Fare Structure for 101 & 102

Can someone explain to me how the fares work on the 101 and 102 trolleys? When I was at 69th Street Terminal the other day, I saw them sitting in the bays with both doors open and people were getting on without paying a fare.

Do you pay when you get off like the 100? And, what does a round trip end to end cost?

As far as I can tell, you pay at your furthest point out. So you pay when you get off headed away from 69th, pay when you get on heading in to 69th. This is the same as the Rt. 100, but I've ridden many, many more times out of 69th than in, so my 69th-bound experiences may not be representative.

It's the same as the 100 and the bus routes that run out there. PAYL outbound, PAYE inbound.

This is simply a continuation of the old Red Arrow practice---- Fares were paid upon boarding inbound ( toward 69th Street) and upon leaving outbound. This applied to both buses and trolleys. Originally, P&W sold "excursion" tickets ( In remember buying a round trip ticket to and from Norristown) but at some point during Red Arrow days, it too adopted the general Red Arrow practice.

First my Standard Rant about fare payment on any SEPTA transit division vehicle: Rules 1 through 10 are NEVER PAY THE $2 CASH FARE. You can buy tokens for $1.30 in quantities of 2 or more. A token is good for the same base fare as the 2 bucks but you save over one-third. In fact, I've heard SEPTA employees refer to the $2 fare as the "sucker fare" because it's mostly paid by tourists and newbies.

If you need a transfer, that has to be paid in cash (60c) but just plop that plus your token in the farebox. Don't get confused by the stories circulating among some operators and riders that you have to pay the $2 fare if you're also buying a transfer. It's just a way to try to get people to overpay.

Depending on how often and where you ride, you may be able to make a City Transpass work for you. The price is about equal to a month of base fares plus one transfer, so if you ride the El and one of the 10X rail lines it might be cost-effective. Another scam - if you go beyond Zone 1, SEPTA's usual advice is to purchase a RRD Trailpass. Problem is, their prices are keyed to the higher RRD fares and you have to ride transit about 34 days a month to break even. Just get the Transpass and pay the extra 50c for each zone after the first one. Also, a Transpass is good everywhere on the whole system on weekends without any zone charges.

The only downside to a pass is that it's a flat cost. There's no refund if you don't use it enough to break even vs. tokens, so do the math up front.

There's another advantage to using a Transpass for anyone who connects to the El and makes a suburban transfer beyond Zone 1.

If you use tokens, the continuation of the Red Arrow PAYE / PAYL practice is a cause of endless inconvenience for regular commuters and confusion for anyone riding for the first time. Inbound, you can combine the zone charge with the base fare and transfer. For ex., on the P&W from Radnor, you just pay a token plus $1.10 (50c zone fare + 60c transfer). But going outbound, the fact that the City Division is always PAYE means you pay the token and transfer when you board, but give the P&W operator the zone fare when you leave.

It means a lot more coins to carry and for SEPTA to count. I've even seen cases wheresome irregular riders become sufficiently flummoxed that they end up paying two separate fares.

queenlnr8 wrote:Can someone explain to me how the fares work on the 101 and 102 trolleys? When I was at 69th Street Terminal the other day, I saw them sitting in the bays with both doors open and people were getting on without paying a fare.

Do you pay when you get off like the 100? And, what does a round trip end to end cost?

Yes. All Red Arrow bus and rail lines that originate at 69 St are pay as you leave heading outbound and pay as you enter heading inbound.

The 101 is a two-zone ride: the zones are between 69 St and Springfield Mall and between Drexel Hill Jct/Shadeland Av and Orange St/Media (an overlap zone exists between Drexel Hill Jct and Springfield Mall).

The 102 is a one-zone ride the entire length between 69 St and Sharon Hill.

Base fare is $2.00, zone charges are 50 cents.

ctrabs74 wrote:Base fare is $2.00, zone charges are 50 cents.

Hi Creighton, please remember to emphasize that the $2 fare should be paid ONLY when you have no alternative.

TOKENS ARE ALWAYS ~35% CHEAPER.

Thank you both for the clear answer about how the fares work.

I rode the 100 out of 69th street once, at night, when I was new to the city and I didn't have enough for the entire fare at Norristown. the guy was nice and let me off, but it could have been trouble for me.

:D

Haha, I mean, would he possibly have locked you in the vehicle and not let you out? That's what I never got about the PAYL system. In order to avoid fare evaders, it would make sense to pay before you get the service.

SubwaySurface wrote:Haha, I mean, would he possibly have locked you in the vehicle and not let you out? That's what I never got about the PAYL system. In order to avoid fare evaders, it would make sense to pay before you get the service.

In the city, perhaps. It's worked fairly well out at Red Arrow, since all passengers heading outbound (away from 69 St) have to exit via the front doors. It's also worked fairly well on the buses in Downtown Pittsburgh (where passengers on buses and light rail PAYL heading away from Downtown), but their route system is completely different from Center City and most of the rest of the SEPTA system.

[quote="ctrabs74 It's worked fairly well out at Red Arrow, since all passengers heading outbound (away from 69 St) have to exit via the front doors.[/quote]

I was on a very crowded Bullet Car that stopped at Radnor outbound in the morning. There was such a long line waiting to pay upon exiting that a kid going to Archbishop Carroll (before Amtrak put up the fence along the Main Line) climbed out a platform-side window near the rear of the car.

He had his fare in his hand, but must have been late for school and couldn't afford the time.

http://community.webshots.com/photo/285 ... YmKmjHYgIY

chuchubob wrote:I was on a very crowded Bullet Car that stopped at Radnor outbound in the morning. There was such a long line waiting to pay upon exiting that a kid going to Archbishop Carroll (before Amtrak put up the fence along the Main Line) climbed out a platform-side window near the rear of the car.

He had his fare in his hand, but must have been late for school and couldn't afford the time.

I saw kids from Carroll hopping out of Bullets' windows on many occasions. Judging by the comments I overheard as they bailed out, the practice was apparently considered a "cool" means of fare-beating. There wasn't a lot the drivers could do to stop it, although once or twice a police officer came out of hiding to nab some of the kids.

I know it's my adult perspective, but it seemed pretty dumb to risk hitting the third rail just to prove you could cheat SEPTA out of the quarter or whatever the zone charge was back then.

The kid that I saw jumped onto the platform.