Amtrak Downeaster Discussion Thread

[MEC407]

There are perfectly good sidewalks from the station to wherever you need to go. I don't find it particularly maze-like; you just follow the sidewalk and eventually you're downtown. There are wayfinding signs, too. How much hand-holding are we supposed to do for people?

In the glory days of rail I doubt that B&M passengers arriving in Portland all walked to their hotels in downtown and the Old Port. I'm sure the majority of them took taxis or buses rather than schlepping their kids and their luggage up the steep Congress Street hill. Today we've got taxis and buses as well as free hotel shuttle vans and Uber/Lyft. Arguably it's a lot easier today than it was back then.

[Suburban Station]

...ridership is displacing northwards with out any additional growth at the Portland station from the capacity relief there.

Why is that a bad thing? It means people who formerly drove to Portland to catch the train now catch it closer to home.

The Portland station isn't convenient to much of anything (although, to be fair, if the former Union Station were still in use, it would be almost as inconvenient).

moving POR to a location on the main cutting travel time and moving it closer to downtown seems like a big win.

[alcohh660]

The Dot was supposed to make a decision on whether to go ahead with the wye project or go with an alternate location for the station by around Labor Day. Any progress on that front?
Relocating the plumbing supply house that sits on the main to Riverside Street (or somewhere) and putting the station on that parcel could work. Again, parking would be a concern. Barber Foods would be a good location as well. The cost of relocating that facility would be way more costly due to the complex mechanicals involved.

S

[gokeefe]

I would suspect we will see more information when the notes from the Board meeting get published (if not sooner from an announcement of some kind).

[Ridgefielder]

A minor nitpick

Why aren't passengers allowed to wait on the platform at the PTC? Portland is the only station I've ever been to where staff reprimanded you for standing on the platform to wait for a train. What's the reasoning?

Didn’t know about Portland, but this is an issue all along the NEC, and has even generated press coverage.

Honestly never heard of this being an issue on the NEC. Within the past couple years I've boarded trains at NY Penn, New Rochelle, Stamford, New Haven, New London, Kingston and Boston South. Only places where I *didn't* wait on the platform were BOS and NYP.

[MEC407]

...walkways into Portland from the PTC could easily be constructed to get people through the maze of expressway interchanges...

There are perfectly good sidewalks and signaled crosswalks from the station to wherever you need to go. I don't find it particularly maze-like; you just follow the sidewalk and eventually you're downtown. There are wayfinding signs, too. How much hand-holding are we supposed to do for people?

In the glory days of rail I doubt that passengers arriving in Portland all walked to their hotels. I'm sure the majority of them took taxis or buses/trolleys rather than schlepping their kids and their luggage up the steep Congress Street hill. Today we've got taxis and buses as well as free hotel shuttle vans and Uber/Lyft, and narrated step-by-step directions in the palm of your hand. Arguably it's a lot easier today than it was back then.

[Suburban Station]

...walkways into Portland from the PTC could easily be constructed to get people through the maze of expressway interchanges...

There are perfectly good sidewalks and signaled crosswalks from the station to wherever you need to go. I don't find it particularly maze-like; you just follow the sidewalk and eventually you're downtown. There are wayfinding signs, too. How much hand-holding are we supposed to do for people?

In the glory days of rail I doubt that passengers arriving in Portland all walked to their hotels. I'm sure the majority of them took taxis or buses/trolleys rather than schlepping their kids and their luggage up the steep Congress Street hill. Today we've got taxis and buses as well as free hotel shuttle vans and Uber/Lyft, and narrated step-by-step directions in the palm of your hand. Arguably it's a lot easier today than it was back then.

the old union station site is about 20 minutes closer to downtown, on foot...not to mention that it's 20 minutes of terrible pedestrian experience. given that it's another 20 to 25 minutes from the old union station, the current location makes the station effectively inaccessible to downtown. in the old days there were taxis and trolleys as well.

[gokeefe]

Plenty of taxis at the PTC no question there. Along with Uber and Lyft of course.

[MEC407]

Yes, I specifically mentioned taxis and trolleys in my post and I pointed out that today we have taxis as well as Uber, Lyft, and free hotel shuttles.

It's a 30 minute walk from Union Station Plaza to the Portland Harbor Hotel. It's a 45 minute walk from Portland Transportation Center to the Portland Harbor Hotel. Yes, that's a longer walk. But what sane person would choose to haul themselves and their family and their luggage on a 30-minute walk when they could have the hotel pick them up for free or they could take the bus or they could take a cab or they could use Uber/Lyft? What difference does it make that Union Station was 15 minutes closer by foot when it's still way too far to walk? Once you've reached the "way too far" threshold, what difference does it make? Way too far is way too far.

