CTA: I JUST CAN NOT GET USED TO THE COLOR NAMES

MikeF wrote: The way you describe the CTA's strategy, it sounds as if you think it is a private, profitable corporation. It's important to keep in mind that the CTA is a public agency and is in business to serve the people of Chicago, not to make money. A large portion of those people are the "cattle" to whom you refer, so whatever measures are necessary must be taken to make the system accessible to them.

Mike, thanks for the response. I think we agree on the necessity of the CTA's measures, and the basic motivation behind it. And I do understand their role as public agency. My point is that the question is not one of profitability (although in a private corporation, that's how it would manifest) but one of Survivability. They're simply coping with the selection pressures currently present, to put a Darwinian spin on it. If the subject of my "rant" seemed a little ambiguous, it's because the problem itself isn't black and white.

Also want to point out, I really don't intend my use of the word "cattle" pejoratively, I just wanted to paint a picture. I ride the L myself.

Color coding lines conveys more information more quickly than wording, and improves speed of access to all, as well as reducing the comprehension barrier to less frequent or first time riders. This is widely used by tranist systems across the world (including the NYCTA, while they use numbers, the lines are also color coded for quick recognition).

To connect this to some sort of 'dumbing down' of society is a non starter in my book.

Colors also have a much higher retention rate for non familiar riders. For example, a visitor will remember 'Red line" while the name 'Howard/95th-Dan Ryan", being unfamiliar, will quickly be forgotten, or transform into something else entirely.

Color coding conveys no information unless one knows what the color stands for.

metrarider wrote:Color coding lines conveys more information more quickly than wording, and improves speed of access to all, as well as reducing the comprehension barrier to less frequent or first time riders.).

Colors also have a much higher retention rate for non familiar riders. For example, a visitor will remember 'Red line" while the name 'Howard/95th-Dan Ryan", being unfamiliar, will quickly be forgotten, or transform into something else entirely.

Using colors are better because for vistors, or new residents could remember.

F40CFan wrote:Color coding conveys no information unless one knows what the color stands for.

I understand what you are saying but, not many people are going to say take the congress line to jackson and transfer to the howard/dan ryan line to howard. They rather here it like this blue lint to jackson, transfer to the red line to howard.

Colors for the Chicago subway lines are easy to remember by color, not really by the name of the line.

Colors for the Chicago subway lines are easy to remember by color, not really by the name of the line.

I understand what you are saying, but as I said previously, it takes away from the uniqueness of the system.

Also, we have a green line that is a west/south elevated route, another city has a green line that is a trolley subway, etc. I would think that visitors would find that confusing.

F40CFan wrote:

Colors for the Chicago subway lines are easy to remember by color, not really by the name of the line.

I understand what you are saying, but as I said previously, it takes away from the uniqueness of the system.

Also, we have a green line that is a west/south elevated route, another city has a green line that is a trolley subway, etc. I would think that visitors would find that confusing.

Actually two cities, but no one in Philly calls the subway-surface lines "The Green Line."

Having taken people from Boston to Washington (those being the other two biggest color line systems after the El), I can say the most confusing thing to them was the idea that trains from two different color lines can run on the same tracks, using the same platform. There's always little things liek that to worry about, but its minor.

After all, I've encountered plenty of people who have a hard time telling that there's even much of a difference between the green Line here in Boston and the other three subway lines ("What do you mean the Green Line subway is different? All I noticed was walking up some steps to get on...").

octr202 wrote:After all, I've encountered plenty of people who have a hard time telling that there's even much of a difference between the green Line here in Boston and the other three subway lines ("What do you mean the Green Line subway is different? All I noticed was walking up some steps to get on...").

I'll second that. A lot of casual riders don't even notice the differences we take for granted. I recall when I was attending a "commuter college" in downtown Chicago, a fellow student mentioned that she commuted on the South Shore. Someone asked, "What's the South Shore?" The answer was along the lines of, "It's a train just like the 'L,' but the seats are more comfortable." Another time, another student mentioned, "I've never been on Metra," and the response was "It's just like the 'L,' but it costs more."

Speaking of Metra, I'm surprised some genius hasn't tried to color code them. Its amazing anyone can find their way around on it.

F40CFan wrote:

Colors for the Chicago subway lines are easy to remember by color, not really by the name of the line.

I understand what you are saying, but as I said previously, it takes away from the uniqueness of the system.

Agreed, it does remove some of the uniqueness of a system to color code the lines (and to use the color names). Some systems use colors for visual identification, but don't use the colors for the name to preserve some of the uniqueness. For example, the London Underground has color assignments, but each line has a name. Signage for the underground uses a block of the color along with the line name to make it clear.

Central Line is red
Northern Line is black
Victoria Line is blue
Circle Line is yellow

etc etc

Isn't one problem the number of lines in London, and getting into some wierd colors if you use the names (Where's the blue line? Light blue or dark blue? There's two??!?!")

Beyond red, blue, green, orange, yellow, purple, and brown, using color names gets tough. Here we've got Silver in use too (not that its a train), and I guess gold is an option too, but hard to tell from yellow at times. All part of why NYC won't be able to go this route.

Isn't Metra sort of color coded too? I got some time tables back in January when I was in town -- are those consistant colors used on each line?

octr202 wrote:Isn't Metra sort of color coded too? I got some time tables back in January when I was in town -- are those consistant colors used on each line?

Metra timetables are color-coded by line, but it is simply an artistic device, and the lines are not referred to by their colors, nor are the colors used anywhere except the timetables. The colors come from history:

UP North Line -- Flambeau Green (C&NW)
Milwaukee District North Line -- Hiawatha Orange (CMStP&P)
North Central Service -- Don't know the history, but it's purple (Maybe WC?)
UP Northwest Line -- Viking Yellow (C&NW)
Milwaukee District West Line -- Arrow Yellow (CMStP&P)
UP West Line -- Kate Shelley Rose (C&NW)
BNSF -- Kelly Green (BN)
Heritage Corridor -- Alton Maroon (C&A/GM&O)
SouthWest Service -- Banner Blue (Wabash)
Rock Island District -- Rocket Red (CRI&P)
Metra Electric -- Panama Orange (IC)

A color coding system is also used for the zone tickets, but I don't think those colors have any special meaning.

Some systems use colors for visual identification, but don't use the colors for the name to preserve some of the uniqueness.

The CTA actually did that from approximately 1985 to 1993. I have no problem with that, as a matter of fact it does help relieve confusion. I wish they would have kept it that way.

Mike: I have always liked the METRA color coding - I remember hearing Mitch Markovitz designed these TTs and came up with the colors - is that true? He is one heck of an artist. This is color coding like it ought to be! - MACTRAXX

MACTRAXX wrote:I remember hearing Mitch Markovitz designed these TTs and came up with the colors - is that true?

I believe it is. He's been responsible for a great number of classy designs on Metra and the South Shore.

while metra has not changed to color names, at a board meeting the directors made it clear that they want new lines to have a direction and end in the word service. ie northcentral sevice, southwest service, southeast service. the only one that will not follow this pattern is the star line