N-Trizzy2609 wrote: I sent a suggest for an Arrow II to IMW a week ago. The only thing that's going hold that back is the lack of Arrow II pictures. (I found only 10 good ones online so far after researching them for a month.) The Silverliner IV pair that's out can be use a model guide since the Arrow IIs are basically Silverliner IVs with center doors and smaller roof humps. (I believe they can't run in service with a Silveliner IV tho.) Also with the NJ Transit deal over with IMW, the only thing we can hope is that two different sets of number decals are made. One for PC/NJDOT, one with NJT numbers. If anything Arrow IIs to me right now are much more higher priority then Arrow III pairs. I'm like dying to own just a pair because they were first NJ Transit trains I rode. I can only remember so little but I have a picture of me next to car 1299 in Hoboken. Like I favor those over the IIIs.
If you only found "ten good shots" in a month, you haven't been looking long or hard enough. Also, buy some books, there are plenty of good shots in many Morning sun books and others relevant to the area.
Silverliner IVs and Arrow IIs came from the same order and were built at the same time. The only reason they are meant to work with different agencies (SEPTA vs. NJ DOT), and have different requirements. Indeed, The only major differences that come to mind are the Center doors, smaller roof humps, and center red markers (Silverliner IVs only have corner makers). I'm sure there are more, but the basic parts are the same. They were delivered with Faively pantographs, but towards the end of their operation, they could be seen with Stemmans.
Some Arrow IIs would be nice But i don't think they'll be that popular. Mike from IHP once told me that most people mostly just buy one or two models of the trains they ride to work all the time, and that those seeking to buy them as part of a commuter fleet aren't very common.
No one has taken a ride in an Arrow II (excluding those on the SEPTA work trains) since the late 90s. Whole lines of them were scrapped. The Arrow IIs were only in service about two years before the Arrow IIIs started arriving, Though the Arrow IIIs were originally meant to run on the then "re-electrified" Morris & Essex lines (from hoboken), they proved so reliable that they were retained for NEC trains, with the Arrow IIs being instead relegated to the former DL&W electrified routes. Their floors started to rot out by the mid 90s and that was it.
If there is one thing i've seemed to learn from observing other modelers, and reading the internet, is that only the past ten years or so seem to be popular with commuter modelers.
Accross the board, there is much contempt for the 1970s from which the Arrow IIs came, and few books or websites cover it, with even FEWER modeling it. Many DVDs and books that are from publishers like Morning sun cannot tell difference between and Arrow and a Silverliner, Let alone an Arrow I from an Arrow II.
In fact, i've seen books misidentify the SAME cars as two different types. On one page, there is an Arrow II misidentified as an Arrow III (OK, they do have the same body shell and its difficult to tell looking head on, despite roof humps being visible). On the very next page, there is another picture of the same Arrow II from the side and above (so everything is visible), though this time they misidentify it as an Arrow I, and even go so far as to comment that "only one of the pantographs is up". It didn't occur to anyone that this was an Arrow II Married pair, even when they noted the evidence that is a major identifying characteristic.
It may sound like i'm nitpicking, but this isn't isolated.
The bottom line is that the Arrow II does not stand out, and thats bad considering that Commuter trains like it are a Niche (electric trains) within a Niche (commuter trains) within a less popular subset of model railroading (passenger trains) in an unpopular time period (1970s-1990s), where freight operations are the most popular form of modeling (plenty of industrial short line layouts taking up small spaces these days). the kind of Mainline modeling required for a commuter train is unpopular and difficult to do in small and medium spaces.
Only us few die-hards are going to want these commuter trains, and i somehow doubt the demand for the Arrow II can come close to the demand for an Arrow III or Silverliner IV.
Elite Juice Jack Modeler.