CSX Heritage units? just like UP program?

[scottychaos]

This was posted over on the Susquehanna forum..I thought it deserved its own thread here!

Right now its just a rumour..but if UP did it, why not CSX?
(im sure CSX is also interested in keeping the trademarks of its predecessor roads "active"..so they can make money from their use like UP does..)

here is the post copied over from the NYSW forum:

Looks for CSX to make annoucements soon for their own program!

Steve

woah! this could be ineresting!!
I wonder what CSX would paint?
the obvious roads include:

B&O
C&O
W&M
Chessie
Seaboard
L&N
ACL
Conrail

but who can really lay claim to the railroads that went into Conrail??
PC
PRR
NYC
LV
EL
RDG
NH
CNJ
LNE
L&HR

Since NS and CSX split Conrail more or less equally, I doubt that CSX would consider those roads as part of their "direct" heritage..
and could they anyway? legally? I dont know..
because NS also operates over many of those railroads original routes, it seems to me that NS and CSX would have to somehow "share" ownership of the Conrail trademark, and the railroads that formed Conrail..
while B&O, C&O, L&N, etc are "pure CSX"..if you get my drift..

I would bet that CSX would probably paint a Chessie system, L&N and Conrail unit to start with..IMO those roads represent the main body of modern CSX..
very interesting!
Scot

[octr202]

As far as Conrail goes, there's an extent to which NS and CSX consider NS to have inherited the PRR, and CSX the NYC. Of course, NS got some pieces of the NYC (Ohio west), and CSX does utilize some small but key sections of others (NH, PRR and RDG, most specifically).

The problem with the CSXT side is where do you draw the line at who's in and how's out of the list. The RF&P should be on there, but what about the CE&I, NC&StL, and Pere Marquette, as well (and probably some more others that I'm missing.

Somewhere I once saw a family tree of CSX, before the CR merger. It was quite long already...

[Noel Weaver]

I think if the CSX does paint engines in their heritage colors, it will be for
the same reason that the UP is doing it, simply to prevent others from
using the logos of the many fallen flags that made up CSX.
I do not really believe that either the UP or the CSX really give a dam
about their heritage, especially the CSX.
Noel Weaver

[njt4172]

Scott,

But like Noel Weaver said, CSX and UP don't care about their heritage. They are doing it only to reap the benefits for trademark purposes in the model world..... Hopefully the heritage painted Chessie units will be authentic, but I'm not holding my breath....The UP MKT and WP ones look fake....

Steve

[railohio]

They look like fake engines or they didn't meet your personal expecation of what they'd look like?

[njt4172]

They look like fake engines or they didn't meet your personal expecation of what they'd look like?

They are great!! Hell it is something different on the railroad to watch and photograph!! All I was saying is that when those railroads were around their paint schemes and styles were completely different....Only the decals are similar!

Steve

[mmi16]

I got to see a document, once upon a time...Pre-ConRail...the gave the heritage of all the lines that were then included in CSX.....Without counting out each predecessor company, I fully believe that CSX could provide an individual 'heritage' paint scheme for each predecessor road and run out of locomotives to paint before they ran out of predecessor companies.

[crazy_nip]

dont count on it...

[Matt Langworthy]

I think if the CSX does paint engines in their heritage colors, it will be for
the same reason that the UP is doing it, simply to prevent others from
using the logos of the many fallen flags that made up CSX.
I do not really believe that either the UP or the CSX really give a dam
about their heritage, especially the CSX.
Noel Weaver

CSX would not be able to control the logos of EL, LV, NYC, PC or PRR. Remember, PC became American Premium Underwriters, and as I understand it- they still own the rights to PC and its predecessors. LV was also folded into PC in 1976 to handle the settlement of its remaining assets, so APU would control that as well.

EL is probably public domain because the corporation remained independant until 1992, when it ended existence upon paying final debts.

[ACLfan]

The CSX "family tree" consists of hundreds of individual railroad companies, and each existed at some time in the past.

But, keep in mind that most of these railroads existed in the times when just about every steam locomotive was black, with an engine number on the locomotive and sometimes on the tender. No fancy designs, just functional numbers, and sometimes with printed railroad names or abbreviations.

If you look at CSX's predecessor railroad companies from the mid-1960's to the present (and exclude Conrail and its predecessors), the number of railroads that form this "section" of the family tree is 16 different railroad companies. Each of these railroad companies had a distinctive color scheme (and sometimes more than one), and each color scheme could be used as a "heritage" color.

However, I am definitely not holding my breath in expectant anticipation for CSX to rush a bunch of "heritage colors" out for us to foam over.

This topic is simply something for us to "dream and scheme" about, with extremely little potential of becoming reality.

Surprisingly, I have seen privately-owned industrial operations with their older locomotives being painted in ACL purple-and-silver and the successor paint scheme of black with yellow trim/stripes. I think that it is ironic that the private sector is preserving the old railroad paint schemes on their locomotive units.

To give credit to the Florida East Coast Ry, they did a historic paint job on one of their locomotives back in 2000.

ACLfan

[DJ]

According to:http://www.csx.com/share/media/tlic/doc ... F21816.pdf CSX claims the rights to the New York Central name. I'm not saying that they will do a NYC paint job.

I don't think you will EVER see a CSX heritage paint job for Conrail.

[octr202]

According to:http://www.csx.com/share/media/tlic/doc ... F21816.pdf CSX claims the rights to the New York Central name. I'm not saying that they will do a NYC paint job.

I don't think you will EVER see a CSX heritage paint job for Conrail.

That form reminded me of part of the Conrail breakup. As far as reporting marks go, NYC was assigned to CSX, all others were assigned to NS (i.e., a car with NYC reporting marks is CSXT's, any car with CR, PRR, or any other non-NYC Conrail predecessor's reporting marks is NS's car). Perhaps the NS inherited rights to the ownership of those names along with the reporting marks.

But yeah, we're not going to see anything painted, I bet. How 'bout a purple and silver ES44DC, anyone?

[ProRail]

In regards to Scotty Chaos' question

"but who can really lay claim to the railroads that went into Conrail??
PC
PRR
NYC
LV
EL
RDG
NH
CNJ
LNE
L&HR "

I have heard the New Haven Railroad Historical & Technical Association secured legal rights from the corporate entity that took over some of the Penn Central assets years ago to use the NH logos and name. The Connecticut DOT also has been using the McGinnis Era paint scheme for years on their FL9s and newer motive power. So that is one Fallen Flag you won't see CSXT honoring due to the inability of them to claim it unique to CSXT.

[conrail_engineer]

According to:http://www.csx.com/share/media/tlic/doc ... F21816.pdf CSX claims the rights to the New York Central name. I'm not saying that they will do a NYC paint job.

I don't think you will EVER see a CSX heritage paint job for Conrail.

Other short lines, notably the Adirondack Scenic Railroad and another tourist operation (name escapes me) are using NYC colors now. Be hard to stop them...CSX may own the NYC coding, but they have no claim on the paint scheme.

As for Conrail...there's a slew of old CR power still in original paint.

I'm with the others: I don't think CSX gives a rat's rearend about "heritage."

[Arborwayfan]

While we're dreaming, how about the Monon?