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  • 72 Foot stainless steel passenger cars

  • General discussion about locomotives, rolling stock, and equipment
General discussion about locomotives, rolling stock, and equipment

Moderator: John_Perkowski

 #949056  by epspsy
 
Just wondering what railroads pre Amtrak used in regular service 72' passenger equipment
coaches, diners, commuter cars etc., and where if anywhere there are pictures of same.
EPS
 #949207  by John_Perkowski
 
The articulated cars of UP and CB&Q were shorter than 85 feet, but I would have to look at other early plans. The almost universal postwar length was 85 feet over buffers.
 #949707  by edbear
 
Right on the 85 foot exterior dimensions for most of the post World War II stainless steel cars from several major builders. It appears that various roads had various methods for defining their passenger equipment; some defined their cars by interior dimensions.
 #950262  by timz
 
Can anyone think of any post-1945 passenger car for any US RR that was less than, say 84 ft 6 inches over couplers?
 #950288  by Allen Hazen
 
To avoid irrelevancy, people answering timz's question should interpret it as meaning: post 1945 passenger car for any U.S. railroad OTHER THAN Talgo or Aerotrain or similar unconventional units, and railroad other than a mass transit system.
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Manufacturers of model railroad equipment sometimes practice "selective compression": there are HO models of stainless steel cars on the market that may scale to 72 feet, but I don't think they accurately portray any full-size prototype.
 #953528  by John_Perkowski
 
There are some 73 foot baggage cars, most I have found are built by P-S or ACF, so far no clear Budd units...
 #953836  by timz
 
Yeah, I should have made clear that by "passenger" car I meant a car that carried passengers, not any car that ran in passenger trains. SFe had lots of postwar baggage cars 73-74 ft over couplers.
 #1015744  by jhdeasy
 
timz wrote:Can anyone think of any post-1945 passenger car for any US RR that was less than, say 84 ft 6 inches over couplers?
One group that comes to mind is the US Army's hospital kitchen cars built by St. Louis Car Company. I admit this somewhat stretches the definition of passenger (Army personnel) as non-revenue passengers), but these cars are definitely categorized as passenger cars.

http://rrpicturearchives.net/showPictur ... id=1264117

http://digital.denverlibrary.org/cdm/si ... 2/id/67211

A good number of these cars ended up on Amtrak circa 1974, when they were used as baggage cars, HEP cars, or for stationary material storage.
 #1019436  by Desertdweller
 
This question has hung in my mind for some time now. It seems that there are cars that fit the description, but are longer than 72' but shorter than 84'6".
I finally found the reference. It is in Patrick Dorin's "Everywhere West, the Burlington Route".

On page 76 is a table of cars used in Zephyr trains. There were a series of coaches used in pool service that measured 80'2" over the buffers. These cars were stainless steel, corrugated Budd cars. These cars were not the short, articulated cars used in the early Zephyrs. They were built in 1940.

Two of these cars, "Silver Alchemy" and "Silver Castle" were rebuilt in the Burlington's shops into dome coaches. "Silver Alchemy" was appropriately transformed into "Silver Dome" in 1945. It was the first modern dome car. "Silver Castle" kept its name, and was converted in 1949. The cars kept their original length after conversion, 80'2".

"Silver Dome" was produced before the postwar flood of passenger cars arrived from the big carbuilders. These first two dome cars differed from later Budd products by having angled, flat glass window panels and longitudinal seating (facing the windows) under the dome. The flat glass domes bore a strong resemblance to those produced by Pullman-Standard.

I was fortunate enough to have ridden both these cars in "Twin Zephyr" service. In my opinion, the quality of materials and workmanship was every bit as good as the later factory-built cars.

So don't despair. There is a prototype for your "shorty" streamlined passenger cars, even shorty dome cars. I run some of these on my N-scale model railroad, and, to my eyes at least, they look just fine even mixed with standard length cars.

Since these "shorty" cars were produced by Budd, there is a good possibility that similar-sized cars were used by other railroads employing Budd equipment. You are on your own there.

Les
 #1038360  by Milwaukee_F40C
 
Lightweight construction 63' RPO and 73' Baggage cars were common from Budd, PS, and ACF.

Southern Pacific lightweight passenger trains like the Daylight had a variety of articulated and single unit cars with individual bodies shorter than 85'.

Rock Island also ordered a class of Budd coaches for the Rocket that were 80' rather than the more standard 85' length dimension for some reason.
 #1038698  by timz
 
Milwaukee_F40C wrote:Southern Pacific lightweight passenger trains like the Daylight had a variety of articulated and single unit cars with individual bodies shorter than 85'.
All built 1941 or earlier, except the postwar three-unit diner-lounge-etcs.
Milwaukee_F40C wrote:Rock Island also ordered a class of Budd coaches for the Rocket that were 80' rather than the more standard 85' length dimension for some reason.
Also prewar?
 #1040224  by John_Perkowski
 
timz,

One of my friends David Engle, who is now retired from being secretary of the Rock Island Technical Society. I will ask him, but on first blush, I believe all of RI's postwar equipment was stock dimension from P-S.

More later