• NJT Comet IV Cars

  • Discussion related to New Jersey Transit rail and light rail operations.
Discussion related to New Jersey Transit rail and light rail operations.

Moderators: Tadman, nick11a, Kaback9, ACeInTheHole

  by R36 Combine Coach
 
From sources elsewhere, the Comet IVs are kept in roadworthy condition (FRA inspection certificates), and can operate in push mode (at least in theory) if needed.
  by TDowling
 
Was the entire fleet of the comet ivs ever given a complete overhaul since their time in service?
  by F40
 
Nope, nothing major at least. What you see is pretty much the original as they came out in 1997/98. As such, they have aged, judging by the lights, LCD display, interior doors, and seats discolored in some areas. I remember riding these same cars back in 2000 and seeing the "picture" of their debut on the now defunct, Michael Steinberg's hobokenterminal.com website.
  by R36 Combine Coach
 
F40 wrote:What you see is pretty much the original as they came out in 1997/98. As such, they have aged, judging by the lights, LCD display, interior doors, and seats discolored in some areas. I remember riding these same cars back in 2000 and seeing the "picture" of their debut on the now defunct, Michael Steinberg's hobokenterminal.com website.
Delivery from BBD in Barre, VT was autumn 1996-spring 1997, in time to replace the Arrow IIs. The IVs were purchased for Midtown Direct, along with the 12 Microprocessor ALP44s. The "formal" premiere (for the public) for the Comet IV was Hoboken Festival '97 (May 11) with one car on display and brochures with facts and specs on the new cars.
  by F40
 
R36 Combine Coach wrote:
F40 wrote:What you see is pretty much the original as they came out in 1997/98. As such, they have aged, judging by the lights, LCD display, interior doors, and seats discolored in some areas. I remember riding these same cars back in 2000 and seeing the "picture" of their debut on the now defunct, Michael Steinberg's hobokenterminal.com website.
Delivery from BBD in Barre, VT was autumn 1996-spring 1997, in time to replace the Arrow IIs. The IVs were purchased for Midtown Direct, along with the 12 Microprocessor ALP44s. The "formal" premiere (for the public) for the Comet IV was Hoboken Festival '97 (May 11) with one car on display and brochures with facts and specs on the new cars.
I was off by a year. :-)
  by liftedjeep
 
Just found this thread....

Comet IV cab car #5015 was sandwiched in the middle of NJ Transit Atlantic City Line #4620 (coming from Philadelphia) at the Pennsauken Transit Center on 8/8.

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPi ... id=4769836" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

This was the car I rode in out of 30th St Station. Still had the lavatory in the center, and the paper cup dispenser with built in trash can underneath!
Ben
  by JamesRR
 
I often see these cab cars right behind the locomotive (cab facing away from loco) on NEC trains.
  by sullivan1985
 
NJT Comet IV cabs are not used to lead trains anymore because they apparently "don't work well with the ALP45/46 locomotives." Take that as you will. The other one is that parts are no longer available for maintenance and the air brake system is outdated.

Other rumors floating around suggested it had something to do with crashworthiness which is entirely false.

Metro-North still operates their Shoreliner IIIs in the lead and they are essentially identical.

The cars are still maintained as cab cars. CSS is active and they get 92D inspections. They are utilized essentially for their lavatoy and only placed behind the locomotives these days. In theory there is nothing in writing prohibiting them from leading a train.

Personally I think it's nonsense and if the lame "ALP excuse" is true they should at least be used for Atlantic City services seince the ALPs and PL42s are currently restricted from the AC line. However this option makes sense.

That or just put money into them and fix them. Since they're not being used to lead trains at the moment they would be a perfect candidate to remove from service and redo the cabs complete with PTC and all.
  by liftedjeep
 
sullivan1985 wrote:NJT Comet IV cabs are not used to lead trains anymore because they apparently "don't work well with the ALP45/46 locomotives." Take that as you will. The other one is that parts are no longer available for maintenance and the air brake system is outdated.

Other rumors floating around suggested it had something to do with crashworthiness which is entirely false.

Metro-North still operates their Shoreliner IIIs in the lead and they are essentially identical.

The cars are still maintained as cab cars. CSS is active and they get 92D inspections. They are utilized essentially for their lavatoy and only placed behind the locomotives these days. In theory there is nothing in writing prohibiting them from leading a train.

Personally I think it's nonsense and if the lame "ALP excuse" is true they should at least be used for Atlantic City services seince the ALPs and PL42s are currently restricted from the AC line. However this option makes sense.

That or just put money into them and fix them. Since they're not being used to lead trains at the moment they would be a perfect candidate to remove from service and redo the cabs complete with PTC and all.
My guess is that since the Comet V cab cars are handling the task just fine here along the Atlantic City Line, NJ Transit no longer has the need to utilize the IVs in that roll. Again, just a theory.
Ben
  by sullivan1985
 
liftedjeep wrote:My guess is that since the Comet V cab cars are handling the task just fine here along the Atlantic City Line, NJ Transit no longer has the need to utilize the IVs in that roll. Again, just a theory.
Ben
The point being that if these lame excuses I get about "incompatibilities" with ALPs is true then why waste Comet Vs on the ACL when a handful of Comet IVs would be more than sufficient as the ALPs do not run there.
  by R36 Combine Coach
 
sullivan1985 wrote:That or just put money into them and fix them. Since they're not being used to lead trains at the moment they would be a perfect candidate to remove from service and redo the cabs complete with PTC and all.
That makes some sense. If they are roadworthy and kept up to date on inspections, they could easily be used to fill in for the Comet Vs, solving the cab shortage.
  by lensovet
 
question
CSS is active and they get 92D inspections
are they getting the PTC treatment too or no?
  by EuroStar
 
lensovet wrote:are they getting the PTC treatment too or no?
Why would they? It is not required in order to operate them as regular cars the way they have been doing and NJT is short on money anyway.

It is a pity that even with the current pinch for cab cars NJT cannot figure out a way to use them leading non-ALP powered consists at least until the end of the year.
  by lensovet
 
but then why not decommission CSS and stop doing the inspections? makes no sense.
  by EuroStar
 
lensovet wrote:but then why not decommission CSS and stop doing the inspections? makes no sense.
I will venture to guess that it has something to do with FRA regulations (hopefully someone with deeper knowledge of this will correct me). Aren't cab cars basically the same as engines when it comes to frequency of inspections and and maintenance? You would not just wake up one morning and say "from now on this engine is not an engine any more, it is just a dead weight I will pull around in my consists". The same probably applies to the cab cars -- to downgrade them to simple coaches probably requires permanently disabling and maybe even removing all control hardware. It might be cheaper to just continue the inspections and other related federally mandated activities instead of decommissioning and removing the hardware. But anyway, this is just a guess. I am not familiar with the FRA regulations or the economics of the issue.