Danbury Branch - History, Electrification, Studies

[DutchRailnut]

Hope the govenor and those in charge taled to HHRC , last comment from its owner was no way, only if they buy my entire railroad plus 4 years of revenue. and Direct trains to GCT all day ??? right we realy need that.

[Otto Vondrak]

Maybe the governor is going to pick everyone up at New Milford and drive them to Danbury...

[Dieter]

Take note of today's property prices around New Milford and say, six miles around. Check them again in six months. Check how they have risen over the same period of time in the past. Check the level of development in three years and you are sure to find a spike in such activity compared to the previous twenty years.

With the release of this news, property value will shoot up, developers will show up, "Middle Income Housing" (condos) will sprout up, and guess what? You really WILL need that service by the time it's launched.

Dieter/

[benltrain]

Where is new milford in relation to Danbury?

We discussed this before in the Danbury electrification thread, but why does electrification mean more direct trains to GCT? The trains can do that now, so why do we need a fancy electrification project on a long line with a relatively small level of service?

[oddball]

As a resident of New Milford and a new Metro North employee, I love this idea!! New Milford is about a half hour driving from Danbury but like mentioned before in this thread, this town is growing in leaps and bounds! I have been here for 14 years and it seems like everywhere i look is a new building. So I think its a great idea.

[njtmnrrbuff]

While the old catenary towers stand along most parts of the Danbury Branch, there has to be more done to electrify the line. The line is mainly single track with a few sidings. It's not as easy to reelectrify the line as one would think, especially with the rock formations. What about just using dual mode. I know the Gennies have issues with acceleration but at least, there are high level platforms. If service were to run every thirty minutes during the middle of the day, there needs to be a demand for it. More and more people are moving up that way. At least an hour will do it and maybe run more trains during the rush hour. The service to New Milford should be a success if it ever happens. I remember going through there on the fl9 excursion. It's like the town got new MN service at the last minute.

[benltrain]

While the old catenary towers stand along most parts of the Danbury Branch, there has to be more done to electrify the line. The line is mainly single track with a few sidings. It's not as easy to reelectrify the line as one would think, especially with the rock formations. What about just using dual mode. I know the Gennies have issues with acceleration but at least, there are high level platforms. If service were to run every thirty minutes during the middle of the day, there needs to be a demand for it. More and more people are moving up that way. At least an hour will do it and maybe run more trains during the rush hour. The service to New Milford should be a success if it ever happens. I remember going through there on the fl9 excursion. It's like the town got new MN service at the last minute.

I agree, I rode a midday shuttle train and there were only enough passengers to fill up not even a quarter of a coach! And now we're talking about running four times more service with electricfication????

[DutchRailnut]

Electrifying existing branch would cost about $200 million not included are minimum of 30 new electric cars that would be needed at $4.2 million a piece on top of existing M-8 order.
Electrification would cut reliability, there are no longer a switcher in Danbury or in South Norwalk like in New Haven days that could rescue a train without power, now if a tree comes down or a other calamity cuts the juice it would take at least hour to get engine up the branch.
if it went to New Milford the $200 would raise to 230 million for electrification.
Every catenary pole on branch needs to be replaced as the bottoms are rotted out.

[Noel Weaver]

I totally agree that there needs to be passenger trains to New Milford. I
suspect that the Housatonic will cooperate, it will benefit them in the long
run. I don't think the Danbury Branch will justify a train every 30 minutes.
I do think the line needs a cab signal system like the system to Wassaic.
I don't think at this point that it would be practical to re-electrify the line
although the wires should never have been taken down in the first place.
New Milford is obviously growing and route 7 is a terrible road for the
most part.
Having said that, Connecticut seems to have a champagne appetite with a
beer pocketbook when it comes to commuter transportation.
Another thing, Connecticut needs a balanced transportation system, they
have decent rail service and some places have decent bus service as well
but Torrington, a city of over 30,000 population has very limited bus
service in or out of town and in Waterbury, a city of over 100,000 they
have very limited city bus service with hourly service generally at best
and no evening service after about 6:00 PM.
If they really want to provide an alternative to the dreadful conditions on
the roads, they need to make it convenient for people to use public
transportation, trains and buses, all during the day and into the late
evening hours.
It seems to me that they should have an open and staffed station in
Waterbury and that every train should have a bus connection to and from
Thomaston, Torrington and Winsted. It would help to have a staffed
station in Danbury too.
I went down to Waterbury a couple of times last summer while in the N.E.
and found the conditions around the station to be a mess, broken glass
all over the place, undesireable people just hanging out and a general
unpleasant atmosphere. I wanted to ride the line to Bridgeport but was
too concerned about my car to take a chance and leave it there while
enjoying the ride, I was afraid that the windows in my car would contribute
to the broken glass around the area and I would find the contents gone.
It is commendable at Connecticut supports rail transportation, it is too bad
that they don't do more for the people who ride these trains.
Noel Weaver

