Waterbury Branch: Improvements, PTC, Sidings, Service Frequency

Or the frequency could be increased so the layover isn't so long. Would be cheaper and get more ridership.

Service is also partially throttled by mainline slots or lack thereof. If anything is built to modify Waterbury branch capacity and free up mainline space, it should be a permanent Devon transfer station.

It has been too long since on the MNRR east line. How constrained is main line capacity on the New Haven line due to the reconstruction of the various draw bridges? schedule planning probably has to do with the periods that only 2 tracks will be i use at the various draws?

What are the various constraints of MNRR running longer trains especially those that are going to be connecting trains off the branches? I suspect that we might see a contraction of thru trains off the branches.

njtmnrrbuff wrote: ↑Sun Jan 09, 2022 7:14 pmWoops I meant to say if Devon Transfer is ever a permanent station, then most of the trains running to and from Waterbury would run as far south as Devon. I don't want to go too far off topic but in terms of having Amtrak stop at Barnum if it ever gets built, not sure about that. The current Bridgeport Station is really the main intermodel transit center in that city because not only do you have Metro North NHL and WBL trains but you also have the ferries that run from Bridgeport to Port Jefferson and back. There are probably many people who live in Suffolk County in the Port Jefferson area who depend on the ferry to connect to Amtrak trains. It's too bad that there is no room for anymore tracks at Bridgeport Station because the WBL trains can layover there without having to sit on any of the Main Line tracks for a long time.

Bridgeport just can't handle Amtrak, it needs to be reserved for through MN trains ONLY. A bus shuttle or timed transfers with MN trains could handle the transfer between the two. As part of the project, MN should just make the fare between the two free. MN shouldn't turn trains in Bridgeport, they should mostly terminate at Devon Transfer, with a few running through to STM.

robelybasis wrote: ↑Sat May 07, 2022 2:49 pmSomething CDOT/MNR should push for is a turning track 0.1 Mi South of Bridgeport station along the higher embankment outside the Ferry Terminal, similar to how Danbury Branch trains sit in South Norwalk off the mainline.

That's a band-aid to building Barnum and Devon Transfer.

west point wrote: ↑Fri May 13, 2022 3:10 amWhat are the various constraints of MNRR running longer trains especially those that are going to be connecting trains off the branches? I suspect that we might see a contraction of thru trains off the branches.

Basically platforms. They're already running 9-car trains, but the longer you go the more unwieldy things get at some of the older, shorter platforms if you don't extend them all to the full 12-car length. And going beyond the 9-car platforms at NHV starts to get unwieldy.

Extending all the platforms to 10-12 cars isn't a terrible idea, but there are a lot of other improvements that could be done first. West Haven was built with 12-car platforms, so clearly the idea is that 12 cars is the ultimate limit for the New Haven Line, as it is throughout much of the NYC commuter rail system.

The challenge with scheduling, especially on the weekends, is that they seem to end up with several connections on one train, and none on another, so the train with connections turns into a bit of a zoo due to the low weekend frequencies on the branches/SLE/Hartford.

A station at Barnum would not enhance capacity, or help Amtrak. It would add a stop to MNRR trains, reducing capacity. Barnum is a Bridgeport request. As for Amtrak, they shouldn't bother stopping at Bridgeport anyway. There's only a few stops a day. It's the same at New Rochelle, and NRO will be obviated as soon as Penn service begins for MNR.

Turning branch trains at Bridgeport also makes no sense. They should just run through to either SoNo or Stamford. Even if there's not a demand from the branch, there's a demand on the mainline.

Devon Transfer, however, definitely makes sense. It removes mainline interference. Add an overpass (ask GOTR how much I love overpasses lol) and it's done. And they should be using DMU's.

By the way, the Branch has been reopened; PTC and passing sidings have been installed.

Jeff Smith wrote: ↑Mon Jun 27, 2022 3:20 pm By the way, the Branch has been reopened; PTC and passing sidings have been installed.

There was a lot of work finished in the past two years. Mostly the new signal system/PTC/sidings and new ties on the northern half of the line but also some smaller projects like replacing old rails in curves and completely replacing 1/2 mile of contaminated track in one area. Two of the passing sidings are completely new (Derby and Beacon Falls) and the other two were just upgraded (Waterbury and Devon).

Jeff Smith wrote: ↑Mon Jun 27, 2022 3:20 pmA station at Barnum would not enhance capacity, or help Amtrak. It would add a stop to MNRR trains, reducing capacity. Barnum is a Bridgeport request. As for Amtrak, they shouldn't bother stopping at Bridgeport anyway. There's only a few stops a day. It's the same at New Rochelle, and NRO will be obviated as soon as Penn service begins for MNR.

