EL Greenwood Lake Division reopened?

[ErieLimited2914]

I noticed that the tracks were cut down by the Newark-Pompton Turnpike crossing (where the Pequannock station used to be).

Anyone know anything else???

[SemperFidelis]

I think they're building a rail trail on the old ROW, which would include the section behind the Quik Check. Removing the trees and the rails would make sense for this.

[ErieLimited2914]

To connect to the NS Totowa Industrial Branch without going over NJT? I live near the old Pequannock Station.

[SemperFidelis]

It would make sense for an NJT commuter line, but if that were the case we would have heard something.

If it is being rebuilt I'd have to throw out a theory that maybe the Tilcon plant on the Totowa Industrial has long term plans to bring stone down from the Tilcon Quarry at the north end of the Greenwood Lake Branch. There really wouldn't be many other reasons that I can think of to link the two segments.

Either way I think we would have heard something if it were anything more than just the rail-trail.

[blockline4180]

If it is being rebuilt I'd have to throw out a theory that maybe the Tilcon plant on the Totowa Industrial has long term plans to bring stone down from the Tilcon Quarry at the north end of the Greenwood Lake Branch. There really wouldn't be many other reasons that I can think of to link the two segments.

That would be a dream come true if it were true, but your right, I'm pretty sure it's only a dream!

[cjvrr]

Hi there,

I found this board while looking for word on the old EL line running through my backyard. It appears at this point that they are definitely going to restore service on this line in some way. The trackway is being clearcut and the old track ripped up. Have not seen anything in the way of new track yet, but if they were removing the old in order to decommission it, they would not be removing the trees too. The tree removal crew is behind Quick Chek as I type this. I hiked the trackway a few months ago, and there are active crossings in Wayne and Totowa. That portion (there are businesses that have rail cars parked on their spurs, and the track appears smooth with no rust on the top surface) appears to be served by an interconnect with NJ transit just north of Mountain View Station. There are brand new switches and locks there, and tracks appear freshly used up to the one lane bridge by Hoffman Grove.

This could be interesting, especially given the NJ Transit interconnect at the other end.

Taz,

Are you talking about the Quick Chek near the Pompton Plains Station? If so, the track was removed from there a few years ago. The NYS&W has remved sections of rail along their portion of the Greenwood Lake Branch for use elsewhere. Its heavy rail and in good shape so it has been used for sidings down in Ridgefield Park. In order to get the rail out, you do need to cut the trees so you can get the machines in.

Morris County plans to build a trail along the right of way adjacent to the tracks, not on them. It is not a rails to trails project. The trail is being built over the water pipeline that parallels the track.

[ErieLimited2914]

Hi there,

I found this board while looking for word on the old EL line running through my backyard. It appears at this point that they are definitely going to restore service on this line in some way. The trackway is being clearcut and the old track ripped up. Have not seen anything in the way of new track yet, but if they were removing the old in order to decommission it, they would not be removing the trees too. The tree removal crew is behind Quick Chek as I type this. I hiked the trackway a few months ago, and there are active crossings in Wayne and Totowa. That portion (there are businesses that have rail cars parked on their spurs, and the track appears smooth with no rust on the top surface) appears to be served by an interconnect with NJ transit just north of Mountain View Station. There are brand new switches and locks there, and tracks appear freshly used up to the one lane bridge by Hoffman Grove.

This could be interesting, especially given the NJ Transit interconnect at the other end.

Taz,

Are you talking about the Quick Chek near the Pompton Plains Station? If so, the track was removed from there a few years ago. The NYS&W has remved sections of rail along their portion of the Greenwood Lake Branch for use elsewhere. Its heavy rail and in good shape so it has been used for sidings down in Ridgefield Park. In order to get the rail out, you do need to cut the trees so you can get the machines in.

Morris County plans to build a trail along the right of way adjacent to the tracks, not on them. It is not a rails to trails project. The trail is being built over the water pipeline that parallels the track.

I watched them working on a section near PV Park/Alexander Ave. crossing, they don't need to cut anything down. They tied a chain to the rail, and hauled ass and pulled it out.

[Taz]

Yes by the Pompton Plains Station. The tracks are still there, they're just overgrown. As far as I remember, they didn't even remove the grade crossing at Jackson Ave, they just paved over it years back. The rails have only been removed in a couple spots between here and Mountain View.. Behind Town Hall, over by where Pequannock Feed used to be, and one spot by Dorsa Rd. The rest of the ROW is still there. I don't see any reason to do the amount of clearcutting that they've been doing just to rip the rails out. The trail next to the tracks is more than wide enough to get whatever backhoe or front loader they use in there. Especially where they were just going at it by Quick Chek. There's plenty of access from Jackson Ave all the way to Woodland that they could've used without cutting down what they did. They're clearing the ROW.. There's something else going on here.

Yes, they ripped a few hundred feet of track up by PV park, but who's to say that isn't to re-grade the trackbed and replace the ties? It's been out of service for 40+ years, so one would think an overhaul would be in order before returning it to service.. We can hold out hope, can't we?!

