Discussion relating to the past and present operations of the NYC Subway, PATH, and Staten Island Railway (SIRT).

Moderator: GirlOnTheTrain

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  by railfan365
 
I've read that the South Ferry Station is still flooded, with no R Service between Manhattan and Brooklyn, and no 1 Service South of Rector Street. I ask: How are they turning 1 and 5 trains that normally turn or switch ends at South Ferry?
  by lirr42
 
railfan365 wrote:I've read that the South Ferry Station is still flooded, with no R Service between Manhattan and Brooklyn, and no 1 Service South of Rector Street. I ask: How are they turning 1 and 5 trains that normally turn or switch ends at South Ferry?
I think South Ferry might be dry at this point and the tracks operational, but all the salt water damage or other infrastructure damage probably makes it uninhabitable for people.

So at Rector Street to turn (1) trains, they can:
  1. run trains empty to South Ferry, turn normally, proceed northbound and collect passengers at Rector Street, then continue normally
  2. There is a switch directly south of Rector Street from the downtown track to the uptown track, so trains could pull in, discharge, pull down the track a little ways, change ends, and proceed over the switch into the uptown Rector Street platform, and off on their way.
And at Bowling Green to turn (5) trains, they can:
  1. use the South Ferry loop as usual, as it would not involve them stopping in the South Ferry complex.
  2. There is a set of crossovers just north of Bowling Green station, so they could just pull into one of the station tracks, discharge, load at the same place, and pull out using the switch to get to the right place. All this would involve is some sort of sign or announcement or human telling people what track to go to first.
  3. And here' the crazy one (we know the MTA has to have at least one crazy option). They could run trains empty through the Joralemon Street tunnels and turn them with the crossovers just west of Borough Hall.
  by eastwind
 
I can't say I've seen any substantive reports on what the damage was to the R line in lower Manhattan through to Brooklyn. It seems like service is suspended indefinitely. Is this line really such a low priority? Or was the damage that bad, and if so, what happened?
  by Kamen Rider
 
1 trains are using old South ferry as a turning loop. Some C/Rs have let people stay on the train.

The Montague Street tunel had so much water it ran almost all the way to Court Street station. Because of the below water level junction with the Nassua street line, The tunnel had probibly the largest volume of water to pump out. the issues with the tunnel also effect the J and Z, they won't be back to Broad till the tunnel is reopened.
  by lirr42
 
Some acrobatics were going down in the Rockaways last night as the MTA was assembling a bunch of subway cars for the special (H) service that begins TOMORROW at 4am.

The service will operate as follows:
Every 15 minutes using 4 car shuttle trains from 4am to midnight from Beach-90 Street to Far Rockaway, where customers can transfer to special bus service to Howard Beach-JFK Airport.

The service is free of charge and will operating using 5 trains of 4-car R32 sets.

They uploaded a video of some of it onto their YouTube Channel Monday. You can view it here: MTA Video Release: Rockaways Train Lift

See a map/details of the service in this MTA Service Announcement.

Some photos:
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(Photos credit: MTA Flickr)
Last edited by lirr42 on Mon Nov 19, 2012 9:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
  by farecard
 
lirr42 wrote: Every 15 minutes using 4 car shuttle trains from 4am to midnight from Rockaway Park to Far Rockaway, where customers can transfer to special bus service to Howard Beach-JFK Airport.
Is the service going to Rockaway Park, or Beach 90 St; and if stopping short, what track damage {besides across the bay, of course....} is there?

A side question: where are the traction power station{s} for the line?
  by lirr42
 
farecard wrote:
lirr42 wrote: Every 15 minutes using 4 car shuttle trains from 4am to midnight from Rockaway Park to Far Rockaway, where customers can transfer to special bus service to Howard Beach-JFK Airport.
Is the service going to Rockaway Park, or Beach 90 St; and if stopping short, what track damage {besides across the bay, of course....} is there?

A side question: where are the traction power station{s} for the line?
You are correct, service is only operating to Beach-90 Street, I was actually in the process of changing the post as you made that reply. The post above has been changed to provide accurate information.
  by Kamen Rider
 
there are no signals south of B90. from B67th to B90th, the trains would run absolute block over the south leg of the wye to the station. The rockaway park tower still needs work to get B90th to B116th working.
  by farecard
 
lirr42 wrote:Some acrobatics were going down in the Rockaways last night as the MTA was assembling a bunch of subway cars for the special (H) service that begins TOMORROW at 4am.

