Protest against photban on June 6th!

[NIMBYkiller]

From 'The Joe' of nycsubway.org:


As you may or may not have heard, there's a plan in the works to protest the proposed photography ban on the afternoon of Sunday, June 6th. We'd meet up at a central location, like Grand Central, around noontime, and make a loop around midtown, going down, across the L, up the west side and back down and over to times square. The whole thing would maybe last an hour or two at the most.
The idea is to simply get a large group of people out with cameras, taking photos riding around the subway as a peaceful protest. While carrying a sign or flag would be encouraged, the key and most important thing to carry would be your camera. Photograph at will. There's no need to turn it into a loud circus atmosphere. Just the fact that photographers would be protesting anything is extremely noteworthy. When was the last time YOU heard of a photographer protest?

I already know this proposed protest will gather a good large crowd. It's a given (and not just from transit buffs, I know many photographers and creative types who are against this ban). What I don't know is who else wants to help organize it it a bit more. I'd say we need a few people to help coordinate during the day, 2 or 3 people to write up and send out a press release to as many news outlets as we can gather, and a few people to get the word out around the web and email.

So - if you're in and want to help out, drop me an email...

[email protected]




I'm going to be there, no doubt about it. I know it's not directly related to LIRR, but LIRR is considering a ban as well. Anyone going?

[GP38]

The "war" continues. This is getting interesting:

http://www.villagevoice.com/issues/0423/haber.php

[NIMBYkiller]

I know I'm going to be there, anyone else?

[DutchRailnut]

You guys file for permit to gather and demonstrate ??

[GP38]

I unfortunately have to work, so I can't make it there, but from the sound of things that I have read, there will be quite a few people there. Everyone from artists to railfans to photographers to "fight for your rights" type of people. We shall see.

On a similar note, another poll and article for you guys....

http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/200 ... -ban_x.htm

[Richard Glueck]

At the risk of turning this totally off topic, if you value you personal right to take a picture of a moving train, simply to enjoy a hobby or document history, you had better consider how you vote in November. This goes straight to the White House, and you should see the writing on the wall now. In four more years you may not be able to ride a train without a police issued permit.
Taking a picture is the surface of an issue that goes far, far, deeper.
If you are not scared, you should be. Gun nuts too! :-)

[kro52]

Greetings All,
I take offense to the "Voting" statement. First off let's not forget who attacked who first! The loss of some personal freedoms are a small price to pay for the privilege of being an American in these times.

KRO52

[DutchRailnut]

And I take offence to that statement, a group of terrorist, maybe 100 or 200 followers of a former US sponsored terrorist turn on us, and the shrub declares war on the world, 50% of Arab population and wonders why nobody likes him anymore.
The guy is a menace and should be kicked out of office. Fire the Liar.
this country is now led by a bush, a dick and a colun(sp)

[Paul]

Hmmmm...lets take a broader look shall we? We financed Osama. We supplied Osama. We trained Osama. We encouraged the Kurds to uprise against Saddam. We left them out to dry.
Gerorge Bush Sr, in an essay to Time Magazine explained that it would be a no win situation to invade Iraq (1998). We blindly allowed our leaders to manipulate the press and gave a blank check to the president to invade and overthow a goverment that had not any ties to the 9-11 incident. We gave up our cival rights under the pretence on security, we allowed the passage of the most damaging law ever to strike a blow to the Bill of Rights. I am still not sure what construction racketeering in Las Vegas has to do with the terrorists of the world, but the Patriot Act is what is being used to prosecute them. One congresswoman from California voted no. One. She was chastized for being 'un American. Speak out against the war and you don't "support our troops". I am against this war and if we trully supported out troops, then they would never, EVER be placed in harms way for a foray for cheap oil. American citizens are being held with out bail and without the right to confer with lawyers, ordinary citizens out to enjoy their hobby of railroad photography have become 'persons of interest" and are on the FBI radar screen. Political? You bet. Will the vote in November change things? I hope so. Do I think it will? No. If voting could really change things then it would be illegal.
John Quincy Addams once said "The first duty of a citizen is to keep his mouth open". Franklyn said "He who is willing to give up freedom for security deserves niether", Kissenger said "The illegal we can to imediatley, the un-constitutional takes a little longer". This proposed photo ban must be stopped, and stopped NOW. What next, gatherings in public places by more than three people will be against the law? Sorry to vent, but I am scared that my son will serve in Iraq, and he is only 10.

