Railroad Forums 

  • Pan Am Railways, For Sale/Acquisition/Merger?

  • Guilford Rail System changed its name to Pan Am Railways in 2006. Discussion relating to the current operations of the Boston & Maine, the Maine Central, and the Springfield Terminal railroads (as well as the Delaware & Hudson while it was under Guilford control until 1988). Official site can be found here: PANAMRAILWAYS.COM.
Guilford Rail System changed its name to Pan Am Railways in 2006. Discussion relating to the current operations of the Boston & Maine, the Maine Central, and the Springfield Terminal railroads (as well as the Delaware & Hudson while it was under Guilford control until 1988). Official site can be found here: PANAMRAILWAYS.COM.

Moderator: MEC407

 #1397500  by newpylong
 
Well, PAS currently has trackage rights into WRJ and uses them, there is nothing that the NECR can do to change that. It goes back to when the Feds took the Conn River away from the B&M. PAS stole the Claremont gas business away from the NECR and wanted to haul the VRS Bellows Falls to WRJ traffic because VRS was unhappy with NECR service. While the NECR can't stop this per the trackage rights agreement they are trying to increase the carload fees in another way to stop it.
 #1397720  by Engineer Spike
 
I agree with F Line, G&W does not have the financial, nor political muscle to mess with NS interests (PAS) too badly. Although the moderator says not to talk about the P&W buyout here, we should. The context being how New England gets carved up.

Will NS take over PAS 100%? Is Guilford really for sale? There haven't been any filings yet. Might other class 1 carriers find parts of the New England railroads strategic? What is the next domino to fall? If someone offered David Wolfson the right price, would he pack it in? VRS has the third western gateway to the region.

I'm wondering who might come out to oppose the P&W buyout. As I said, the whole eastern NY, and New England region seems to be in a state of impending change. Who knows if CP will keep the rest of D&H, since the oil prices have tanked, and that business has declined.
 #1397722  by Jeff Smith
 
Engineer Spike wrote:... Although the moderator says not to talk about the P&W buyout here, we should. The context being how New England gets carved up.
...
That's not what I said. This is what I said:
Jeff Smith wrote:Let's keep it related to effects on PAS and/or PAR. If it's solely about G&W acq. P&W, it goes here:

G&W to acquire P&W
 #1398071  by Engineer Spike
 
Jeff, I was thinking of the big impact of all of the local rumors, and active deals (P&W) here. Many of my comments were about P&W, but I think all of the New England regionals are in a state of flux now. I made my remark about your comment about P&W preemptively before someone jumped down my back. I wanted it to be clear that my P&W comments were taken in context, of the future of the whole region. Please know that my intent was not to start anything with you.

Both the rumored Guilford sale of the PAR, and the NS 100% takeover of PAS. One has to wonder if the big fish want to get involved. As has been mentioned, NECR/P&W would be a good way for CN to penetrate CSX and NS markets. Who knows if any of these regional/short line systems would be worthwhile to purchase, or just form traffic alliances. We have seen several spinoff regionals, which have been taken over by either the class 1 which spun it off such as IC-CC&P, or SOO-ICE, vs. CN takeover of WC, which gave CN totally new markets. In this last case, a western route to Chicago may have been a larger factor, than gaining the local market in WI.
 #1398156  by gokeefe
 
I am also starting to wonder if the Class I railroads now may be looking at the New England market differently as well. CSX's position around Boston is already impressive and I am not sure that their competition is going to be happy with indirect service solutions anymore.
 #1398201  by roberttosh
 
I don't think CSX is that worried about not having direct access to Boston anymore or impressive facilities at places like Readville. In reality, they now serve the Boston "market" more through the Worcester intermodal terminal and the East Brookfield Auto facility. The manifest business plays second fiddle to those business units and I think they're more than content to hand off that traffic at places like Worcester to PAS & PW and one way or another they'll always control the branch line network South of Boston.
 #1398216  by Engineer Spike
 
I think CN is in a good pounce position. Both of their spinoff New England lines connect at their north ends. This may be the way to enter the market, yet have few risks. NECR and especially P&W cover CT, MA, and RI very well. 2 Pan Am connections also give CN a good entry point, to the region.

In the CV sale, didn't CN retain the actual real estate? I remember reading that somewhere. Maybe there aren't the paper barriers, which CR set up with CT Southern, but other than CSX at Palmer, and VTR-P&W haulage, what else is there, but to feed CN?

The population density of the previously mentioned states is thick. Even with little industry left, the consumor goods market is endless. Maybe CN might form an intermodal hub, rather than dray from Montreal.
 #1398237  by F-line to Dudley via Park
 
CN still retains track ownership of 2-3/4 miles on the U.S. side of the border. The E. Alburgh Rd. dirt-road grade crossing is the official division post regardless of which RR crosses the border for set-offs. So while there is zero in the way of contractual paper barriers, CN has them ownership-blocked from building any conceivable track connection that lets them hit CP. Including paranoia-level blocked from rebuilding the Alburgh Trestle (not that that's ever going to happen in a million years). Even if for some reason Amtrak had its Adirondack + Montrealer routes switched up to use CP to Delson instead of the Rouses Point Sub and that half-mile track connection across the farm field were restored from Cantic Jct. to bring the Montrealer over to that side, NECR wouldn't be able to touch it.
 #1398330  by roberttosh
 
