Anybody know why this is at GCT ?

Why is there a track 102A and 103A ?

Tracks 102 and 103 have platforms on either side. So this platform is labeled "A".

Due to the curvature of the tracks, doors are supposed to be open on one side of the train. This is why trains off 102 load on the "A" side. The 102 side has wide gaps between the platform and train.

Thank you !

truck6018 wrote:Tracks 102 and 103 have platforms on either side. So this platform is labeled "A".

Due to the curvature of the tracks, doors are supposed to be open on one side of the train. This is why trains off 102 load on the "A" side. The 102 side has wide gaps between the platform and train.

That's new, I can't say I ever noticed the "A" designation before.

-otto-

Otto Vondrak wrote:That's new, I can't say I ever noticed the "A" designation before.

I noticed it back when I started using GCT regularly, in 1986.

I'd assumed it was that way when GCT was built, but maybe someone has a copy of the original track & platform layout from 1913 and can speak from knowledge.

I tried to find it marked on a track plan I have that was revised in the 50s, but it doesn't appear to have any mention of an "A" track. This always perplexed me, too, but the platform rationale makes sense. If they wanted to force people to use one platform side over another, telling them to use the "A" entrance would steer them that way.

It's definitely not new, as the old Omega track boards were marked as 102 and 102A also by the track entrances.

The track is 102, the platforms are 102 and 102A. Technically there is no track 102A despite the signage stating otherwise.

There's actually a discussion about the whole single numbering thing on the LL. No one can find maps that show non 100series track numbers on the LL, yet the photos clearly show they weren't always that way on the passenger-facing side.

If anyone hear can shed some light, it would be helpful. When did the 100s get added to the signage at the track entrances on the LL?

JamesRR wrote:There's actually a discussion about the whole single numbering thing on the LL. No one can find maps that show non 100series track numbers on the LL, yet the photos clearly show they weren't always that way on the passenger-facing side.

If anyone hear can shed some light, it would be helpful. When did the 100s get added to the signage at the track entrances on the LL?

I have track maps from 2005 that show tracks in the 100's, 600's and 700's. It also shows the loop on the LL as track 200.

The addition of the letters for those tracks are actually handy. If you've ever tried to board one of those trains at the last minute -- they seem to be used chiefly at rush hour -- it's easy to get confused as to which platform to use.

The gates on the Lower Level with the single digit track numbers. My theory? The photos were taken in the fall of 1912 when the suburban concourse was first opened. The Detroit Photograph Company (I think that's the name) took a series of shots and the older ones on Emily's site look like they're from that series.

Here's another one from that series:




In the November 1, 1912 issue, Railway Age reported five gates with ten tracks had been opened on the Lower Level. Perhaps they were numbered from one to ten? At least until the entire complex was open. In 1912 I believe access was still exclusively from the east. From corridors linking the tracks to the temporary Lexington Avenue Terminal where the ticket windows were briefly located.

Suggesting AGAINST that theory is the fact someone who has a New York Central ETT issued in November 1912 says it shows track assignments in the Lower Level and the tracks were already numbered in the 100s.
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Tommy Meehan wrote:Suggesting AGAINST that theory is the fact someone who has a New York Central ETT issued in November 1912 says it shows track assignments in the Lower Level and the tracks were already numbered in the 100s.
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Would the numbers on the gates necessarily reflect the numbers assigned to tracks in the ETT? Or could the railroad have assigned simpler temporary numbers to the gates for public consumption?

Could the Central have used one digit numbers on the gates while using the three digit numbers (the real track numbers) in the ETT?

We really don't know. It's tempting to think that's what they did, it would explain the photos showing the single digit track numbers. It has a certain logic to it, but as a devoted student of history I understand the fact that we don't actually know they did that. Another problem is the photos themselves. They don't be seem to be very well-dated. If they were that in itself would answer some questions.

There seems to be so little recorded about the way Grand Central Terminal was phased in. The recent 100th anniversary really brought this to light.

For instance William Middleton (and others) wrote that even Upper Level tracks were phased into service, probably as early as 1911, as sections of the old station came down. But there seem to be few details recorded as to how the public gained access to these tracks.

Yes, there do seem to be few details on how the terminal was phased in. I've read most of the major engineering-heavy books about GCT, and the only aspect they touch on is the phasing in of the new terminal in 'bites' as the construction moved westward. No details about upper/lower level, or yes, how anything was accessed.

I'm siding with the theory that since the lower level opened first, and presumably on the east side, the tracks were numbered 1-whatever for simplicity's sake. Why start numbering at 101, which would sound confusing to passengers? The secondary digits were the same, so it wouldn't have caused too much confusion for train dispatchers - 114 would be 14 for customers.

It's possible that the lower level retained non-100 numbers for a while, since it served a completely unique service: commuter trains. The whole idea was to separate long distance from commuter traffic, essentially creating two terminals. I've tried finding photos of the upper level departure board to see if there are any clues there. the earliest photos I've seen are of the 60s era Solari board, with its separate upper/lower level track column indicators, with the lower level having 3 digits.

JamesRR wrote:
Why start numbering at 101, which would sound confusing to passengers?

There is a track 101. However it is not a passenger track.