Railroad Forums 

  • RVL Whitehouse Passing Siding Progress

  • Discussion related to New Jersey Transit rail and light rail operations.
Discussion related to New Jersey Transit rail and light rail operations.

Moderators: lensovet, Kaback9, nick11a

 #432242  by ajt
 
Wanderer wrote: The problem last time was just that they failed to consult Conrail when they made the changes/additions. Obviously that didn't go over well, and rightfully so. I've heard the rumor about the creation of Raritan-High Bridge trains also, but I wouldn't say die for changes for service over Conrail, as long as everybody is on the same page this time.
The word is they did check with CR, but CR had not checked with CSX and NS.

 #432304  by nick11a
 
Well, if that rumor is true, worse comes to worse, NJT can look into expanding the some trains they do have already to High Bridge which wouldn't affect CR. But, I'm optimistic they'll find some kind of solution.

 #432362  by Jtgshu
 
ajt wrote:
Wanderer wrote: The problem last time was just that they failed to consult Conrail when they made the changes/additions. Obviously that didn't go over well, and rightfully so. I've heard the rumor about the creation of Raritan-High Bridge trains also, but I wouldn't say die for changes for service over Conrail, as long as everybody is on the same page this time.
The word is they did check with CR, but CR had not checked with CSX and NS.
I remember hearing that as well - CR didn't have a problem with it, but just like a week or two before the schedule change, word got to NS and CSX and they were like WHOOOOOOOOOOOA NELLY!!!!!! and then the scheduled has to be pulled and changed back to what they were.

NJT could extend its existing trains up to High Bridge, and Conrail/NS/CSX would have no say, but it might screw with the schedules and crews of eastbound (and westbound) trains, which would be effected by CR because they would run on the line on the Lehigh Line at different times, etc.

 #432373  by Wanderer
 
So noted. However, the possibility still can't be ruled out. If everyone got on the same page, some type of changes may still be possible. Whether or not it will ever happen is an unknown.

 #432450  by nick11a
 
The left hand doesn't know what the right hand is doing, heh? :-)

 #432881  by Rail Boy
 
I thought from Aldeen to NK was Conrail controlled. Why would permission be needed from CSX or NS?

 #432884  by Zeke
 
CSAO and its CEO Mr. Ron Batory answer to the owners, CSX and NS. I understand there will be a substantial push for new business once the double track segment is debugged and placed in service. They are still gun-shy about increased NJT service. It is a performance-based contract; if they delay too many passenger trains, they get a reduced payment from NJT. I guess they feel if they cannot realistically handle the new NJT service, at least they are up front about it and do not have to deflect political pressure from the state if a service meltdown unfolded, basic RR CYA.

Look for the third track option in the not to distant future. NJT is running about 62-65 movements per 24 hours on the Lehigh and I guess CSX/NS are good for 40-50 on a busy day. Over 100 trains per 24 hours plus two commuter stations makes for a jumping five miles of double-track railroad.

 #432911  by blockline4180
 
Zeke wrote:Look for the third track option in the not to distant future. NJT is running about 62-65 movements per 24 hours on the Lehigh and I guess CSX/NS are good for 40-50 on a busy day. Over 100 trains per 24 hours plus two commuter stations makes for a jumping five miles of double-track railroad.
Yes, it would be nice for a third track between Aldene and NK, but do they have enough room between the two stations…it would seem rather tricky in some spots. Have there ever been three tracks through that stretch?

And yes, it would be nice if CSX/NS pushed for new business once the second track is in service between Potter and Bound Brook. What I would like to see is the following:
  1. NS 20A extended to NJ
  2. NS 20T extended to NJ
  3. Possibly new SI dedicated trains (I know V.V.V says it won't happen)
  4. A through CSX Coal train
And then of course NS grand plan to push thirty-plus new trains through by 2013…

 #432926  by wolfboy8171981
 
I had the new schedule in my hand two weeks before it was to be effected. The fact was that the PM rush left almost no room for any freight movements from 5:00 pm to 6:30 pm in either direction. That's what killed the schedule; it was just very ambiguous. We will work with NJT, but to simply give our main line over to them for an hour and a half while van trains like 25K, 191, 190 and 174 sit is unacceptable to NS and CSX; and after all, those are our parents and they have the last say. That said, I was ready to move those new trains, and in fact was told the day before that the schedule was not going to be in effect. I do believe that NS and CSX told NJT if they want more trains, they need to pony up for the third track, even though that "new" track to be built would most likely be freight-only.

When the double-track project is complete, I don't think you're going to get more trains overnight. The fact of the matter is that you only added ten miles of double track; the railroad still brings you to two single-track main lines. Until NS and CSX make improvements to their single-track mains (NS' main is better than CSX's), there will still be gridlock on Conrail.

Regarding Staten Island: Eventually, there should be a new van train to/from Staten Island on CSX, but for the River Line (West Shore). The NYC Department of Sanitation has been busier than they originally anticipated. My opinion is that there should be a unit train started for this operation, but it's just not busy enough for this yet.

 #432970  by nick11a
 
It's understandable. So, the ball is in NJT's court to come up with a solution. Meanwhile, they're biding their time by not rushing the signal and wire installation.

 #433072  by Wanderer
 
wolfboy8171981 wrote:Regarding Staten Island: Eventually, there should be a new van train to/from Staten Island on CSX, but for the River Line (West Shore). The NYC Department of Sanitation has been busier than they originally anticipated. My opinion is that there should be a unit train started for this operation, but it's just not busy enough for this yet.
It is definitely on it's way to that point, however. I have actually been keeping track of the traffic, as it passes here. For the last two weeks, the DSE traffic has been making up at least 35% or better of Q300/Q301's train. It's starting to outnumber the EPIC traffic...which as anyone who's been close enough knows...is not something to complain about. :P

Sorry...back to topic here...

 #433367  by nick11a
 
Geez, way off track :-)

Zeke does have a point. Between Newark and Aldene, that is some busy RR.

 #433389  by Zeke
 
I think the passing siding is on the back burner for now, although we could still use it during the evening rush when delays put more than one train up the mountain.

Regarding Conrail, I would look for a third track from Townley east to High interlocking. The Meeker Avenue bridge at NK is due for replacement; a third track will be added. A jumpover alongside the existing Conrail bridge over Amtrak with the span connecting to Amtrak's eastward No. 1 track will negate crossing the whole railroad for eastbound RVL trains. After these improvements are instituted, and they are coming soon, the service increase will keep Wolfie on his toes.

Yes; there was a third track between Hillside and NK when I qualified on the old LV in June of 1976. Old track 4 right alongside eastward No. 2 speed limit of 10 mph. It was ripped out around 1979 (?) Back in the 50s I was told they had four tracks between Hillside and NK.

 #433390  by finsuburbia
 
Zeke,

Do you have inside information about this or are you just speculating?

 #433405  by blockline4180
 
finsuburbia wrote:Zeke,

Do you have inside information about this or are you just speculating?

I'm sure he is just speculating about the increase freight traffic, but then again you never know... If the freight traffic continues to increase in this country as a whole then its pretty inevitable that there will be more trains on this stretch of track... That is if the economy doesnt suddenly go in the tank or a recession similar to 1987-88/1990 stock market drop occurs...
  • 1
  • 6
  • 7
  • 8
  • 9
  • 10
  • 16