MBTA's MPI HSP-46 Locomotives

Gerry6309 wrote:They seem to like teaming them with screamers for break-in. Since the screamers have older prime movers which run at higher revs, it is no wonder the headlights and cowls get sooted up. Obviously a simple solution is to run them back to back instead of nose to tail. They can be wyed at North Station or looped at South Station.

The headlights are clean when they go into service on their own. This is soot from the HSP's own engine.

jmar896 wrote:HSP46 #2001 was at the Worcester layover yard yesterday (4/25/15) with a 8 car bi-level set

Everyone:

How about relocating the HSP46 headlight to where either the T front end logo is or right in between the number boards?

This problem of push mode diesel exhaust soot fouling the window protecting the headlight looks like something that can be solved easily
and I do agree if a wiper is needed to keep the headlight area clean so be it...

MACTRAXX

A wiper isn't going to be very effective on soot unless it also includes a washer fluid nozzle. That's an awful lot of effort, expense, and ongoing maintenance, compared to either relocating the headlight or finding some way to shield it from the exhaust.

It's easy to see that they never should have put it there in the first place, but what's done is done. And for all we know the T might have asked for it to be up there, just like they asked for most of the other things that make these units unique.

If they looked closely at the MP36s, they'd see that this would be a problem.

(My photo, taken in 2011)

Yes, it was absolutely predictable.

*DOH!!!! *

MEC407 wrote:A wiper isn't going to be very effective on soot unless it also includes a washer fluid nozzle. That's an awful lot of effort, expense, and ongoing maintenance, compared to either relocating the headlight or finding some way to shield it from the exhaust.

It's easy to see that they never should have put it there in the first place, but what's done is done. And for all we know the T might have asked for it to be up there, just like they asked for most of the other things that make these units unique.

MEC:

What about designing a smoke deflector that can be installed above the headlight to deflect exhaust upward as
the engine pushes away to try and solve this problem?

Another thought is to design the exhaust port to go a couple of inches over and above the locomotive body
to try and further deflect push mode exhaust upwards - the question I have is this not possible because of
clearance issues ? (overhead wires, etc.)

This may be the easiest way to go instead of relocating the HSP46 headlight...

MACTRAXX

I think a visor would work best. Getting diesel soot off with a wiper can be hard because once its on something its pretty hard to get off, even with washer fluid. Finding a place to mount a wiper motor and fluid tank could be hard depending on whats in that area of the locomotive, and it would also be expensive to install. A visor would be a weld on part, and wouldn't cost a significant amount. A deflector could be next best from a visor, but I don't think it would be as good as a visor.

Relocating the headlight would seem impractical to me. It would cost a lot and again you could run into issues with whats behind it

Clarification: Is the soot from push-mode of the HSP-46, or from one of the other "legacy" locomotives? Tier III shouldn't be generating lots of soot, should it?

MACTRAXX wrote:MEC:

What about designing a smoke deflector that can be installed above the headlight to deflect exhaust upward as
the engine pushes away to try and solve this problem?

That was exactly what I suggested on the previous page of this thread. Or a visor, more specifically, but basically the same concept. Keeping it simple is always a good thing.

BandA wrote:Tier III shouldn't be generating lots of soot, should it?

The levels for smoke and particulate matter are the same for Tier 3 as they are for Tier 2. As we've seen with the MP36 series, Tier 2 units are still "allowed" to produce enough soot to make a locomotive pretty filthy. So I guess the same would be true for Tier 3 locos.

BandA wrote:Clarification: Is the soot from push-mode of the HSP-46, or from one of the other "legacy" locomotives? Tier III shouldn't be generating lots of soot, should it?

It's from the HSP46 itself. These units don't spend any significant time behind other engines.

For MPI designs,the soot trail at the nose is shared by all models with a MP 36 style nose.

with no operational wash in winter it shows, but I am sure things will improve once water and soap are introduced.

Wouldn't just taking the window off and installing a sun shade/hood on top of the light assembly improve this? The regular lower headlight mounts on these things just have the bulbs exposed, like pretty much all low-mount loco headlights. It's not like there's quantifiable risk of debris strikes breaking bulbs mounted that high up if they don't see the need on the regular headlights and markers. Or is it part of the ditch light regs that they have to have an extra layer of protection?


And RE: the design...is it just a natural drawback of any aerodynamic nose that the soot is going to pile up more on the top than on a flatter-nose cowl like an F40? Or is it just a default drawback of the high-mount/max-visibility lights that they get gunked up faster than the mid-mount ones? There aren't a lot of ready comparisons since the older aerodynamic-nose diesels like the Genesis and F59PHI all have theirs mounted immediately below the windows, and the ACS-64's high-mount lights are on an electric that obviously isn't producing the soot.