[Tom Curtin]

That news article I posted the link to is very nonspecific about what kinds of improvements they are proposing. We know "studies" have been done on electrification as well as on the utterly absurd idea of double tracking the branch (Can you imagine that?), but just what they are proposing to do is unclear. Herewith a couple of quotes from the article . .

Extending the line to New Milford will cost about $45 million, according to DOT assistant planning director Carmine Trotta,

I would surmise that is for track upgrading, including welded rail, and station improvements at Brookfield and New Milford, and possibly a new station that has been talked about at or near Berkshire Junction (just about at the Danbury-Brookfield town line)

Improvements to the Danbury to Norwalk train line are expected to cost about $200 million.

Is the $200M for electrification? I imagine $200M does not include TCS signalling which is, as far as I know, is already in an existing capital plan.
If they're really serious about the kind of grandiose train frequency the article talks about, I would think some passing siding additions (e.g. restoration of Bethel Lower) are called for.

[Tom Curtin]

Electrification would cut reliability, there are no longer a switcher in Danbury or in South Norwalk like in New Haven days that could rescue a train without power, now if a tree comes down or a other calamity cuts the juice it would take at least hour to get engine up the branch.

Interesting and valid observation. But CTDOT is not a railroad and does not probably think about the details of operational issues such as that.

But I will say I'm old enough to remember, and to have ridden it a number of times, when it was electric, and I have to say I do not recall problems with falling trees taking down the catenary --- although neither will I say it never happened!

What's more likely to get in the way of catenary construction is the world-famous NIMBY effect -- can't you just picture the uprisings from the residents along the route who are absolutely certain they will suffer from Terminal Impotence*** and other such life-theatening conditions from being near a hi-voltage electric field.

Every catenary pole on branch needs to be replaced as the bottoms are rotted out.

Unfortunately so. But they existing I-beam poles would be replaced no matter what, as they would install the European-style catenary just as was done on the New Canaan Br.

_____________________-
***Now that I think about it, living near a hi voltage electric field might just result in the opposite problem, i.e., Terminal Priapism. I trust this comment will be taken in good fun.

[metroduff]

This thread is incorrectly titled.

Please note that the Governor has NOT approved this plan, and her previous comments on it -- that it was much too much money spent on transportation when CT has other pressing needs -- are not encouraging. This plan has only passed the House, and there's many a slip ...

[Tom Curtin]

Thank you for the correction, you're right

In any event, my first opinion, that this grandiose scheme has something approximating zero probability of getting executed as is being talked about, still stands

[Dieter]

Don't worry about the NIMBYs on this one, as the GIMMES will outnumber them when push comes to shove.

I think electrification of the entire run to start is a waste of funds, and is something to consider down the road. Using Gennys and Bombardier coaches and just extending the existing run until there's a scream to double track and expand service is good enough to start. That's a lot more cost effective too.

To answer a question of why to electrify, it makes a larger pool of equipment potentially available for runs.

Double tracking that run is not as rediculous as it sounds, and in the next fifteen years, it may become necessary.

Dieter/

[DutchRailnut]

You have obvious never seen passenger count on Danbury branch. people rather drive to Brewser for a 84 minute ride , then take the branch for a 115 minute ride. even if gass went up people would rather take a bus to Brewster or Goldens bridge.
Electrifying or cab signal or in best scenario both will only cut about 5 minutes of the run.