[DutchRailnut]

If this Draft legislation goes my sons will be yanked out of College for a war they don't agree to.

Pending Draft Legislation Targeted for Spring 2005
The Draft will Start in June 2005

There is pending legislation in the House and Senate (twin bills: S 89 and HR 163) which will time the program's initiation so the draft can begin at early as Spring 2005 -- just after the 2004 presidential election. The administration is quietly trying to get these bills passed now, while the public's attention is on the elections, so our action on this is needed immediately.
$28 million has been added to the 2004 Selective Service System (SSS) budget to prepare for a military draft that could start as early as June 15, 2005. Selective Service must report to Bush on March 31, 2005 that the system, which has lain dormant for decades, is ready for activation. Please see website: www.sss.gov/perfplan_fy2004.html to view the sss annual performance plan - fiscal year 2004.

The pentagon has quietly begun a public campaign to fill all 10,350 draft board positions and 11,070 appeals board slots nationwide.. Though this is an unpopular election year topic, military experts and influential members of congress are suggesting that if Rumsfeld's prediction of a "long, hard slog" in Iraq and Afghanistan [and a permanent state of war on "terrorism"] proves accurate, the U.S. may have no choice but to draft.

Congress brought twin bills, S. 89 and HR 163 forward this year, http://www.hslda.org/legislation/na...s89/default.asp entitled the Universal National Service Act of 2003, "to provide for the common defense by requiring that all young persons [age 18--26] in the United States, including women, perform a period of military service or a period of civilian service in furtherance of the national defense and homeland security, and for other purposes." These active bills currently sit in the committee on armed services.

Dodging the draft will be more difficult than those from the Vietnam era.

College and Canada will not be options. In December 2001, Canada and the U.S. signed a "smart border declaration," which could be used to keep would-be draft dodgers in. Signed by Canada's minister of foreign affairs, John Manley, and U.S. Homeland Security director, Tom Ridge, the declaration involves a 30-point plan which implements, among other things, a "pre-clearance agreement" of people entering and departing each country. Reforms aimed at making the draft more equitable along gender and class lines also eliminates higher education as a shelter. Underclassmen would only be able to postpone service until the end of their current semester. Seniors would have until the end of the academic year.

Even those voters who currently support US actions abroad may still object to this move, knowing their own children or grandchildren will not have a say about whether to fight. Not that it should make a difference, but this plan, among other things, eliminates higher education as a
shelter and includes women in the draft.

The public has a right to air their opinions about such an important decision.

Please send this on to all the friends, parents, aunts and uncles, grandparents, and cousins that you know. Let your children know too -- it's their future, and they can be a powerful voice for change!

Please also contact your representatives to ask them why they aren't telling their constituents about these bills -- and contact newspapers and other media outlets to ask them why they're not covering this important story.


this legislation would affect most of railfans on these boards.

[bingdude]

I hope you guys did meet and take pix. And I hope you didn't resist too much if they decided to take you in.

I went with my family to the USSR when I was 11. Since I heard they still used steam engines I told one of our guides on a trip that I'd like to see some. He saw my Satellite 127 camera and warned me not to take any pictures of trains and if I was caught I could be arrested or my camera would be smashed or taken away.

I never thought it would happen here at home.

