Adirondack Scenic Railroad (ADIX) Discussion - 2012

MikeVT wrote:I'm sure the Railroad is moving forward as best they can but every year that passes and the railroad is not in full operation just makes the case for the trail stronger.

The cost to turn the rail line into a trail would rival the cost of bringing the rail line up to "speed." The trail advocates have been noticably silent on where their funding is coming from.

There is also the question of whether even better funded organizations (Adirondack League, Sierra Club, et al) will press to have those sections of the proposed trail located in existing wilderness areas returned to "wilderness" - no motorized vehicles, no trail, nothin' but trees. And no 60+ mile trail through the middle of the Adirondack Park.

Again, my opinion is that the trail advocates aren't really advocating a trail, but if they revealed their actual agenda, a lot of people that currently support them probably wouldn't.

Alas, that's only my opinion - I've got no inside information, etc, to give it credence...

tree68 wrote:Again, my opinion is that the trail advocates aren't really advocating a trail, but if they revealed their actual agenda, a lot of people that currently support them probably wouldn't.

Most "trail supporters" who advocate removing rails in favor of dirt paths are not concerned about the environment or recreation at all, usually just their perceived notion of what "property values" mean. Most of these trail proposals are a sham, and are not sustainable on volunteer work alone.

In other words: We have a serious Bravo Sierra situation on our hands.

-otto-

charlie6017 wrote:Here is an article on this, courtesy of the Adirondack Daily Enterprise:

TUPPER LAKE - At a forum Wednesday night, advocates for removing the train tracks in the Adirondack Rail Corridor questioned support for the railroad in the North Country Regional Economic Development Council's plan.

Garry Douglas, co-chairman of the council and outspoken rail advocate, took a moment at the end of a presentation to explain why the council included support for all rail projects in its plan last year.

http://www.adirondackdailyenterprise.co ... 31557.html

Charlie

The best way to combat this situation is to write to the newspaper mentioned in the above post, and just say that you support restoring the railroad because you will ride it. The best way to help is to just show that there are people out there who will use it.

N_DL640A wrote:The best way to combat this situation is to write to the newspaper mentioned in the above post, and just say that you support restoring the railroad because you will ride it. The best way to help is to just show that there are people out there who will use it.

Great call..........and I just did my part.

I encourage others to do the same as perhaps it could make at least a small difference.

Charlie

Thanks, Charlie!
Every letter counts!

The Scenic got into the firefighting business near Ray Brook yesterday.

There is no truth to the rumor that the rolling stock will be repainted red and equipped with lights and sirens...

The Adirondack Scenic Railroad needs to get their act together to at least extend the operating territory as far as Beaver River. The advocates for destruction of the railroad are very real and very serious. Following is a link to a letter to the Albany Times Union, reading it turns my stomach.

http://www.timesunion.com/opinion/artic ... 711476.php

Noel Weaver

I was disappointed to find that the article does not have a comment section. It is unfortunate that they continue to bend the numbers and play the taxpayer sympathy card. They are also now reaching outside the local area and trying to sway people in Albany. I think it might be time for the Adirondack Scenic to do something that can be positively reported on. Big Moose expansion? (report on it, some of us know it's happening) Twentieth anniversary celebration? Over a Million riders? Something to show that the railroad is a successful and popular operation. Just because NYSDOT has no plans to remove the rails doesn't mean that ARTA won't severely damage the railroad's reputation in the process. I think the railroad being publicly quiet has gone on long enough (trust me, they are not taking this lightly behind closed doors). It is time for some positive spin. The media is a powerful thing but if you don't use it someone else will and it probably won't be to your liking.

Do we have a public relations expert among our readers who can provide the RR with some help on a positive spin for them?

I have PR/Marketing prowess. The recent article in the the Plattsburgh Press-Republican regarding transportation of fire fighting equipment west of Lake Placid for a forest fire July 12th proves a valid point throughout the system. Put that out there.

LAKE PLACID, N.Y. – Crews from the Adirondack Scenic Railroad helped firefighters with a forest fire on July 12, reports the Plattsburgh Press-Republican. The fire was spotted about a mile from the Lake Placid fire department in a location inaccessible by trucks. The train was used to move firefighting equipment closer to the fire.

A second fire was spotted two miles further down the line; the railroad continued to transport equipment and personnel as the crews focused on the new location.

There's a second (but apparently lesser known) group actively working to restore the railroad as well.
Next Stop! Tupper Lake, is based out of Tupper Lake, and their first priority is to rehab the line from Saranac Lake to Tupper Lake.
Here's their website:
http://nextstoptupperlake.org/
They have built a complete replica of the Tupper Lake station, and are working to raise funds for rail restoration.
One possiblility they have discussed is a do - it - yourself restoration akin to the Catskill Mountain RR's approach, and I'm sure they would like to hear from anyone with experience in that area!

The taxpayers deserve some sympathy. In a 1992 letter to the DOT/DEC planning team, ARPS stated that they were prepared to rebuild, "...the road bed and track to class three standard and accept all liability for the railroad at no cost to the State of New York." Twenty years and $32 million dollars later we have 60 miles of 'no cost to the State' class two track. Given that no cost estimates to date have even been close to the truth and the economic and job creation benefits have been minimal, it's time to try something else for the Corridor. If after 20 years the rail trail fails to live up to its projections, the you can say, "I told you so", and you'll have a nice clean surface on which to rebuild a new railroad.

The two links to articles on rail trails that didn't quite work out are not surprising given that there have been over 700 rail to trail conversions in the past 30 years as our vastly overbuilt rail system has been rationalized and as a result again become profitable. Neither of the articles mentioned any opposition to restoring rail service, and I doubt that restoration will cost any more now than it would if the rails and ties had sat there unmaintained for the intervening years.

As for ridership at the Lake Placid end, I have calculated that with the number of scheduled runs, the passenger count must average 53 (counted as 106 riders) each run to equal last year's stated ridership of over 21,000. At 2 PM yesterday, the clown train had 31 Lake Placid/Saranac Lake riders get off and 25 get on for the afternoon trip. There were some on the train that were returning to Saranac Lake, but the train was late enough that they did not get off - so much for helping the Lake Placid economy. In watching other trains to date, I have only seen one train with more than the 53 passengers needed to equal last year's ridership. Is this a down year, or does it get busier in August? Weekday trains observed last September never had more than 30 riders. I'm not saying "nobody" rides these trains, but I and many others believe many more would use the Corridor without the tracks.

The preceeding entry on here was written by somebody who is NO FRIEND of ours. We need to support the railroad to every extant that we are able to do so. Please remember for the most part the people who want rail trails, snowmobile trails etc are NO FRIEND OF THE RAILROADS. IF the tracks were to be torn up it would be a sin in my book and if this were to happen then NOTHING should go in their place.
Noel Weaver