Pilbara Iron Ore roads...

[Komachi]

Since this topic is picking up on another thread, I thought I'd move it out here in the open where more people would have access to it.

My interest in the Pilbara ore operations stems from my interest in the ore operations in my native Minnesota. I'm also fascinated with the "Pilbara rebuilds" performed on ALCo. and GE units operating in the region (those big, boxy cabs are quite interesting, at least in my opinion).

[Komachi]

I thought I'd catch everybody up on what the other people had been posting on the other thread before I moved the topic here...


David Benton wrote...

As far as the philbara iron ore operations , a news item on tv i saw , talked of the size of the whole operation been doubled , to cater for China's growing consumption .


Sir Ray wrote...

Heh, I didn't even realize that the old 'Non North American' forums had consolidated into one - I remember a British forum (where I asked about 'Slam-Door' Carriages), an European one, and a Australian/NZ forum (where it seemed our correspondent David 'Solar' Benton sometimes held a lonely vigil).

If I could only get them to consolidate a few more forums (like why is NJ light rail seperate from NJ transit...).

So, is the Australian iron ore from Philbara shipped using the new Darwin line? (I thought that was one of the reason it was constructed)


David Benton wrote...

the Pilbara ore railway is a stand alone operation , not connected to any other rail line . it is situated on the west australia coast , a long way from anywhere .
the Darwin line Was built to encourage sea frieght form south eat asia to Darwin , then rail to Southern Australia . Traffic on it is predicted to be light , until this trade picks up .
I think Darwin Getting a rail line was secondary to this aim , although obviously the benefits to Darwin are lower frieght costs , and tourisim form the passenger trains .


Then I moved the conversation here for all to enjoy. Have fun with it!

[Komachi]

David,

The Pilbara roads are totally autonomus from other lines in Austrailia? I was not aware of that. I thought they were just primarily ore handlers but also did general merchandise transfer with other roads in OZ as well. Interesting.

[Sir Ray]

Then, Sir Ray added:

http://www.railways.pilbara.net.au/index2.html

(After getting home from the club and before going to sleep)

Couldn't find the map they mentioned, however...

[David Benton]

im pretty sure they are , i better check my facts though .
They are definetly in Western australia , and afaik , the only lines that come anywhere near them would be narrow gauge .

[David Benton]

its definetly out there on its own . Around 1600 k.m north of Perth .

http://www.railpage.org.au/railmaps/central.htm

[Sir Ray]

Well, that site had a bit of a London Underground feel to it.

Actually it seemed a bit confusing because some info I think was missing - the color coding applied to the thick bands indicates certain Passenger train routes (which, BTW, the Gulflander seems to be the coolest looking), while the color coding applied to thin lines indicates frieght lines by type of gauge (Broad, Standard, Narrow). So nothing seems to indicate gauge of Passenger Lines[?], which I guess means nobody cares?.

Hmmmm...

[David Benton]

yes , they are basic maps , but the best i could find .
The Gulflander is indeed hard case . ive seen a couple of videos of it , real flavor of the outback . it seems that Australia is quite happy to subsidise these rural trains , which is great .
As far as gauge goes , the interstate lines , and Nsw lines are standard gauge , queensland is 3ft 6inch gauge , as is west australia , and parts of south australia . Victoria and the rest of south australia are wide gauge , 5ft 3inch . Tasmania is 3ft 6inch .

[Sir Ray]

yes , they are basic maps , but the best i could find .
The Gulflander is indeed hard case . ive seen a couple of videos of it , real flavor of the outback . it seems that Australia is quite happy to subsidise these rural trains , which is great .
As far as gauge goes , the interstate lines , and Nsw lines are standard gauge , queensland is 3ft 6inch gauge , as is west australia , and parts of south australia . Victoria and the rest of south australia are wide gauge , 5ft 3inch . Tasmania is 3ft 6inch .

Don't sweat it, the maps are fine.
Now, to the hoary old question - is there any movement afoot to standard gauge the remaining non-standard lines in Oz?
And are there any standard gauge lines (1435mm) in New Zealand?

[Komachi]

3'6"? That, incidentally is the standard gauge for the Japanese railway system. I haven't researched the subject to heavily, but is that a common guage in the East Asia/Austrailian/New Zealand region? Just currious. I'm also interested to know that since the guages are similar, is there much Japanese equipment that is in use in Oz/NZ? Would be interesting to see some JNR/JR type units in action down there.

[David Benton]

easy answer first , there are no 1435 mm lines in NZ . We have railcars , diesel locos , and electric locos built in Japans , as far as i know only the electric locos bear any resemblance to any japanese stock ive seen . there have been propsoals to buy secondhand japanese equipment for our passenger and commuter services , but none has come through so far .
I believe the queensland electric locos are japanese , hitachi , although i think they were built under liscence in Australia
i think most lines that are suitable for converting to 1435 mm gauge already have been . there is a proposal to build a Melbourne - Brisbane line , bypassing Sydney , and i think this would involve converting some queensland 1067 mm lines to standard gauge .

most south east Asia lines are 1000 mm , or metre gauge . that is Singapore , Malaysia , and Thailand . i think South vietnam as well .

[Guest]

Most British Empire lines were 3ft 6. Exceptions are East Africa (Kenya, Uganda, Tanzania - metre gauge) and Malaysia (metre gauge). There was quite a lot of metre gauge in India (from where the East African materials came). The Germans built metre gauge lines in Tanzania. There was also a 2ft gauge line in Sierra Leone - some of its carriages are now on the Llanfair and Welshpool (2ft 3.).

In Australia the more rural states adopted 3ft 6. So did New Zealand.

The story of the Broad gauge (Irish gauge) in South Australia and Victoria is well known.

There is a plan to change many of the lines in Victoria to standard. But Queensland probably has no such plan.

[george matthews]

Pilbara is entirely isolated. For some years it had a former GWR steam locomotive on its lines but that has now been returned to Britain.

Most British Empire lines were 3ft 6. Exceptions are East Africa (Kenya, Uganda, Tanzania - metre gauge) and Malaysia (metre gauge). There was quite a lot of metre gauge in India (from where the East African materials came). The Germans built metre gauge lines in Tanzania. There was also a 2ft gauge line in Sierra Leone - some of its carriages are now on the Llanfair and Welshpool (2ft 3.).

In Australia the more rural states adopted 3ft 6. So did New Zealand.

The story of the Broad gauge (Irish gauge) in South Australia and Victoria is well known.

There is a plan to change many of the lines in Victoria to standard. But Queensland probably has no such plan.

[David Benton]

Welcome George , to the worldwide Railfan forum . Thanks for your input .
I have started a seperate thread regarding railway gauges , which you might like to contribute too .

[David Benton]

I'd be interested in the history of the british choosing the metre gauge . The metre gauge tends to suggest a european influence . 1 metre been 3 foot , 3.37 inches , it seems unlikely this was a imperial measuremnt that just happened to be exactly 1 metre .any ideas ??