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  • Feds fault NJ Transit crew for fatal train mishap

  • Discussion related to New Jersey Transit rail and light rail operations.
Discussion related to New Jersey Transit rail and light rail operations.

Moderators: lensovet, Kaback9, nick11a

 #486563  by Jtgshu
 
Ry, you gotta at least give me credit, i have been spelling "the" correctly for a while (for the most part) - one thing at a time buddy, one thing at a time!!!

No, it wasn't me, but the engineer is a very good friend of mine, and a DAMN good engineer. He is a stickler for the rules, and if he said he didn't touch the switch and it was sealed in normal, I believe him.

However, it really could have been any one on any train at any time, and thats the scary part, just like the derailment of 3920 at Portal in 2003.......that could have been anywhere, at any time - hot box detector tripped or not.......

 #486569  by DutchRailnut
 
Again if the switch was in bypass for days should the Daily Mechanical inspection have not revealed that ???
If you operate the train in Bypass do you lose your light during station stops ??? cause if you keep the light when doors are being opened, would it not be engineers duty to report such to Mof E at turn around point or would it warrant calling Equipment desk ???
The more we talk about this the more I wonder what a sloppy operation were dealing with ???

 #486582  by Sirsonic
 
Well, as I have tried to point out in the past, yes it is entirely possible, and was normal, for bypass switches to be unsealed, or sealed in the bypass position for days or even weeks at a time. The locomotive would receive a daily inspection each day, and each day the mechanical forces would observe the condition of the switch and sign off the inspection anyway (on those days that they actually inspected the equipment and didnt just sign the card). If the seal was missing, either it would be left missing or it would be replaced and the doors would be, again, sealed in bypass.

If the bypass switch is in bypass it will only allow the engine to take power while the doors are open. It will not affect in any way the operation of the door light. So if the switch is in bypass, and the crew is closing all the doors before giving a signal to proceed, the engineer would not notice anything wrong with the operation of the doors. This is provided the door light was not burned out as many of them can be.

 #486589  by DutchRailnut
 
Maybe its time for Door Bypass to be wired like on SLE.
When changing ends the door bypass relay drops out and engineer has to hit a momentary switch to activate it, it goes back to normal again when engineer keys out of that control stand.
Or when engine is cut out.

To activate Door bypass on MNCR we must obtain permission from RTC(dispatcher) and must note the event on defect card and to MofE at final terminal.

 #486652  by thebigc
 
Asbury Park Press:

http://www.app.com/apps/pbcs.dll/articl ... 8801010334

By Larry Higgs • STAFF WRITER • January 1, 2008

The train that dragged John D'Agostino to his death on Nov. 21, 2006, in Bradley Beach had a defect that NJ Transit employees had reported three times in the four days before the fatal accident, according to a federal report about the accident.

The defect involved an indicator light in the locomotive, which would have told the crew that one of the doors on the train was still open. D'Agostino, 49, a native of Neptune, was pinned when a train door closed on him as he was getting off the train in Bradley Beach. The door failed to re-open, and he was dragged to his death.

In the December Federal Railroad Administration report about the accident is a listing of three incidents in which the PCS (Pneumatic Control System) indicator light in locomotive No. 4116 operated normally when the train stopped at stations with high-level platforms on the North Jersey Coast Line, but didn't work when it stopped at stations with low-level platforms.

Information downloaded from the locomotive's event recorder, which is like the black box in an airliner, showed that on the morning of the accident, the light worked normally in stations with high-level platforms, such as Red Bank and Asbury Park, but stopped functioning at stations with low platforms, such as Little Silver, Allenhurst and Bradley Beach, according to the report.

The report also shows that the problem was reported to NJ Transit once on Nov. 17 by train crews and twice more on Nov. 20.

NJ Transit and FRA officials blamed the accident on the crew, and accused the engineer of operating the train with a bypass switch on, which would have allowed the locomotive to draw power to move even if a door were open.

In an interview with the FRA, according to the report, the engineer denied moving the bypass switch out of its normal position.

If the PCS light was off when the bypass switch was in its normal position, the light would indicate an open door on the train and the locomotive would not receive power to move the train, said Patrick Reilly, general chairman of United Transportation Union Local 60, which represents NJ Transit assistant conductors and conductors.

Reilly is a former inspector and accident investigator with the FRA and National Surface Transportation Board. He brought concerns about the train doors and safety equipment to NJ Transit's board of trustees last July.

"Something was wrong with that equipment. The FRA and the carrier (NJ Transit) came to the conclusion that the doors were in bypass, but there was an electrical problem," Reilly said. "That train should have never gone out."

Had the light functioned the way it should have, with the bypass switch in normal position, the light would have gone off, meaning a door was still open, and the train wouldn't have been able to move, he said.

Unlike a check engine light in a car, which comes on to indicate a problem, the PCS light instead lights up when the train doors are closed and turns off when they are open, Reilly said. When the light is off, and a door is open, the locomotive can't take power to move, if it is functioning properly, he said.

"It was reported three times (prior to the accident)," Reilly said. "The (bypass) switch was in the normal mode and there was some kind of malfunction when the train was in low-level (station) mode. It was not working as intended."

According to the FRA report, on Nov. 17, the locomotive and rail cars were used on train No. 2348 to Hoboken, and on the return trip to Dover, the report said, there was "no PCS at high or low platforms."

That same day, when the locomotive and cars were used on train No. 2311 west, there was "no PCS at low-level platforms," the report said.

On Nov. 20, the locomotive and rail cars were used on train No. 2311 on the Coast Line and "no PCS at low platforms" was again reported, the FRA report said. The train set ran east to Long Branch as train No. 4388 and "no low-level PCS" was reported.

