Railroad Forums 

  • Who makes decisions on spurs? Why are they tore out?

  • General discussion about railroad operations, related facilities, maps, and other resources.
General discussion about railroad operations, related facilities, maps, and other resources.

Moderator: Robert Paniagua

 #911470  by carajul
 
Looking at some historic aerial photos of the New Brunswick area kinda got me thinking. Just south of the How Ln bridge over the NEC in North Brunswick, a spur crossed Jersey Ave. As long as I can remeber, this spur had pine trees growing thru it. I didn't realize it but it actually tapped several of the industrial budingins past Jersey Ave. There were even flashers on Jersey Ave. In the mid-2000s the spur was ripped out. I looked at the over head photos from 1967-2006 and not one car was ever spotted on any of the sidings. Seems like a waste.

Who actually owns a rail spur into a factory and who pays for its installation? Why are spurs installed and never even used one time? Why would those spurs be tore out, eliminating rail service forever? Why would one spur have flashers and a spur 10' away over the same road just have crossbucks? Do modern day RRs such as NS and CSX want the spur into factory business these days?
 #911497  by PARailWiz
 
Ownership of spurs usually goes with ownership of the land - the railroad owns up to the right of way line and the facility owns the track on its property.

Sometimes they have a spur installed to use as a negotiating tactic to get truckers to lower prices, other times a proposed business never comes to fruition.

Tearing out a spur doesn't generally eliminate all future possibility of service, it's usually not a huge deal to re-install them. In the meantime the rail has scrap value or could be used somewhere else, and maintaining spur switches costs money. Leaving unused spurs connected to mainline track also raises risk of derailment.

Different levels of crossing protection probably relate to how frequently the spur is used and the general visibility of the crossing (or at least it should).

Couldn't tell you if the modern railroads want this kind of freight traffic, but they'll do it if they're paid enough.
 #911662  by dano23
 
Sidings are often constructed to new buidlings simply as a way to lure potential lessees in by giving a facility multiple forms of access. It's not uncommon for a building with rail access to be leased by someone with no interest in rail as a lessee may be more interested in the warehouse space than the access.
 #911836  by Tom_E_Reynolds
 
Also in my research, I have found references where a company wants rail access and pays for the construction of the tracks on their property, and then gives the Railroad (Raritan River) a deposit, covering the construction costs of the switch and leading track to the customers property. The Railroad, in return, will credit the customer $1 per loaded car received or shipped for the customer for 5 years. Usually, this was done, when the customer's estimate of shipments was low.

I'll have to dig through my docs to get the exact customers.
 #912243  by wolfboy8171981
 
Each customer will sign a "side track agreement" with the railroad they connect to. There is usually a fee to inspect and maintain the switch on the main line unless x amount of cars are handled per year. ( last I knew this to be 8 to 10). The railroad itself hardly ever owns the tracks on private property, but they may also charge a fee to inspect and maintain it, or fix it if becomes damaged.
 #913127  by 2nd trick op
 
The economics of local pick-up and delivery began to change after World War II. The idea of a lumber yard, coal dealer, and team track in every small community became obsolete in the days of "mass distribution" and the trend toward freight cars of large capacity intensified the didsadvantage of small shipments.

The major freight roads replied in two ways, for the most part. When branch lines could be spun off to local operators with more flexibility and lower base labor costs, the cost disadvantage was mitigated. The other strategy was to concentrate points of pck-up an delivery in fewer locations. Usually, this revolved around iintermodal services, but the use of "distribution centers" also could involve larger individual rail shipments to fewer locatons.

Total freight tonnage moved has improved substantially since the industry hit bottom a quarter-century ago; but I wouldn't look or a return to "loose-car railroading".
 #913280  by slchub
 
We wondered why the UP was tearing out switches and siding a few years ago and it came to light that the UP was paying taxes on those unused switches. How a switch, siding and/or stub track is taxed by the Feds is a mystery to me. Can anyone shed some light on that one?
 #913301  by Lronan
 
Yes, sidings into private industries belong to that industry. They paid and maintained the siding at their own cost. The switch cut into railroad would be paid for by the customer or the railroad, depending on the volume of traffic. There were also, "Team Tracks" (sidings), which were owned by the railroad, where they placed cars for loading/unloading for customers, at no charge, usually 48hrs free time was allowed to load/unload, after that a fee was paid per day.
Such a track was in downtown New Brunswick near Remsen Ave. between Livingston Ave and Commercial Ave south of Sandford St.
 #913307  by edbear
 
