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  • Cincinnati Union Terminal

  • Discussion related to Amtrak also known as the National Railroad Passenger Corp.
Discussion related to Amtrak also known as the National Railroad Passenger Corp.

Moderators: GirlOnTheTrain, mtuandrew, Tadman

 #1276251  by Station Aficionado
 
Unfortunately, it is not really fit for service anymore for much of anything beyond the current 3x/week service. The concourse was demolished when Amtrak left in 1972. There is only one track with one side platform left for passenger service. There is no way, absent a huge expenditure of funds to buy land from CSX or NS, to re-expand. Also, given the massive amount of freight traffic (and resulting congestion) on the west side of the station and on northward through Mill Creek Valley, it's very tough getting a passenger train in and out of their in any sort of timely fashion. While it's great that the building has been preserved (and I would love to see it become a truly active station again), the better course would likely be to build a new facility on the riverfront near downtown.
 #1276736  by gokeefe
 
Station Aficionado wrote:While it's great that the building has been preserved (and I would love to see it become a truly active station again), the better course would likely be to build a new facility on the riverfront near downtown.
Reading through the station history on the Cincinnati Museum Center website I am having a very hard time imaging the locals approving of anything else. They have spent some very substantial amounts of tax dollars to renovate and restore the station. The only logical outcome will be an eventual restoration of more passenger rail service. I certainly wouldn't exclude the possibility of other alternatives but I am having a hard time seeing a political equation develop where suddenly the residents of Hamilton County would spend grants or revenues elsewhere.

Here are some of the briefs from the website describing public investment:
In 1986, Hamilton County approved Issue 3, a $33 million bond levy, to support the conversion of Union Terminal into a museum facility, which was passed by county voters in May of 1986. The State of Ohio and the City of Cincinnati also contributed $8 million and $3 million respectively to support the project. In addition, more than 3,000 Cincinnati individuals, corporations, and foundations also contributed to the building’s renovation.
In 2004, Hamilton County residents again supported Union Terminal by passing a five year operating levy which helped to provide for the occupancy costs of Union Terminal and provided some funds for capital repairs. In 2009, Cincinnati Museum Center began Project One, a year-long restoration and stabilization of the Southwest wing of Union Terminal. This project, funded by public funds from the 2004 Levy and the State of Ohio, resulted in a comprehensive ground to roof restoration including structural, roof, and exterior masonry repairs, new windows and a new HVAC system, as well as the restoration of two historic spaces, the formal dining room and the three historic dining rooms used by train passengers and locals alike.
By the end of the project, both historic spaces had been brought back to their original splendor and the structural concerns had been addressed. This project has provided valuable insight into the cost and needs for a full restoration of Union Terminal. In 2009, Hamilton County residents approved an extension of the 2004 levy to continue to sustain Union Terminal.
All told they are probably in excess of $100,000,000 invested in the terminal at this point. In regards to the concourse I think that is a relatively small problem that is generally solvable. The real question is where are the funds going to come from to rebuild the route to Chicago but that is probably best discussed in the Ohio Regional Amtrak Service thread.
 #1305355  by gokeefe
 
Among a handful of overlooked results from the November election was the passage of a levy to preserve Cincinnati Union Terminal at a cost of approximately $172,000,000.

This extraordinary development will likely help support the movement to increase regional passenger rail service to Cincinnati.

From the Huffington Post.
Since it opened in 1933, Union Terminal has served as both a cultural hub for the city of Cincinnati and one of the most iconic Art Deco structures in the nation. Now, thanks to local citizens who voted "yes" on Issue 8, it will continue to fill both roles for generations to come.

Yesterday, voters in Cincinnati and throughout Hamilton County decided overwhelmingly (61% to 39%) in favor of Issue 8. The ballot measure will increase the sales tax in Hamilton County by one-quarter of one percent over a total of five years and raise nearly $172 million in revenue for the restoration of Union Terminal, making this one of the country's largest sales tax issues supporting a preservation project.

Roughly $40 million will also be raised for the project through state of Ohio capital grants, state and federal historic tax credits, and private funds.

"One of the reasons we advocated for the passage of Issue 8 is that it wouldn't be just left to taxpayers," says Jason Clement, the National Trust's director of community outreach. "The financial burden is not on any one single group, and by voting yes, tax payers are eager to see how Union Terminal can be a model for partnerships going forward."
 #1357677  by gokeefe
 
Renovation project continues to move forward. Budget is set at $213,000,000. Pretty impressive.

For more read this article from the Cincinnati Enquirer.
The project will replace the roof, windows, heating and air conditioning, and other deteriorating parts of the structure. The project does not include new exhibits or space, but Museum Center officials have said the work will spur new investment from donors and will make it possible to expand exhibits in the future.
Excellent to see the HVAC and mechanical included. I'm sure this will also help reduce operating costs as well.
 #1410116  by gokeefe
 
Work continues on the renovation. Published in October from the Cincinnati Enquirer:
It's been about four months since restoration began on Union Terminal, which opened in 1933 as a railroad station. The $212.7 million project, mostly funded by a voter-approved Hamilton County sales tax, focuses on replacing and repairing deteriorating parts of the Art Deco icon.

