Railroad Forums 

  • Naugatuck Branch in the 1970's

  • Discussion relating to the NH and its subsidiaries (NYW&B, Union Freight Railroad, Connecticut Company, steamship lines, etc.). up until its 1969 inclusion into the Penn Central merger. This forum is also for the discussion of efforts to preserve former New Haven equipment, artifacts and its history. You may also wish to visit www.nhrhta.org for more information.
Discussion relating to the NH and its subsidiaries (NYW&B, Union Freight Railroad, Connecticut Company, steamship lines, etc.). up until its 1969 inclusion into the Penn Central merger. This forum is also for the discussion of efforts to preserve former New Haven equipment, artifacts and its history. You may also wish to visit www.nhrhta.org for more information.
 #1440494  by Ruzbasan
 
I am researching the Naugatuck Line and have a question.

From 1969-1976, what types of locomotives were used by Penn Central on the Naugatuck Branch?

What types of locomotives were used from Derby-Waterbury-Torrington, from Waterbury-Plainville, and from Waterbury to Watertown?

Please excuse me for asking about Penn Central on a New Haven forum but many former New Haven engineers worked for Penn Central and may be able to shed some light on this question.

Any info is greatly appreciated.
Reply Edit
 #1440500  by Noel Weaver
 
Generally the Penn Central ran the same power that the NHRR ran which meant RS-3's and GP-9's. Occasionally something else came into the mix. Yard jobs were still mostly Alco S-1's. Dublin Street during most of the NHRR days was restricted to nothing heavier than an S-1 (0931-0995) but as of timetable 7 dated 4-26-59 the brains or lack of brains decided that any yard engine and some road engines could run on the Dublin Street although I don't think anything was done with this branch to allow heavier power and i kind of doubt if anything heavier actually ran here. There were also restrictions on the Watertown Branch that kept at least some RS-3's in Waterbury. Not too long after Penn Central took over the freight business evaporated, this was not the fault of the railroad but was a result of the big customers simply closing or moving out. This does not mean that other power would show up occasionally but probably not often. Budd cars stayed in Waterbury until after Conrail finally took over in 1976. Prnn Central made a lot of cuts but they would have come no matter who was running the operation in Waterbury and railroading continued to be interesting and in some ways better after Penn Central took over.
Noel Weaver
 #1440522  by TomNelligan
 
I was living in the Valley in the early 1970s and I'll confirm everything that Noel has written above, and just add that while Waterbury had Alco switchers, the Derby-based switcher that covered Ansonia, Derby, and Shelton was usually an SW1200 until the job was abolished a few years after the PC takeover. At one point in the early Conrail years, CR ran a Danbury-Derby-Ansonia local freight with an SW1500 that covered the lower Valley until so little industry remained that that too disappeared.
 #1440936  by Ruzbasan
 
Noel and Tom,
This is a list I compiled from forum posts and photos of locomotives on the Naugatuck Line (and the Highland to Plainville) from 1969-1995:

Penn Central (1969-1976): RS-3, RS-3M, RS-11, GP9, U-25B, U-33B, GP38, S-1, SW-1200, RDC-1
Conrail (1976-1982): RS-3M, GP9, GP15-1, SW-1500
Boston & Maine (1982-1987): GP9, GP18, GP38-2, GP40-2
Guilford (1987-1995): GP38-2, GP40

I end at 1995 because that is when freight service ended to my home town, Torrington.

Did I leave out any locomotive type that was used on the Naugatuck Line and up to Plainville from 1969-1995? Is the list complete ?
Did the Boston & Maine use RS-3's on the Naugatuck Line or in Plainville?
 #1447960  by Ruzbasan
 
I did some further research, found more photos, and discovered some errors in my earlier post.

Here is my revised list of locomotives used on the Naugatuck Line (and on the Highland to Plainville) from 1969-1995:

Penn Central (1969-1976): Lower Naugatuck Line (Maybrook-Cedar Hill Freights): RS-3, U-25B, U25C, U33B, C425, GP40
Upper Naugatuck Line (including Highland to Plainville): RDC-1, RS-3, RS3M (Plainville only), RS-11, GP9, S3, SW1200 (Derby Switcher)

Conrail (1976-1982): RS3M (Plainville only), GP9, GP10, GP15-1, SW1500 (Derby Switcher), SW1, B23-7

Boston & Maine (1982-1987): GP9, GP18 (low nose), GP38-2, GP40, GP40-2

Guilford (1987-1995): GP18 (low nose), GP39-2, GP40

Almost all of the above I have verified by photos. I only need the following three photos to completely verify everything in the list:

-Penn Central RS3M (in Plainville)
-Penn Central SW1200 (as Derby Switcher)
-Penn Central RS3 (in Waterbury)

Does anyone have any other locomotives to add to this list?
Thanks for any assistance!
 #1450533  by Ruzbasan
 