We have public transportation for a reason. Amtrak itself is public transportation. Who are these people who are willing to use Amtrak but unwilling to use a free hotel shuttle, the bus, taxis, or ride sharing services? I'm not so sure they really exist.

[gokeefe]

Me either. This is intercity transportation not the local light rail.

[njtmnrrbuff]

It’s possible that while I’m spending a few days in Boston, I’m going to take a daytrip on the Downeaster from Boston to Dover. The plan would be to take 691 north and coming back, take 694 south.

[sicariis]

It’s possible that while I’m spending a few days in Boston, I’m going to take a daytrip on the Downeaster from Boston to Dover. The plan would be to take 691 north and coming back, take 694 south.

If the journey is for the enjoyment of the train trip alone, may I suggest getting off in Durham, enjoying lunch in the restored 1896 station that now houses the UNH Dairy Bar, with plenty of time to check out campus a bit before catching 694 back to BON.

[Suburban Station]

Yes, I specifically mentioned taxis and trolleys in my post and I pointed out that today we have taxis as well as Uber, Lyft, and free hotel shuttles.

It's a 30 minute walk from Union Station Plaza to the Portland Harbor Hotel. It's a 45 minute walk from Portland Transportation Center to the Portland Harbor Hotel. Yes, that's a longer walk. But what sane person would choose to haul themselves and their family and their luggage on a 30-minute walk when they could have the hotel pick them up for free or they could take the bus or they could take a cab or they could use Uber/Lyft? What difference does it make that Union Station was 15 minutes closer by foot when it's still way too far to walk? Once you've reached the "way too far" threshold, what difference does it make? Way too far is way too far.

We have public transportation for a reason. Amtrak itself is public transportation. Who are these people who are willing to use Amtrak but unwilling to use a free hotel shuttle, the bus, taxis, or ride sharing services? I'm not so sure they really exist.

you are missing the fact that "way too far" varies and is reached in increments and that 20 minutes further away . walks under highways also feel longer and people are less likely to do them. this is a train station not an airport and site selection matters. does being 20 minutes closer matter? absolutely. not everyone travels with their families, not every hotel and short term rental has free shuttles. no one would choose a station on the ass end of time that requires a back up move over one that does not require a back up move and it 20 minutes closer to where you want to be. I get it, the line was started up on a shoestring budget but at some point improving the station siting should be one of the improvements.

[Ridgefielder]

Yes, I specifically mentioned taxis and trolleys in my post and I pointed out that today we have taxis as well as Uber, Lyft, and free hotel shuttles.

It's a 30 minute walk from Union Station Plaza to the Portland Harbor Hotel. It's a 45 minute walk from Portland Transportation Center to the Portland Harbor Hotel. Yes, that's a longer walk. But what sane person would choose to haul themselves and their family and their luggage on a 30-minute walk when they could have the hotel pick them up for free or they could take the bus or they could take a cab or they could use Uber/Lyft? What difference does it make that Union Station was 15 minutes closer by foot when it's still way too far to walk? Once you've reached the "way too far" threshold, what difference does it make? Way too far is way too far.

We have public transportation for a reason. Amtrak itself is public transportation. Who are these people who are willing to use Amtrak but unwilling to use a free hotel shuttle, the bus, taxis, or ride sharing services? I'm not so sure they really exist.

you are missing the fact that "way too far" varies and is reached in increments and that 20 minutes further away . walks under highways also feel longer and people are less likely to do them. this is a train station not an airport and site selection matters. does being 20 minutes closer matter? absolutely. not everyone travels with their families, not every hotel and short term rental has free shuttles. no one would choose a station on the ass end of time that requires a back up move over one that does not require a back up move and it 20 minutes closer to where you want to be. I get it, the line was started up on a shoestring budget but at some point improving the station siting should be one of the improvements.

The population of the City of Portland is approximately 66k. That's roughly the same as it was in 1920. But the population of the 3 "inner-ring" suburbs of South Portland, Westbrook and Falmouth has increased from 18k to 56k in the same time period. Arguably the current station location adjacent to I-295 is better suited to serve the needs of the people who actually live in the Portland area today, in 2019, than the old site on St. John Street.

[west point]

Acceptable walk distance is one thing in the summer. However in the throes of the many down east winter storms ?