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Discussion relating to the past and present operations of the NYC Subway, PATH, and Staten Island Railway (SIRT).

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 #303968  by Terrapin Station
 
I'm quoted in it!

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http://www.nytimes.com/2006/10/08/nyreg ... ref=slogin

October 8, 2006
New York Up Close
For the City’s Choo-Choo Charlies, the Shade Is Slowly Drawn
By ALEX MINDLIN

RACHAEL LAMBERT, a 24-year-old office worker and part-time student from Howard Beach, Queens, took a practiced stance on Tuesday at the head of a J train that was clattering eastward across the Williamsburg Bridge into Brooklyn. Peering out the scratched window at the front of the train, she offered in her slight Midwestern twang a running commentary on the view.

“You see the green-yellow?” she said, pointing to a pair of signal lights beside the elevated tracks. “We’re going, but we’re being diverted to the middle track.”

A few minutes later, the train reached one of Ms. Lambert’s favorite spots, near the Myrtle Avenue station, where the M line veers northward across the J line, and in doing so crosses a spaghetti-like tangle of rails.

“It’s great in winter,” she said. “When they’re afraid the switches are going to freeze, there are little pilot lights on them, and they light them, and it looks like the tracks are on fire.”

But Ms. Lambert’s is a dying pastime. Over the last few decades, and with increasing speed, the Metropolitan Transportation Authority has been phasing out cars with publicly accessible windows in front, a feature that is often called the rail-fan window because of its appeal to subway buffs. In 2000, nearly half of all cars had such windows, according to Charles Seaton, a spokesman for New York City Transit. This year, they appear in only about one-fifth of the fleet’s roughly 6,200 cars.

And over the next decade, rail-fan windows will probably disappear entirely. A new model of car that lacks the rail-fan window is currently being tested on the A and N lines; the city has ordered 660 of the cars, set to arrive in 2008, and has an option to buy an additional 900 or so.

In these newer cars, the train operator’s cabin takes up the entire width of the cab, essentially blocking the tracks from public view. The redesigned cabs are more comfortable, and let conductors open doors on both sides of the train without walking from car to car. But subway buffs complain that the new cars are much less fun.

“It’s awful,” said Brian Weinberg, the owner of railfanwindow.com, a Web site featuring pictures of New York subway cars. “It’s totally going to remove a whole aspect of the subway.” And on Rider Diaries, an Internet message board for New York public transport fans, a user who identified himself as MikeGerald45 wrote: “It was a lot of fun just watching the ride from the front window of the train. Now, that will be something that we can tell our grandchildren about.”

Indeed, it is the young who seem to love the rail-fan window the most. “I don’t like to hog the window so much,” Ms. Lambert said, “because a lot of times little kids get on, and the first thing they do is run to the window.”

Ms. Lambert recommends a sideways stance anyway, for safety. During her first months in New York in 2001, she sometimes spent two hours a day riding the subway just for pleasure, she said. But she learned not to brace herself against the window with her arms. “If I try to hold on,” she explained, “I usually bang my face into the glass.”

Larry Furlong, a spokesman for the Electric Railroaders Association, a group of train enthusiasts, had a different strategy for rail-fan posture when he was a boy in Astoria, Queens.

“I was a member of the flat-nose society,” Mr. Furlong said. “At Christmastime my father would take us into Radio City Music Hall to see the show. You would stand at the front window, and you would press your nose against the glass. At the beginning, my father would have to hold me, and eventually I got tall enough.”

In a sign of the strong appeal of the rail-fan window, even Mr. Seaton, the New York City Transit spokesman, has fond memories of it. “I especially liked the ones that opened,” he said.

Will he miss the windows when they are gone? “No,” Mr. Seaton said, “because I’m not 10 years old anymore.”

 #304093  by AJ
 
I read that in yesterday's NY Times.

 #304133  by pennsy
 
Hi All,

The practice appears to be common. Metrolink Cab cars have Railfan windows, but the area is roped off and no passengers are allowed in the area. Might just as well paint over the railfan windows.

 #304255  by Terrapin Station
 
AJ wrote:I read that in yesterday's NY Times.
Yep, October 8, 2006.

 #304470  by RearOfSignal
 
It is certainlly a sad fact that much of the equipment with railfan-windows are being taken out of service. When I was a kid, I always ran to the front of the train to see out the window. Even now I'll wait for a R32 C train to pull into the station, even if it is a local, instead of taking the express A R46 just to look out the front window. The R142s have the window on the cab door which you can see through, but since it is moved back from the front of the car the angle to view is narrow, plus the window is tinted which makes it hard to see in the tunnels. The R62s also have a really small window to see through but since its so high on the cab door it makes it hard to see through, especially if you're not very tall. I guess its better than nothing!