And the bike path (which is going to parallel the ROW, basically a paved/lighted upgrade to the trail that's already there), while it has been in concept and wrapped in red tape for nearly 15 years, JUST literally a few weeks ago got approval for the federal grant to build it, with the projected start date sometime in 2012. This work has been going on for months, and there is NYS&W trucks and personnel involved, so one could safely assume that this activity is unrelated to the path.

[Taz]

It would make sense for an NJT commuter line, but if that were the case we would have heard something.

If it is being rebuilt I'd have to throw out a theory that maybe the Tilcon plant on the Totowa Industrial has long term plans to bring stone down from the Tilcon Quarry at the north end of the Greenwood Lake Branch. There really wouldn't be many other reasons that I can think of to link the two segments.

Either way I think we would have heard something if it were anything more than just the rail-trail.

Honestly I can't see it being commuter, because the other side don't go anywhere. It dead ends by Federal Hill Road in Pompton Lakes just after the Pompton Junction. That end is basically just long enough to get a (relatively short) train off the NYS&W main line onto the EL spur. And at that point it's an ugly transition too, especially to get a northbound train onto the spur, or get off the spur to go southbound. It involves switching/stopping/reversing which would cripple a commuter line.

Tilcon is one of many potential customers on this line. Wayne Tile's warehouse on Alexander Ave (formerly Mohawk Flooring) has a turnoff, there are many industrial/warehouse operations on Haul Rd/Ryerson/Dorsa Ave (Konica/Minolta, 3M, etc), then you have Totowa, where there are already at least the two customers I saw which are going via NJT. There's a Case heavy equipment facility on Lackawanna Ave right at the end of the spur, a chemical plant, and a few others. Maybe NYS&W sees how much they're paying to NJT to get those 2 customers their service (running freight on commuter lines can't be cheap), and they think it's worth it to reactivate the line because they could attract those other customers as well.

Again, we can dream! Everything seems to be hush hush, no mention of any of it in the papers, so all we can do is guess and hope!

[cjvrr]

And the bike path (which is going to parallel the ROW, basically a paved/lighted upgrade to the trail that's already there), while it has been in concept and wrapped in red tape for nearly 15 years, JUST literally a few weeks ago got approval for the federal grant to build it, with the projected start date sometime in 2012. This work has been going on for months, and there is NYS&W trucks and personnel involved, so one could safely assume that this activity is unrelated to the path.

Taz,

I know this project well as I too work for Morris County, but in the Engineering Dept. That project is being run out of our Transportation Dept. I have been and will be involved on a limited basis with the design of road crossings, but not the overall project.

My guess is the NYS&W is salvaging the rail and tie plates. This rail is / was heavy duty stuff installed by the Erie when they were hauling massive amounts of sand out of Wanaque / Haskell down to the Meadowlands for the NJ Turnpike and other projects. So it is good for reuse on yard tracks or new sidings.

I would think if it were something larger than that (like re-establishing service) the railfan rumor mill would have gone crazy by this point.

[blockline4180]

I would think if it were something larger than that (like re-establishing service) the railfan rumor mill would have gone crazy by this point.

But I thought the "railfan rumor mill" has been in overdrive a bit over the last few weeks, just not on here...LOL

[Idiot Railfan]

I was told by a pretty reliable source that the brush is being cleared to allow better access to the various utilities that run along the row, including several power lines, telephone trunk lines and the Wanaque South Aqueduct, which runs adjacent and below the tracks.

[blocksignal]

Hi all first time posting in this NYS&W thread. I found this topic so intriguing that I took the liberty of doing my own "inspection" of the Old Erie GLB track line myself. Also being that I used to live in Haskell for 8 years as a boy living about 6 minutes walk from the ROW further motivated me. Here are my observations;

On Saturday 1/16/2010 I checked out the section of the GLB from the northern most point of the Pompton Industrial (Federal Hill Road/Willard Street) to Woodlawn Ave. in Pompton Plains. Then from Woodlawn Ave. to Alexander Ave. I noticed 2 gondalas at the end of that line and 4 covered hoppers parked on the BER Plastics siding located at 5 Curtis in Riverdale. As far as I can tell that looks like the only customer on the Pompton Industrial - is that true?

I noticed the old Riverdale train station on Patterson-Hamburg Turnpike - If NJT & NYS&W are planning to collaborate and restore service to that section of track it seems to me the Riverdale train station would be a good northern point to run to. I agree I cannot see passenger service North of the Riverdale station to the Pompton junction, team track, etc. as it would be too burdensome to move around.

From Woodlawn I headed eastbound to Jackson Ave. and noticed the cutting down of the trees and bushes - the road path being on my left - a lot of rails gone on the ROW - ties still in the ground. From Jackson Ave. to Alexander Ave. the pathway switches to the right. I noticed the old siding to the left which terminates at the road - the customer looked like Wayne Tile. Tracks paved over at Jackson Ave. grade crossing. Across the road is another company (Corporate Town Center sign there) where a siding trails off to the left. Trail continues. I noticed this all the way to Alexander Ave. Also noticed all the new Utility poles that I did not see a few months ago. Tracks still visible at Alexander Ave. grade crossing. I took several photographs on my trek in these locations.

