Discussion relating to the past and present operations of the NYC Subway, PATH, and Staten Island Railway (SIRT).

Moderator: GirlOnTheTrain

  by Jeff Smith
 
This may not belong here as it is not related to passenger rail, but it is rail related.

http://www.progressiverailroading.com/p ... p?id=21594
PANYNJ also announced it recently completed two major components of the $600 million ExpressRail project. The authority built a second lead track to the ExpressRail Elizabeth intermodal facility to enable trains to arrive and depart simultaneously, and constructed a rail support facility along Corbin Street that can handle four 10,000-foot trains daily.
So why can't PANYNJ do something like this on the New York side of the river, where there is a need more freight rail? Or, God forbid, actually build the freight tunnel that was their ORIGINAL PURPOSE? Or provide some infrastructure money to allow freight to run on the (admittedly) very busy NEC/MNRR lines?

Or, heaven forbid, build a useful connection to LGA? No, all the money goes to Joisey.

Otto, feel free to move where appropriate.

Methinks America's Mayor Rudy was right about the PA.
  by JCGUY
 
NYC needs better truck routes not freight rail. There is no warehouse complex of the sort you currently see in central jersey to support massive loading and unloading operations in NYC and there never will be. Having a cross harbor truck tunnel would make enormous sense, as would a cross sound truck link bypassing Queens and the Bronx, plus these projects could also facilitate the movement of passenger cars and buses.

"So why can't PANYNJ do something like this on the New York side of the river"

You are describing a rail line terminating at a container port. There is no analog to such container port of any consequence on the NYC side.

"Or provide some infrastructure money to allow freight to run on the (admittedly) very busy NEC/MNRR lines?"

That would go over like a lead balloon on this board.

"Or, heaven forbid, build a useful connection to LGA?"

No objection there. An extension of the yellow trains would be fine by me, although I imagine that retrofitting LGA to make the system fit would be a bear of a job.
  by Tom V
 
Sarge wrote:This may not belong here as it is not related to passenger rail, but it is rail related.

http://www.progressiverailroading.com/p ... p?id=21594
PANYNJ also announced it recently completed two major components of the $600 million ExpressRail project. The authority built a second lead track to the ExpressRail Elizabeth intermodal facility to enable trains to arrive and depart simultaneously, and constructed a rail support facility along Corbin Street that can handle four 10,000-foot trains daily.
So why can't PANYNJ do something like this on the New York side of the river, where there is a need more freight rail? Or, God forbid, actually build the freight tunnel that was their ORIGINAL PURPOSE? Or provide some infrastructure money to allow freight to run on the (admittedly) very busy NEC/MNRR lines?

Or, heaven forbid, build a useful connection to LGA? No, all the money goes to Joisey.

Otto, feel free to move where appropriate.

Methinks America's Mayor Rudy was right about the PA.
Wow your so misguided I don't know where to begin...

The Port Authority is investing tons into Howland Hook on Staten Island, they just rebuilt the rail bridge to New Jersey a fews years ago and now have a large container port operation complete with a new pier side rail link. They also rebuilt the ROW all the way down the West Shore to the trash transfer station. Container operations will never happen in Brooklyn, not enough room. They are being done in New Jersey and Staten Island, and yes Staten Island is part of the City of New York. So I don't get where New York City is getting short changed by the Port Authority, go check out Howland Hook. The place is humming with activity. Also as part of their Redevelopment of the Container Port on Howland Hook the Port Authority is also going to replace the Goethals Bridge, that's a $3 Billion dollar project in order to better serve the Port and Staten Island residents.

http://www.goethalseis.com/overview/study_area.aspx

And with regards to the airports, while LGA might have gotten the shaft over the past 10-20 years JFK is the airport that is receiving the most investment from the Port Authority. Probably to the tune of $10-15 Billion more than EWR, 4 of JFK's Terminals have been completely demolished and rebuilt over the past ten years. Not one Terminal at EWR has been replaced, although CO's Terminal C was expanded and renovated. Then there's the Airtrains, EWR's Airtrain cost $600 MIllion total, JFK's cost nearly $3 Billion. ALso within the last two years the Port Authority purchased another airport, Stewart airport in Orange County New York.

So could you please provide and example of where New Jersey has received preferential treatment from the Port Authority over the past 10 years?.. Because to me it's the other way around, and I'm not including the Tens of Billions the Port Authority is putting into rebuilding the World Trade Center, which has absolutely nothing to do with their mission of creating and maintaining transportation infrastructure in the NYC/NJ region. Same with tele-port on Staten Island, nothing to do with transportation.
  by OportRailfan
 
Tom V wrote: And with regards to the airports, while LGA might have gotten the shaft over the past 10-20 years JFK is the airport that is receiving the most investment from the Port Authority. Probably to the tune of $10-15 Billion more than EWR, 4 of JFK's Terminals have been completely demolished and rebuilt over the past ten years. Not one Terminal at EWR has been replaced, although CO's Terminal C was expanded and renovated. Then there's the Airtrains, EWR's Airtrain cost $600 MIllion total, JFK's cost nearly $3 Billion. ALso within the last two years the Port Authority purchased another airport, Stewart airport in Orange County New York.