From what I've been told, East Worcester has the capacity to handle and offload more trains but is running out of parking spaces. If you look at google maps, there does seem to be at least some adjacent property (some with buildings, some without) that they could expand their parking space into, but they'll still always be tight for space at best with any future growth. Not ideal by any means, but off-site parking/storage is always an option too. West Springfield seems to be in a similar predicament and I'm sure the abutters at both locations know they have all the leverage now regarding sale price. It's really too bad they couldn't expand their Westboro footprint lengthwise as that would have given them a much more traditional rectangular shaped layout with excellent highway access to I-495 and the pike.
 #1398377  by F-line to Dudley via Park
 
Does PAR still have any claim to the Barbers Yard property? The NECR Palmer interchange is quite likely going to move to Worcester out of convenience and cost-savings for both G&W and CSX (who can reduce presence @ Palmer by letting Framingham sort it instead). But that puts pressure on P&W's already tight space crunch in downtown. Barbers is far and away the juciest and easiest parcel for expansion and place to block interchange loads if they want to stay out of the way of general freight at Southbridge St. and IM down by the city dump. Did P&W get ownership + rights to do what they please with Barbers when they bought the lower Gardner Branch, or does it require PAR's blessing/back-scratching to make use of the property?
 #1398383  by F-line to Dudley via Park
 
BandA wrote:Is Readville competitive?
It would be more competitive if Dept. of Conservation and Recreation dropped the truck ban that's been in effect on Neponset Valley Pkwy. since 1987 (at arm-twisting of then- Hyde Park City Councillor Tom Menino). Straight, direct access to the interstates on high-quality state-maintained pavement is impossible because of that ban. Trucks from Readville instead have to make a convoluted trip down Sprague St. and East St. in Dedham, narrow town-control streets that themselves have tight hours-of-day restrictions on trucking. After dark there is literally no way in or out of Readville except to barrel down Hyde Park Ave. Which is insane because the parkway route only requires the trucks to pass like 4 houses total before shooting down wide Route 138 through the unpopulated Neponset Reservation to reach the highway; the hands-down least disruptive 24-hour route of all is maddeningly the one that they're totally prohibited from using in any capacity. These truck bans are literally responsible for driving the massive Stop & Shop Warehouse out of town to inferior locale in Freetown. But that was just fine with Mayor Menino and the Dedham NIMBY's, who just wanted Readville to die already.

The one thing CSX lacks on the southside that PAR has up north is a Tighe Warehouse-type transload anchor customer inside of Route 128. PAR's going to have two of those right down the street from each other when that new entrant on the Woburn Loop track gets its permitting sorted out. It's proving to be a very good thing for them, but CSX thus far hasn't found a matching opportunity of similar upside down south. The S&S property is absolutely golden for that kind of activity. The absolute max neighborhood mitigation that would be required is erecting a sound wall around the existing tree buffer on Meadow Rd. so Wolcott Sq. residents hear nothing, then installing a traffic light and truck-geometry turn lane at the parkway intersection. Everything from there is directed away, away, away from residents on a 5-minute trip to the first I-93 exit adjacent to the Canton split and MA 24. One MassDOT action to lift the truck ban and slapping the Boston Redevelopment Authority with a ruler to stop interfering by proposing one inappropriate BS redev proposal after another at Readville that no developer has any interest in biting on (the latest: "tech lofts"...whatever that's supposed to mean)...and you'll get a transload warehouse showing immediate and considerable interest in that site.


CSX long ago stopped caring because the city was hopeless to deal with, but if they actually got somebody at MassDOT to realize what they were sitting on and lift that truck ban they'd snap immediately into gear recruiting an anchor tenant who can drive revenue growth out of that yard. It is a missing piece of the puzzle that complements their New England business model a lot better than trying to recruit any new on-line customers. Yard-to-yard jobs, customers feasting off the yards, the interchanges...that's the window for modest, high-ROI local growth amid their all-consuming IM focus.
 #1398385  by newpylong
 
F-line to Dudley via Park wrote:Does PAR still have any claim to the Barbers Yard property? The NECR Palmer interchange is quite likely going to move to Worcester out of convenience and cost-savings for both G&W and CSX (who can reduce presence @ Palmer by letting Framingham sort it instead). But that puts pressure on P&W's already tight space crunch in downtown. Barbers is far and away the juciest and easiest parcel for expansion and place to block interchange loads if they want to stay out of the way of general freight at Southbridge St. and IM down by the city dump. Did P&W get ownership + rights to do what they please with Barbers when they bought the lower Gardner Branch, or does it require PAR's blessing/back-scratching to make use of the property?
Why would moving interchange be a cost savings? Even if G&W acquires the P&W, you're still talking two different railroads (NECR to P&W) and a circuitous routing. Hauling NECR north tonnage all the way down to Willimantic and then up to Worcester does not make sense. CSX still has to go into Palmer for the Mass Central so I don't think moving the interchange would be a huge benefit to them either.
 #1398398  by bostontrainguy
 
F-line to Dudley via Park wrote:
BandA wrote:Is Readville competitive?
It would be more competitive if Dept. of Conservation and Recreation dropped the truck ban that's been in effect on Neponset Valley Pkwy. since 1987 (at arm-twisting of then- Hyde Park City Councillor Tom Menino).
I was witness to that. Unsuspecting hard-working truck drivers were suddenly pulled over and fined just for doing their jobs. It was unfair and relentless. But I thought it was challenged and it was found that when the parkway was taken over (or given to the State) there was a provision to allow trucks perpetually. I thought it was eventually resolved in the trucks favor. No?
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