When an industrial siding is installed, the shipper foots the bill for the installation. In my Boston & Maine experience, the entire cost was borne by the customer; if the territory was signalled, the signal modifications were paid for separately. If a crossing was nearby it was even more costly. The railroad owned to the property line. The shipper/receiver signed a contract and was refunded either $5 or $10 per loaded car (depending on the commodity - high value commodities, manufactured goods moved at high rates - low value commodities, raw materials moved at low rates) until the railroad owned portion excluding the signal work was paid off. The shipper/receiver paid an annual rent for having the connection in place and from time to time the railroad would tell the shipper/receiver that the track required additional maintenance in the amount of $xxxxx and to pay up. Industrial sidings off mainline trackage are a high maintenance item and railroads have been trying to get low volume installations removed. Shell Oil had a tank farm on the Belmont/Waltham line off the east end of the truncated Central Mass. Branch at Clematis Brook. They dutifully paid for maintenance and rent for years as it was their insurance of deliveries if there was a truckers' strike. In the past 30 or so years a lot of sidetrack owners with just a very sporadic traffic volume have opted out of sidetrack agreements rather than pay an annual rent and periodic maintenance.
 #914459  by 56-57
 
The taxes on infrastructure aren't paid to the federal government, they're paid to local municipalities in the form of property taxes. Some states, like New York and New Jersey have historically had railroad tax rates that have been almost damaging, with Hudson County (essentially Jersey City, NJ) being about the worst.

The rates vary from state to state, and for various classes of property. Conrail would have paid taxes to Philadelphia on their headquarters building, however, railroads in Pennsylvania do not pay property taxes on property directly used in the transportation business, i.e. freight yards, mainlines, bridges carrying them, etc..

-Micah
 #914672  by carajul
 
No wonder there is no more local traffic. What shipper needs that expense/headache?!?! I could call Fedex, UPS, ABF, JB Hunt, etc and have a truck deliver it on schedule with no other expenses!

---------
When an industrial siding is installed, the shipper foots the bill for the installation. In my Boston & Maine experience, the entire cost was borne by the customer; if the territory was signalled, the signal modifications were paid for separately. If a crossing was nearby it was even more costly. The railroad owned to the property line. The shipper/receiver signed a contract and was refunded either $5 or $10 per loaded car (depending on the commodity - high value commodities, manufactured goods moved at high rates - low value commodities, raw materials moved at low rates) until the railroad owned portion excluding the signal work was paid off. The shipper/receiver paid an annual rent for having the connection in place and from time to time the railroad would tell the shipper/receiver that the track required additional maintenance in the amount of $xxxxx and to pay up.
 #915446  by Tom_E_Reynolds
 
Here are some of the latest examples I could dig up from the Raritan River Archives of cases where the railroad required the shipper to put down a deposit for the construction of new sidings:

AFE #726 April 5, 1965

Permission requested to spend $3850 to construct a siding to serve the Decorated Metal Company located on the Milltown Spur. The company has agreed to deposit $2500 towards the construction of the siding, and will be refunded $1 per loaded car handled over 5 years. Traffic is expected to begin with 75 cars per year.

Note: 75 cars per year x 5 years = 375 cars or only $375 dollars refunded out of the $2500 deposit.



AFE #752 September 13, 1972.

Permission requested to spend $6450 to construct a new switch and 50 ft of track connecting with 2300 ft of side track in Highview Industrial Park, in East Brunswick. Highview will deposit $6460 for the construction of the switch, which will be refunded at the rate of $3 per loaded car to or from their track.



AFE #745 May 12, 1970

Permission requested to spend $4600 to construct a siding to serve Tidewater Distribution Services on the recently completed East Brunswick Branch. Tidewater has agreed to deposit $5000 toward the construction, which is refundable to them at $3 per loaded car over a 5 year period.
 #916918  by scharnhorst
 
I was told by an MOW Road Foremen on CSX that the charge was about $700.00 dollars per month to keep a Switch connected to a Spur connected along the main line that was 11 years ago when I was told this. It was explained in a simple way like a renter paying for a service and the money used for upkeep and maintaince of the Switch. I would assume that if the customer stops paying the railroad removes the switch after X amount of time when the track falls dormant or if the customer gos out of business or the switch is removed at the owners request.