[kro52]

Greetings All,
I guess you guys are part of the blame America first crowd. As for us backing Osama, I'm interested to see where you got your info. Is that why when he was offered to Clinton it was ignored? As for the draft, I am sure that there is many men and women now serving in our military that also are against the war, but loyalty to their country comes first. Let us hope there will be no need for the draft.

Well here's a solution for peace put forward by Robin Williams:

I see a lot of people yelling for peace but I have not heard of a plan for peace. So, here's one plan.

1. The US will apologize to the world for our "interference" in their affairs, past & present. You know, Hitler, Mussolini, Tojo, Noriega, Milosovich and the rest of those good ol' boys: We will never "interfere" again.

2. We will withdraw our troops from all over the world, starting with Germany, South Korea and the Philippines. They don't want us there. We would station troops at our borders. No one sneaking through holes in the fence.

3. All illegal aliens have 90 days to get their affairs together and leave. We'll give them a free trip home. After 90 days the remainder will be gathered up and deported immediately, regardless of who or where they are. France would welcome them.


4. All future visitors will be thoroughly checked and limited to 90 days unless given a special permit. No one from a terrorist nation would be allowed in. If you don't like it there, change it yourself and don't hide here. Asylum would never be available to anyone. We don't need any more cab drivers or 7-11 cashiers.

5. No "students" over age 21 The older ones are the bombers. If they don't attend classes, they get a "D" (for "deport") and it's back home baby.

6. The US will make a strong effort to become self-sufficient energy wise. This will include developing non-polluting sources of energy but will require a temporary drilling of oil in the Alaskan wilderness. The caribou will have to cope for a while.

7. Offer Saudi Arabia and other oil producing countries $10 a barrel for their oil. If they don't like it, we go some place else. They can go somewhere else to sell their production. (About a week of the wells filling up the storage sites would be enough.)

8. If there is a famine or other natural catastrophe in the world, we will not "interfere." They can pray to Allah or whomever for seeds, rain, cement or whatever they need. Besides, most of what we give them is stolen or given to the Army. The people who need it most get very little, if anything.

9. Ship the UN Headquarters to an isolated island some place. We don't need the spies and fair weather friends here. Besides, the building would make a good homeless shelter or lockup for illegal aliens.

10. All Americans must go to charm and beauty school. That way no one can call us "Ugly Americans" any longer. The language we speak is ENGLISH.....learn it...or LEAVE...

Now, ain't that a winner of a plan.
The Statue of Liberty is no longer saying "Give me your poor, your tired, your huddled masses." She's got a baseball bat and she's yelling, "You want a piece of me?"

KRO52

[Richard Glueck]

KRO52, you have it all nicely packaged into one little basket. No gray, just black and white. And no doubt, you're not too keen on that black side either. Freedom is everyone's to share, not to be parcelled out by ultra-rightist kooks like yourself. You talk more like a Nazi than an American. You should be ashamed of yourself, but with you head so far up your ass, you wouldn't notice the blush.

[kro52]

Richard,
Nazi, Right wing kook? A typical answer from your type when the truth is put in their face. As for your lurid description of me, you are so far off the mark it is laughable. As for my head being up my ass, it would only be to search for the likes of you spewing your retoric to any who would listen. Too bad we won't be around in 500 years to see how history will paint these times.

[CLiner2005]

Pretty pathetic - I thought I joined an intelligent "railroad forum." I have been taking RR photos all over the U.S. for years and have yet to have my cameras and equipment confiscated - and I have had contact with law enforcement personnel in pursuing my hobby of 60 years. Perhaps a little attitude adjustment will be of benefit. How many of you have been detained for taking photos on public property (not trespassing)?

You folks who are complaining of your "rights" being taken from you because of REAL security concerns should have been around during WWII when there were, in fact, many restrictions on activities, movements - not just taking photographs. It was called sacrifice.

I don't want to get started, so I will discontinue participating in RAILROAD.NET and continue to enjoy those forums that exibit some maturity, respect and courtesy amongst its members.

God Bless America.