 #304682  by Terrapin Station
 
rcervel wrote:It is certainlly a sad fact that much of the equipment with railfan-windows are being taken out of service. When I was a kid, I always ran to the front of the train to see out the window. Even now I'll wait for a R32 C train to pull into the station, even if it is a local, instead of taking the express A R46 just to look out the front window. The R142s have the window on the cab door which you can see through, but since it is moved back from the front of the car the angle to view is narrow, plus the window is tinted which makes it hard to see in the tunnels. The R62s also have a really small window to see through but since its so high on the cab door it makes it hard to see through, especially if you're not very tall. I guess its better than nothing!
The R-62/A fleet has the only worthwhile railfan view of the R-44 and up fleets. And select R-62A singles are the only cars with real railfan windows. The rest have drunken view that are worthless underground and barely adequate aboveground. The end of subwayfanning in NYC is immanent :(

 #304703  by Fred Rabin
 
When I was a kid growing up Boston, one of the subway lines had cars with head end doors that, in the summer, opened completely and were locked by a full-length grate. It was fun to stand there and have the cool air blowing through you when the train was running through the tunnels. Those cars went out of service in the mid-50s.

 #304989  by Lucius Kwok
 
SEPTA's new M-4 subway cars have railfan windows.
 #305166  by Head-end View
 
I've been standing at the front window since I was 11 years old, which was 44 years ago. I like it as much or more today than back then. It will be a very, very sad day in New York when all the cars with corner-cabs are gone. At least the #7 Flushing Line still uses the corner-cab at one end, and those cars will be around for a long time yet, I'm happy to say. They're only about 20 years old. And that's one of the most interesting lines in the system. Right now I've been enjoying the R-40's on the Brighton Express once in a while, for as long as it lasts. Still trying hard to catch an R-32/38 type on the F-line for a front-window ride over the Smith-9th viaduct. Wish I'd done it years ago when there was still lot's of time to do it.

 #305791  by Jersey Jeff
 
PATH trains still have big railfan windows. My son loves to sit there and pretend he's driving the train. :-)

 #305823  by MACTRAXX
 
Yes - I am a big fan myself of the RFW. On any system from the LIRR to NYCT and other cities such as Philadelphia and Chicago I've ridden them over time. As mentioned-PATH:When the older PA cars were rehabbed in the 80s they removed the traverse seating from the ends installing the wall seating-which made it easier to see out the RFW because the old seats faced away-a problem when the train was crowded if you could not sit alone. Philadelphia-Market-Frankford M4 cars have a good RFW-you can sit down the right way-two seat-and enjoy the ride. You can see out the front of the Broad Street Line cars also-but thru the cab from a single left-side seat. In my opinion the CTA in Chicago before OPTO had arguably the best RF seat-a single seat up next to the left front window with a two seat right behind facing properly. This would accomodate three people to enjoy the ride. Another one I recall was Washington METRO-the train operator would open up the left side by closing the cab door off to the right when they would change ends-leaving a good observation view-but they now only do this in rush hour these days I recall. Yes I agree-the RFS can be the best part of your train ride! MACTRAXX
 #306021  by Head-end View
 
You're right Jeff! PATH is excellent for railfanning. See our posts in the PATH thread concerning the design of their new cars that are now on order.

 #306077  by Robert Paniagua
 
Also, WMATA's Cars still have the railfan windows, but I think the R160 cars' Cab-Access Doors will still have a good-size window, however, if you want to watch the motorperson..................not gonna happen, sorry, since they will slap on that fuzzy material that I now find on the R44/46/68/110B/142/143 which will still enable me to see out the trackage straight.

Also, the MBTA Boston T Blue Line 0600s and Red Line 01800s also have a railfan window.

 #306862  by Terrapin Station
 
Yes, you can see straight ahead on the R-68/142/143/160, but the railfan view is distorted. It is like you are drunk. Light is repeated multiple times due to the polarization, I think. It is better than nothing, but pretty worthless underground and marginally ok above ground.

 #307233  by GP38
 
Terrapin Station wrote:Yes, you can see straight ahead on the R-68/142/143/160, but the railfan view is distorted. It is like you are drunk. Light is repeated multiple times due to the polarization, I think. It is better than nothing, but pretty worthless underground and marginally ok above ground.
Not to mention you can't take photos like this anymore with those Drunken railfan window views through that glass:

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