After further research, I revised my list again. Here is my revised list of locomotives used on the Naugatuck Line (and on the Highland to Plainville) from 1969-1995:

Penn Central (1969-1976): Lower Naugatuck Line (Maybrook-Cedar Hill Freights): RS-3, U-25B, U25C, U33B, C425, GP40
Upper Naugatuck Line (including Highland to Plainville): RDC-1, RS-3, RS3M (Plainville only), RS-11, GP9, S3, SW1200 (Derby Switcher)

Conrail (1976-1982): RS3M (Plainville only), RS-11, GP9, GP10, GP15-1, GP30, SW1500 (Derby Switcher), SW1, B23-7

Boston & Maine (1982-1987): GP9, GP18 (low nose), GP38-2, GP40, GP40-2

Guilford (1987-1995): GP18 (low nose), GP38, GP39-2, GP40

Almost all of the above I have verified by photos. I only need the following two photos to completely verify everything in the list:

-Penn Central SW1200 (as Derby Switcher)
-Penn Central RS3 (in Waterbury)

Does anyone have any photos of a Penn Central RS3 or Penn Central SW1200 in Waterbury or on the Naugatuck line?
Thanks for any assistance!
 #1451155  by Engineer Spike
 
I didn’t see much of Naugatuck growing up, but lived in Plainville. I remember lots of RS3s, as well as EMD repowered. The Conrail era brought the GP15. I barely remember back to the mid 1970s. BM mostly used GP9, and 18. Sometimes a GP7 showed up, but they had small fuel capacity, due to being commuter power originally.

Under Guilford newer power showed up, as the old Geeps were retired. Most common were the GP38-2, and GP40-2. The ex Conrail GP40 was common too. D&H 7300 class GP38-2, and 7400 class GP39-2. The D&H 7600 class GP39-2 became BM 350 series. These were common after Amtrak added cab signals to the Springfield line. 350-3 had the gear. Other power could come as trailing units. The MEC GP38 was often in appearance too.

As to the CR and PC era, I’m sure that Plainville and Waterbury shared the same power pool. The shape of the old Alcos was distinctive, and I remember them well.
 #1467085  by NortheastTrainGuy1965
 
Not sure where to put this post.

I have memories of watching a train on Old Route 8 in the Burville section back in the late 60’s/early 70’s when I was a child which is impossible since passenger service stopped going north from Torrington in 1958 and freight service stopped in 1964.

My question is, Did freight trains possibly come dowwn Old Route 8 south from Winsted, maybe being served by the old east-west CNERR Line?

I might just be placing these train memories in the wrong location, but they are pretty vivid in my memory. A train moving freight during a Burville firemen’s Parade, firetrucks running their sirens, train engineer having fun blowing the horn for the children.

Just curios. I might just be imagining it or confusing it with a different location.
 #1467114  by Noel Weaver
 
Torrington - Winsted was abandoned in 1963, April I believe so you did not see any trains in Burrville after that. The MOW used a crane and gondola to remove the track during that year.
Noel Weaver
 #1467192  by NortheastTrainGuy1965
 
Thanks Noel. I must have confused a memory of a train I saw somewhere else on one of our long family Sunday drives. Also, someone mentioned I might have seen the scene in my memory on an old family film. I was under 10 years old so I probably just merged all the instances in my mind.it always confused me how I could remember something that could not have occurred based on the timeline of the discontinuation of train service.
 #1469395  by Engineer Spike
 
When did Connecticut take ownership of the line? Was it part of the final system plan for Conrail? Did state ownership have to do with the legislation which freed Conrail from commuter operations?
 #1469415  by TomNelligan
 
State ownership of the Naugatuck Valley trackage preceded Conrail by five years. New York and Connecticut purchased their respective sections of Woodlawn-New Haven and Connecticut bought the New Canaan, Danbury, and Waterbury branches from Penn Central effective January 1, 1971. (The Hudson and Harlem lines went to New York state under long term lease eighteen months later.) Conrail took over from PC as contract operator of the Grand Central-based lines in 1976. The Congressional edict that absolved Conrail of commuter obligations took effect at the end of 1982, which led to the beginning of Metro North on January 1, 1983.
 #1528788  by NortheastTrainGuy1965
 
I know this is a 1970’s thread but maybe someone can answer this question.

What was the typical length (# of cars) for a consist in thee 1940’s-1970’s era for branch lines on the NYNH&H?

Also, what type of rolling stock normally made up the consists?

I’m particularly interested in consists going North on the Naugatuck towards Winsted and going North on the House through North Canaan to Pittsfield.
 #1528794  by Ruzbasan
 
For the 1940's-1950's on the Naugatuck Branch from Waterbury to Winsted most freight consists were about 15-20 cars. About five cars would be coal gondolas and the rest would be boxcars.

As coal heating gave way to oil, by the 1960's the freight consists would have three or more oil tankers and the rest boxcars.

Same into the 1970's on the Naugy from Waterbury to Winsted.