The locomotive and cars returned to Bay Head and then were sent to Long Branch, and then to East Matawan to rescue passengers on a train that struck a woman.

D'Agostino was riding on that train.

"Once an engineer reports a problem (with equipment) it has to be addressed or corrected," Reilly said. "Nothing shows it was addressed."

NJ Transit officials declined to comment, because information about the PCS light problem with the train set being reported prior to the accident was not in the copy of the report the agency received from the FRA.

"It's not something we've seen," said Dan Stessel, NJ Transit spokesman.

FRA officials said in an e-mail Monday that they don't consider that defect to mean there is a larger problem with equipment.

"FRA did not and does not consider this to be an indication of a larger or systemic mechanical problem, since the equipment was in end door bypass position for several days prior to the fatality as evidenced by the locomotive event recorder," said Warren Flateau, FRA spokesman.

He said that by design, the PCS light will not illuminate when the end doors are open, the end door bypass switch is on and the train is stopping at a station with a low platform.

The PCS light will illuminate when the center doors, which are used for high-level platforms, are open unless the center door bypass switch is in the bypass position, Flateau said. Only the end door bypass switch was in the bypass position, while the center door bypass switch was in the normal position, he said.

However, Reilly said that the bypass switch was put in the bypass position when a different crew moved the locomotive and cars from Spring Lake to Bay Head after the accident on the morning of Nov. 21.

 #486671  by ryanov
 
Same article from page 3. :P

 #486726  by nick11a
 
Dutch, you are going onto irrelevant conversation.... no where does the articles say that the engineer tampered with the safety device. So, in actuality, most likely based on the information at hand, the engineer did nothing wrong.... and got fired.

 #486732  by DutchRailnut
 
Nick he had to have a rules violation to get fired, or he would have been reinstated by now.
Just because nobody is mentioning what rule it is does not mean he did not violate one.
But for Company to fire him they had to give a reason.

 #486738  by nick11a
 
DutchRailnut wrote:Nick he had to have a rules violation to get fired, or he would have been reinstated by now.
Just because nobody is mentioning what rule it is does not mean he did not violate one.
But for Company to fire him they had to give a reason.
Granted... and there are things that were kept from the press such as the exact reasons why they fired him. But, based on what I've read in those articles, one has to question the circumstances and wonder how valid of a reason it was... and how much of it was based on evidence or not. And we'll probably never know.

 #486756  by Zeke
 
There is a huge flaw in the system as presently implemented and that is the inability of the rear brakeman to visually observe the platform as the train departs a station. When this feature was deleted from the door control system under the present operating practice it was only a matter of time before a dragging incident would result in a fatality. All of the trainmen who post here and worked under the old system could tell us how many times they caught a dragging incident while they observed the platform and stopped their train before it could devolve into something terrible. The public is ignorant of the harm that can befall them in a heartbeat when they do something stupid or unthinking, and lets face they aint smartening up anytime soon. I believe it is time to revisit the present system and install some type of local end door overide so the platform can be observed unobstructed by the rear brakeman because in my opinion its just a matter of time before we have another one of these nightmare scenarios.

 #486760  by geoffand
 
Zeke wrote: I believe it is time to revisit the present system and install some type of local end door overide so the platform can be observed unobstructed by the rear brakeman because in my opinion its just a matter of time before we have another one of these nightmare scenarios.
Why spend all that money when NJT can just pass blame on to the crew? :(

 #486763  by hockeyman
 
From an outsider's perspective, there is another option (albeit it would be a little time consuming), but on a train with a defect that can not readily fixed (ie: door light problem); would it not be possible for the rear brake to observe and close all doors except for his, so that he may do walk down on platform and perform a visual inspection of said defect; then close his door to let the train go on its way?

 #486769  by Grump
 
Before going into bypass and moving the crew should do a visual inspection of the doors. This isn't limited to just the rear brake but also the ticket collectors and conductor too. Crew members and be aware to the fact that the train is in bypass and pay extra attention to doors during the trip.
If you're ever on the train and hear the conductor say on the PA, "Crew check your doors" and then the crew members throughout the train will check the doors and usually say something back like, "5 and 6 are good", etc etc etc, this is ensuring that all doors are closed before going into bypass and movement begins....

Getting back to the issue of this thread...
The main thats been mentioned many times is the fact that if you're ever standing at a door in the vestibule, even if you smush your face up against the glass, your range of vision down the platform is next to none. You can't even see the center door. You can't see jack $h!t from the closed door.
And theres no way that the rearbrake would be able to see someone stuck in the door in the front of the car....

 #486817  by Jtgshu
 
Amen Zeke, Amen........I can think of several near dragging incidents that I was able to prevent because I was in the door, with it open, of a Comet 2 (before rebuild) or a MU. And no, people haven't gotten any smarter over the course of time............shocking info, i know!!!

Going on what Grump posted, MOST of the Comet 3 cars have VERY dark tinted windows. So dark that its damn near impossible to see anything outside of them, especially in the dark. And the car that the man was dragged on was a Comet 3 - 5514 or 15, I don't remember which.

 #486833  by hs3730
 
Until I read this thread I honestly thought it was standard practice for one of the crew of any passenger train to leave his/her door open and watch the platform as the train began moving to make sure nothing was dragged, falling out, etc, platform height irrelevant. NJT crews still do this with their Comet I consists, and I have seen Amtrak do this, as well. LIRR/MNRR MUs (and the LIRR bilevels) all have openable windows by the door control panels, which I had assumed was for this purpose.

It's probably uncomfortable but at least with Arrows, every other vestibule will have a window that opens. Perhaps retrofits should be considered on the Comets, if it is such a no-no to run in bypass at all times to allow a crewmember to watch the platform while departing. Even that seems preferable, as I'd trust a pair of eyes over a little indication light any day while en/detraining.