The effort marks the first full renovation of the Fellheimer & Wagner-designed building.

On Thursday, museum center staff and project leaders gave a behind-the-scenes look of the ongoing construction, slated to take place through October 2018.
 #1410118  by gokeefe
 
This article from the Cincinnati Business Courier has even more photos of the mechanical work that is being done at the station.
 #1411303  by gokeefe
 
It really is quite the epic facility. Hopefully someday it will have more train service. For now it is being incredibly well-preserved for a brighter future.
 #1445277  by gokeefe
 
Work continues on schedule for the $212 million renovation at Cincinnati Union Terminal ...
The work itself isn't exactly hard to spot.

Construction equipment buzzes on the plaza. Cranes hover above.

The results of all that effort at Union Terminal, however, won't all be as obvious.

That's because the restoration project focuses on replacing and repairing deteriorating parts of the Art Deco icon. Things like the heating and air conditioning. The roof, too.

But that doesn't mean there aren't already noticeable improvements at the home of the Cincinnati Museum Center.
 #1445309  by palmland
 
Thanks for posting. CUT is my favorite railroad terminal. In fact I just finished an HO scale model of it for our model railroad. We couldn't have done it without the help of the staff at the Museum Center that gave us access to the blueprints.

Hopefully Hunter Harrison will move his intermodal terminal elsewhere. A trench was dug under part of the terminal concourse to serve as a tail track for the facility. This effectively blocks any additional tracks for Amtrak to terminate/originate a train or cars there. Also under wishful thinking is an extension of the new Cincinnati streetcar line to the terminal. The terminal was originally designed for the streetcar to operate through the terminal (note there are 3 entrances on each side: buses, taxis, streetcars). Without easy transit downtown, it'll be hard to justify future state rail expansion there.

Fortunately we have Graham Clayton to thank for getting at least one train back into the terminal. Better than nothing but a far cry from the days when 7 railroads had many trains operating there. I was fortunate to have ridden trains there on all of them except NYC.
 #1445347  by Arlington
 
The WPA murals from CUT were moved from CVG Airport to the outside/side of the downtown arena near the end of 2016:
http://www.cincinnati-oh.gov/cityofcinc ... -new-home/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
 #1445368  by gokeefe
 
palmland wrote:Hopefully Hunter Harrison will move his intermodal terminal elsewhere. A trench was dug under part of the terminal concourse to serve as a tail track for the facility. This effectively blocks any additional tracks for Amtrak to terminate/originate a train or cars there. Also under wishful thinking is an extension of the new Cincinnati streetcar line to the terminal. The terminal was originally designed for the streetcar to operate through the terminal (note there are 3 entrances on each side: buses, taxis, streetcars). Without easy transit downtown, it'll be hard to justify future state rail expansion there.
I took a look at this on Google Maps ...

It would appear that the existing right of way which goes under the headhouse might have space for a second track. Additionally depending on what level passengers are coming from it seems to be that the trench probably would not get in the way of an elevated walkway over to a concourse (not that I think this will ever be necessary ...).
 #1445376  by palmland
 
gokeefe wrote:
palmland wrote:Hopefully Hunter Harrison will move his intermodal terminal elsewhere. A trench was dug under part of the terminal concourse to serve as a tail track for the facility. This effectively blocks any additional tracks for Amtrak to terminate/originate a train or cars there. Also under wishful thinking is an extension of the new Cincinnati streetcar line to the terminal. The terminal was originally designed for the streetcar to operate through the terminal (note there are 3 entrances on each side: buses, taxis, streetcars). Without easy transit downtown, it'll be hard to justify future state rail expansion there.
I took a look at this on Google Maps ...

It would appear that the existing right of way which goes under the headhouse might have space for a second track. Additionally depending on what level passengers are coming from it seems to be that the trench probably would not get in the way of an elevated walkway over to a concourse (not that I think this will ever be necessary ...).
You may be right but I'd still like to get CSX out of there.

Thanks for the link to the permanent home for the murals, Mr Arlington. That's a great solution, second only to rebuilding the concourse and reinstalling them there! In my model I scanned those murals from color photos in one of my CUT books. I then reduced to HO scale and printed them. If you look into the window (added in the model at the end of the concourse) you can see the many travelers, seating, and the murals on the wall.
 #1543498  by Jeff Smith
 
Staffing to return: Cincinnati.com/
Amtrak will bring back staff to Cincinnati Union Terminal. The national passenger train operator shut its ticket office in May 2018, according to transportation advocacy group All Aboard Ohio.

The Cardinal, a Chicago to Washington, D.C. train, stops overnight in Cincinnati six days each week. The train stops three nights each week to head west to Chicago via Indianapolis and stops three nights each week to travel east through Kentucky and West Virginia to Washington, D.C.
...
Cincinnati was the largest Amtrak-served city in the nation without station staff, according to an All Aboard Ohio release. Cincinnati was one of 15 cities to lose station staff in 2018, according to the release.
...