On Saturday 1/23/2010 I went from Alexander Ave down to Meadow Road in Wayne and saw much of the same as I saw on 1/16/2010. Clear cutting to the left but I noticed a lot of the old rail still in place. The old trestle over the Passaic River is closed. There is some type of work going on over there.

From what I have seen it looks like they are simply clearing everything out for the trail, utilites, and it seems they probably are taking that old rail to be used elsewhere on the NYS&W line.

By the way I believe Taz mentioned the Totowa Industrial Branch on the 12/18/2009 post. NYS&W does not service those 2 customers on that track branch (formerly the DL&W) Norfolk Southern does more specifically the NS-H02 which is a local freight drill based out of Dover, NJ. They do come down the Montclair-Boonton main heading Eastbound, then switch on the GLB interconnect, then switch from there onto the Totowa Branch and head Eastbound to their 2 customers on that track. Those 2 customers are Omega Warehousing & Royal Distributors - both located in Totowa.

As far as passenger service restoration why not just restore the tracks from the switch at Mt.View (just West of Mt. View Blvd) and rebuild the line from there North to let's say Riverdale for example. There is that yard up in Riverdale that could be used for trains on stand by and storage. You have the 2 headed signal facing Westbound traffic & a 1 headed signal facing Eastbound traffic a few hundred yards to the East of the Mt. View station. You would probably have to replace the manual switch there and put in an automatic switch. When trains at Mt. View go to Dover they would go up the Montcalir-Boonton line as they do now. When they go to Riverdale they would go up the former Erie GLB tracks. Has anybody asked NYS&W or NJT about this - presuming they give an answer - security reasons and so forth. It would be exciting if passenger service did get reinstated on the GLB line. I guess only time will tell.

Happy Sightings.

[jmp883]

Blocksignal wrote:

It would be exciting if passenger service did get reinstated on the GLB line. I guess only time will tell.

It would be exciting.....unfortunately it probably won't happen. I believe you'll see commuter service on the Cutoff and the NYSW&W main before you'll ever see service on the GLB.

It's too bad we don't have the gift of seeing into the future. If we did maybe the GLB would still exist. It would sure ease the traffic issues in northern Passaic County. I moved to Wanaque, NJ in 1973, which was the end of the GLB when the EL made their big service cuts back in 1966. At that time most of northern Passaic County was still fairly undeveloped (compared to the way it is now) and the population was far lower than it is now. I still live in Wanaque and all I can say is that some type of relief is needed from the massive traffic issues we now face. I've waited up to half an hour to get on to Ringwood Avenue from my side street during the morning rush hour.

Restoring commuter service on the NYS&W main will help somewhat but I don't feel it will help enough. It's too bad the railbed of the GLB from Mountain View north is too overgrown, or developed, to be reinstated. Even if those weren't issues the NIMBY issue always has to be taken into account. I'm sure many of the people screaming about the traffic issues would also be the first ones to scream about NO rail service. Anyway, had the rails stayed in place, and the former yard/engine terminal in Wanaque not been sold for an elementary school site, the GLB would have been able to provide a viable mass transit outlet for this area. Unfortunately this area has become so over-developed, and the road system has never been upgraded to handle the increases, that there will probably never be a solution to our traffic problem. It's only on my N-scale layout that this scenario has happened. There are hourly commuter runs from Wanaque to the Mt. View station during every morning and evening rush hour.

Okay....I didn't mean to hijack this thread off-topic the way I did. I guess living in the town that was the end of the GLB, being an EL fan, and wanting to see some type of relief from our traffic issues really struck a chord in me!

[airman00]

You know, one of the basic issues with these questions, is that railroads didn't use any foresight and look ahead to the future. If so, then perhaps they might have saved or maintained some of these train tracks, in the event that things improve later on. With an exsisting infrastructure, there's less of a leg for nimbys and other issues to stand on, because the railroad is/was already there.

Problem is, maintaining an exsisting infrastructure costs time and money. And when railroad stopped being king because the truck and car got into favor, most railroads were faced with dwindling ridership and dwindling freight customers as well. So railroad companies decided to abandon or at least make oos any lines which had only a handful of riders or only 1 or 2 freight customers left. In time as railroads were combined and condensed, old abandoned and oss rail lines were forgotten and ripped up and the land redeveloped. The few that hung around still intact, when they try to reinstate those lines people howl because a train hasn't run here in 35 years. (and then they also complain something about property values, and quality of life issues, etc.)

So with that in mind restarting old lines, needs people behind it, not against it. Now if the railroad kept an old line still in service, even if for just 1 freight customer, then at least they could say it's still an active line, and keep it on the active roster, in hopes of future expansion.