Barnum would absolutely help Amtrak, as today Amtrak can't stop in Bridgeport during rush hour because there is no time on the outer tracks for them. With Barnum, they could stop in Bridgeport whenever they please. It alone would modestly increase MN capacity in the off-peak, as there wouldn't need to be slots for Amtrak in the existing Bridgeport station anymore.

If they get rid of all NRO service, that's pretty dumb. Couldn't they find time for a few trains a day to make a 2-minute stop there, even with all the MN traffic to Penn?

Devon Transfer, however, definitely makes sense. It removes mainline interference. Add an overpass (ask GOTR how much I love overpasses lol) and it's done. And they should be using DMU's.

It is true that Devon Transfer is the big capacity improver. They should use DMUs, and terminate some trains at Devon Transfer, have a few go down the west leg of the wye bypassing Devon Transfer and on to SoNo or STM, and then have some stop at Devon Transfer and continue onwards to New Haven. The New Haven service is admittedly a bit of an oddball service that wouldn't exist on its own, but with New Haven being a bit of a rail hub, and Devon Transfer making such service trivial on existing infrastructure, it would be worth a try. Devon Transfer is huge, as it would no longer require slots on the mainline at all, removing the biggest bottleneck between STM and NHV, and additional branch service could be added as an isolated service to connect with a mainline train, and the station itself would have kiss and ride, bus, uber/taxi, and pedestrian access as well.

You're missing the point; Amtrak stopping at Bridgeport and or NRO doesn't do anything for Amtrak except slow it down; the passenger counts are negligible. It's not about capacity. Devon definitely helps. It's a waste running Bombs. They could even run through all the way to Hartford via Berlin.

Jeff Smith wrote: ↑Fri Jul 01, 2022 1:18 pmYou're missing the point; Amtrak stopping at Bridgeport and or NRO doesn't do anything for Amtrak except slow it down; the passenger counts are negligible. It's not about capacity. Devon definitely helps. It's a waste running Bombs. They could even run through all the way to Hartford via Berlin.

Amtrak service is the biggest driver behind the Barnum Station, as they could get access to Bridgeport all day, instead of only during off-peak hours. NRO is a good location for Amtrak, service, they should also look at building a station at Northern Blvd and Broadway in Queens, as they don't currently have anything serving Queens/Brooklyn.

It is true, however, that the biggest benefit to the New Haven Line would be Devon Transfer. And yes, they should have DMUs for Waterbury. The run to Hartford makes little sense, as coming from the New Haven Line it's faster to go through New Haven, and the service would be rather slow on the winding, twisting, and circuitous route now that the Boondoggle took the more direct ROW to Newington Junction. Even if that ROW was still there, it would still be a really slow service on that very curvy route between several really small cities. I'd rather see the funds put towards the missing stations on New Haven Line, Hartford Line, and SLE, extending SLE to Westerly, and improving service on all three lines.

There might still be some service needed to Hartford on the line as not many passengers would be traveling the full distance. Do not make this an end to end issue.

west point wrote: ↑Fri Jul 08, 2022 2:11 am There might still be some service needed to Hartford on the line as not many passengers would be traveling the full distance. Do not make this an end to end issue.

Even from Bristol or Plainville, the run would be painfully slow. Although with small DMUs, maybe some people would take it as an occasional regional rail type of thing just for parking/convenience reasons. That stretch wouldn't be high on my priority list though.

EDIT 1: It's also a route well covered by major highways, including the newly rebuilt I-84, so I think the money and effort would be much better spent on improving SLE/Westerly, Hartford, existing Waterbury Branch, Danbury/New Milford, and of course New Haven Line service.

EDIT 2: The Waterbury-New Haven service makes no sense if it had to be built as its own service, but I think there's a lot of possibilities for it, as it becomes relatively easy to run once Devon Transfer is put in place, pointing trains east to service Devon Transfer. Extend a few trains to New Haven, a few to STM, avoiding terminating at Bridgeport, and increase service frequency significantly with trains terminating at Devon Transfer to meet New Haven Line trains.

Jeff Smith wrote: ↑Fri Jul 01, 2022 1:18 pm You're missing the point; Amtrak stopping at Bridgeport and or NRO doesn't do anything for Amtrak except slow it down; the passenger counts are negligible. It's not about capacity. Devon definitely helps. It's a waste running Bombs. They could even run through all the way to Hartford via Berlin.

Not to go OT but-- are the passenger counts at NRO really that negligible? I've picked up Amtrak there plenty of times and there seem to be a healthy number of people detraining/entraining. It's not like it just serves New Rochelle itself-- there are over 400k people in the southern tier of Westchester County towns for whom NRO is the most convenient place to catch an NEC train.