So could you please provide and example of where New Jersey has received preferential treatment from the Port Authority over the past 10 years?.. Because to me it's the other way around, and I'm not including the Tens of Billions the Port Authority is putting into rebuilding the World Trade Center, which has absolutely nothing to do with their mission of creating and maintaining transportation infrastructure in the NYC/NJ region. Same with tele-port on Staten Island, nothing to do with transportation.
Just so you know, Continental paid for their own renovations I believe. Terminal B is undergoing a huge face-lift as it is currently getting an expansion built. All of terminal B will be rebuilt, and later Terminal A. Right now B just opened a new lower levels arrival area on the ground level and contracts for the old mid-levels arrivals to be demolished/rebuilt are already out for bid.

AAAANNNDDDDD for those that think NYC is getting shortchanged, the PA scrapped their trainee program this fall, due to budget constraints from what I expect. I also anticipate a large portion of their new contracts to be put on hold for a while while the bulk of their money is thrown at WTC. It's very bad publicity for them and they want to finish it ASAP.
  by Jeff Smith
 
Wow your so misguided I don't know where to begin...
I don't think so, but you're (by the way, that's the correct spelling of the contraction "you are") entitled to your (the correct usage of the possessive pronoun) opinion. I may be mistaken, but I am not misguided, nor do you know me well enough to make such a statement.

So the Port Authority is spending a lot of money on a SI port. Wow. Don't get me wrong; SI has been the neglected step-child of NYC for far too long, and I'm glad to see the investment there. However, all of that investment goes towards connections with NEW JERSEY. Replace the Goethals Bridge? As with their belated investment in SI, I say "finally!" and "about time!". But again, does the Goethals connect SI with NY proper in any way?

I don't expect operations in Brooklyn to ever recover to what they were; there are obvious constraints. The same with the west side of Manhattan. But there must be something that could be done. As for freight rail in the northeast, there used to be a substantial amount, and it is not rush hour every day all day, so I don't think it would go over like a "lead balloon" (quoting a different poster).

LGA has gotten the shaft for only the last 10 or 20 years? And you claim JFK is getting tons of investment? Please. How much does the PA reap from those two airports? The LEAST they could have done was the Airtrain, and that's HALF a solution (to Jamaica only). Building, renovating, and replacing terminals is part of their responsibility. Stewart Airport? WOW! You crack me up. That nothing airport on the WEST side of the Hudson? Will they fund a HSR link to it? Doubtful. I think that's a boondoggle.

I won't even touch the WTC argument; you can make too many arguments on all sides, and it's way too emotional. But I do find your restricting your argument to just the last ten years very interesting and informative. Why restrict it to just 10 years?
  by Tom V
 
Sarge wrote:I don't think so, but you're (by the way, that's the correct spelling of the contraction "you are") entitled to your (the correct usage of the possessive pronoun) opinion. I may be mistaken, but I am not misguided, nor do you know me well enough to make such a statement.
Are you the internet police or something, why don't you stick to the content being discussed and don't look for imperfections in the manner of it's delivery.
Sarge wrote:So the Port Authority is spending a lot of money on a SI port. Wow. Don't get me wrong; SI has been the neglected step-child of NYC for far too long, and I'm glad to see the investment there. However, all of that investment goes towards connections with NEW JERSEY. Replace the Goethals Bridge? As with their belated investment in SI, I say "finally!" and "about time!". But again, does the Goethals connect SI with NY proper in any way?
The Port Authority's mission is to facilitate and maintain transportation infrastructure between New York and New Jersey, they are not responsible for intra State commerce in New York rather inter state between New York and New Jersey. The MTA/Tri-Borough bridge/NY State DOT are responsible for building and maintaining infrastructure within the state of New York.
Sarge wrote:LGA has gotten the shaft for only the last 10 or 20 years? And you claim JFK is getting tons of investment? Please. How much does the PA reap from those two airports?
With the same argument how much revenues do the Port Authority generate from Newark Airport, Teterboro airport, New Jersey commuters paying tolls, Port Newark/Elizabeth etc..

Again JFK has seen a tremendous amount of investment over the past 10 years from the Port Authority:

New American airlines terminal replacing T-8/T-9, $1.1 Billion
New IAB Terminal 4 ($800 million)
New Terminal One ($500 Million)
New Terminal 5 (Jetblue terminal) ($800 MIllion)
Several new parking garages
JFK Airtrain ($3 Billion)

At EWR Terminal C received a $800 MIllion dollar remodeling, and Terminal B is receiving a $350 MIllion refurbishment.
  by Jeff Smith
 
Why yes, yes indeed, I AM THE INTERNET POLICE. Please wait by your PC Jr, an officer will be coming to confiscate your two 5 1/4 disks momentarily. By the way, if you're going to attack me as "misguided" I am going to attack you as illiterate.

I am fully aware of the PA's mission (the one I originally mentioned, the original purpose, a cross-harbor tunnel, has yet to be completed after what, a century?). I was not the one who brought up the SI projects; you were. I was rebutting their usefulness to NYS as a whole, not to SI in particular, nor was I rebutting their cross-jurisdictional purpose. I'm glad SI is getting the projects. The stuff arriving at SI still ends up going via NJ, right? And the stuff being shipped from SI still has to get their, right? My point is this money is being spent West of Hudson.

You can selectively edit my original quotes all you want to make your point and quote your figures; you were the one that originally brought up the points. LGA has been neglected for much more than 10 years, and quoting a bunch of projects and an airport upstate don't help your argument. JFK was neglected until only recently. Run a freight tunnel from SI to Brooklyn, and that will accomplish something for NYS as a whole and get trucks off of the interstate crossings.