horsepower to haul the train in the tunnels.
MU operation? NJT should pretty much be all MU now. Nobody in their right mind operates locomotive hauled trains in the kinds of service NJT runs. It's just plain stupid and pointless. Low HP diesels are good for moving boxcars accross the US at 30mph. High HP electrics are good for going 125mph for 1/2 an hour to the next city. MUs are great for that start and stop life that is a regional RR.
I agree – I don't see why NJT insisted on push-pull, but...

  by JoeG
 
NJT doesn't have it in 'em to be as innovative as Bob Scheurle or Nasadowski are suggesting. They can't even order regular cars where the doors work and the seat check holders dont rip. If they did order innovative stuff it would end up sitting at the MMC most of the time because it would be beyond the staff there to maintain it.

  by Jtgshu
 
JoeG nailed that one on the head!!! haahhaha

Maybe the new tunnels will all diesel operation, who knows....a new station and tunnels with proper ventilation, maybe NYC will allow an exemption to the "only electric rule" in NYC.

Im still not understanding the whole new terminal nonsense.....

I thought there was an article a few months ago stating that NJT was going to be the major tennant in the Moynahan station when that is built, and that they were going to figure out a way to expand Penn station, and integrate the new tunnels and platforms into the new and current station.

I think people would have a better idea of figuring out "first four cars only" than going to the right terminal to catch a train.

"Long branch trains are in Penn station, Dover trains are at the XXXXXX station, all subject to change, of course." And people complain about track changes in NYP, imagine whole terminal changes......NJT is not and cannot going to completely abandon NYP, not with all the LIRR and Amtrak and Subway connections available there

And this whole loop thing at SEC is a complete waste as well......not to mention making the entire station useless, but as Bob I believe it was said, it will take a lot of time, IMO about 5 minutes at least, to go down off the high line, loop down to the current lower boonton Line, then curve back to teh Main and Bergen line (thats how I understand it will be)

I like the out of the box thinking, and the potential for new lines and services, but the whole seperate station adn loop thing just seems to me like a collosal waste of money.....

  by Lackawanna484
 
Wasn't one of the concerns with EMU units that each power car had to be inspected as an engine, and the whole train pulled off line regularly? I thought that was the reason that NJT went the opposite route, buying cars which could be hauled by diesel or straight electric locomotives.

  by Jtgshu
 
Oh yea, one thing I forgot to mention last night in my post.....how did all these Bergen Co. area projects get leapfrogged to the front of the line?????? Does anyone believe that all these additional light rail and DMU lines can be built at the same price that the original line to Tenefly alone would have cost??? I have my doubts.....

I know that the Cross County route and the NYSW have been discussed before, but what about MOM and the Cut-off and West Trenton???

In the article posted by mcmannors only what 2 days ago, NJT has placed the cutoff behind the tunnel project.....

And it looks as if NJT, at least by reading all these Asbury Park Press articles, is trying to kill MOM by not recommending a definate route for the project and therefore jeopardizing funding for the project.

I would love to see all the lines built mentioned by Warrington, but NJT CANNOT just push all the other projects aside, just for these. Look at the Meadowlands Raillink - that came out of the middle of nowhere......all because the PA gave money.

MOM and West Trenton and the Cut-off too (in a way) would help and expand EXISTING capacity by diverting people to the new trains. People who live in the Monmouth/Ocean county areas wouldn't have to drive to Matawan or Metropark and could take teh MOM trains, going into Hoboken, and free up a little capacity on NEC especially and NJCL trains. Forget about tunnel capacity, you simply cannot get another person on some of the NEC trains at Metropark. There needs to be train capacity problems addressed, and particularly MOM and West Trenton line trains would address that. People would get dropped off at Newark, could catch Path or NJT into NYP. If NJT to NYP gets too rediculoulsly crowded, they can opt for the Path or go to Hoboken for the ferries (if they are still there, which im sure they will be)

I hope im the only one looking at things this way, but I just really hope NJT hasn't forsaken other very necessary, and long in the pipeline projects, for the THE tunnel project.