How much do the trucks weigh vs. the body?
  by lirr42
 
An update on the condition of the South Ferry station following Hurricane Sandy was posted on the MTA Website, under the Rebuilding after Sandy section.

The basic gist is this: South Ferry is closed indefinitely .
MTA wrote:Restoring South Ferry Station

Sandy's Catastrophic Surge

When Hurricane Sandy struck, an unprecedented storm surge of 13 feet sent the East River careening into Battery Park and the streets of Lower Manhattan. At the southernmost tip of Manhattan, the water cascaded into the South Ferry subway station, forcing Transit Managers, who were there to monitor the surge, to flee the station after watching the water consume the platform, and the stairs leading to the mezzanine, eventually rising to the tops of the escalators that lead to the street above.

Sandy's impact on New York's rivers and waterways caused water infiltration to other vulnerable areas of the subway system as well. The extent of overall system-wide flooding, including eight underwater tubes, took a massive amount of manpower to operate pump stations, leaving the South Ferry station essentially underwater for a week. When the water was pumped out, the extent of the problem was clear—Sandy's surge was catastrophic, rendering the station, used by more than twenty-nine thousand riders daily, inoperable indefinitely.

Details of Damage

When crews began inspecting the station, finding a component or sub-system inside the three year old station that wasn't water-logged was impossible. Debris from the East River littered the station. Tiles were ripped off walls, plaster and paint hung from corridor ceilings. Turnstiles and other MetroCard equipment suffered extensive damage as did escalators, tracks, signals and switches. The equipment that Dispatchers use to monitor and control train traffic in and out of the terminal — worth hundreds of thousands of dollars — was ruined. Crew quarters were in shambles. Equipment was not only submerged, but evidence of corrosion from salt water was apparent, presenting crews with a maintenance and restoration nightmare.

Working toward Recovery

NYC Transit is now in the process of conducting a comprehensive assessment of the stations' damage, and its impact to the overall infrastructure of the station. Engineers are developing a plan to repair damaged components where possible, and replace those beyond repair. Some equipment, like elevator and escalators, will require new motor parts which require long lead time to manufacture, or may be replaced altogether. Signal interlockings and communication equipment may also need to be replaced. NYC Transit will work as expeditiously as possible to assess the most appropriate restoration approach to get the terminal up and running as soon as it is safe to do so.

Bringing Back Service

While the South Ferry terminal is being restored, the southern terminal for 1 line icon service is Rector Street, about four blocks north. A temporary signal system was installed that allows trains to use the track area known as the Old South Ferry Loop after leaving Rector Street to turn around so that trains can travel back uptown.

Trains are running on regular schedules, but customers going to Lower Manhattan should allow for extra travel time.

Customers who rely on the Staten Island Ferry for travel to and from Lower Manhattan can also use the 4 line icon 5 line icon subway at the Bowling Green Station, located about a quarter of a mile from the South Ferry Terminal building. The 2 line icon 3 line icon Wall Street Station is also just under a half mile from South Ferry Terminal.

In addition, the M5 Limited, M15, SBS 15 and M20 bus routes are also available.
See the full news post and photos of South Ferry station here: Rebuilding South Ferry Station
  by M&Eman
 
There is also no longer any reference to Cortlandt Street (closed since 9/11) on the 1 train on the new recovery map. Has the idea of re-opening Cortlandt St. after 1 World Trade Center opens been abandoned?
  by lirr42
 
No, I don't think it was forgotten. I think it was left off the map to avoid confusion. "Closed temporarily do to the storm" and "Closed for long-term construction for years to come" are two different things and could possibly confuse people.
  by Gerry6309
 
lirr42 wrote:No, I don't think it was forgotten. I think it was left off the map to avoid confusion. "Closed temporarily do to the storm" and "Closed for long-term construction for years to come" are two different things and could possibly confuse people.
A question for those of you closer to the scene. Was the level of damage to the new terminal due to its depth below the surface making it a natural water trap. Obviously, the old terminal connects directly to the Joralemon tubes at a higher level, probably diverting the floodwater down into the tunnel where there was less technology to be damaged. Since the new terminal connects to the Montague Tunnel at some point via Whitehall station, it makes sense that these are the most damaged areas.
  by Kamen Rider
 
the new station's primary problem was that, reguardless of how deep it was, there was no outlet, so the water stayed too long. Though, the old station was also flooded to atleast the platform...
  by Crabman1130
 
Are there any updates on the A line between Howard Beach and Broad Channel?
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