• Texas Central HSR (Houston - DFW Dallas Fort Worth)

  • General discussion of passenger rail proposals and systems not otherwise covered in the specific forums in this category, including high speed rail.
General discussion of passenger rail proposals and systems not otherwise covered in the specific forums in this category, including high speed rail.

Moderators: mtuandrew, gprimr1

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  by electricron
 
I don't see a problem at all. The railroad right -of-way is at least 100 feet wide and at grade. The viaduct over I-30 already has 4 tracks, with room for an additional 4 tracks. The HSR tracks will be 30 feet above them in height. The HSR station and parking facilities will be built on both sides of the existing railroad corridor just south of the I-30 viaduct. Amtrak and TRE have rights to run on the existing railroad corridor. Adding multiple platforms in the existing railroad corridor with so much room will not be difficult, the difficult part will be finding someone to finance them.
May I suggest the TRE?
  by chrsjrcj
 
There likely won't be Amtrak service in Texas by the time this gets built (if ever).
  by mtuandrew
 
Looks like Texas Central has more financial backing. https://www.dallasnews.com/news/transpo ... in-project" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Fair-use quote:
Texas Central lands $300 million loan for Dallas-to-Houston bullet train project
Ray Leszcynski, Communities; 9/14/18

Texas Central Partners has secured a $300 million loan to continue its pursuit of a new 240-mile high-speed rail route from downtown Dallas to Houston.

...

The loan is backed by Japanese sources, including the nation's only public-private fund that specializes in overseas infrastructure. Texas Central plans to use Japanese Shinkansen technology for its bullet train.
"This is a loan to be paid back with interest," the company said in a written statement Thursday. "It does not change the train's majority-Texan ownership."
When added to its current equity — much of which comes from its Texas investors — the loan will get the company to "the point at which all of the capital required to construct is fully committed" and construction is authorized, Texas Central officials said.
They sound bullish about getting FRA approval too.
  by electricron
 
Recent Texas Central news of note:
1) October 10, 2018 — Texas Central names global railway company Renfe as its high-speed train operating partner
2) October 04, 2018 — Texas Central Reaches Another Milestone With Addition of Salini Impregilo for Limited Notice to Proceed
3) September 13, 2018 - Texas Central Partners has secured a $300 million loan which Texas Central will use to move ahead on permitting, design and engineering, as well as other preliminary work needed to launch.
4) May 04, 2018 — Texas Central, Amtrak reach agreement to link Bullet Train and Amtrak’s interstate passenger network
5) May 02, 2018 — Texas Central Names Bechtel Project Manager for Bullet Train
6) February 5, 2018 — Texas Central picks preferred high-speed train passenger station in Houston
7) January 29, 2018 — Texas high-speed train unveils passenger station in Dallas
8) January 17, 2018 — Texas high-speed train unveils passenger station in Brazos Valley
9) December 15, 2017 — Texas Bullet Train moves ahead with federal environmental report
10) October 05, 2017 —Texas Central announces design-engineering firm WSP to join Texas Bullet Train team.

Recent Dallas City Council presentation about new intermodal hub near Texas Central station.
https://dallascityhall.com/government/C ... 100818.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;


Looks like this project is proceeding along slowly, but it appears steps are being made to start building it soon.
  by ziggyzack1234
 
Andrew -

The DEIS stated it was using the JR Central complete system, and everything in the DEIS is built around the N700 being the train used. They are bringing in Renfe simply to run the trains. At its core it's like many other operations in the US in which the railroad owns the equipment and a contractor operates it. Many of the commuter railroads have contracted operators, the MBTA commuter rail is run by Keolis (a subsidiary of SNCF) using MBTA/MassDOT owned equipment.

I was on that bandwagon that assumed JR Central was going to operate it given their depth of involvement with the project, but I guess they put it out to bid and Renfe was the winner.

Also, Renfe and Talgo are completely separate beings. Alstom also has nearly as heavy presence on the Renfe Spain roster as Talgo does, so equating Renfe with Talgo isn't really accurate.
  by Jadebenn
 
I assumed JR Central would operate it as well. Contracting it out to Renfe is certainly a move I didn't see coming. The only thing that could have possibly surprised me more would be another surprise takeover by a certain upstart American passenger train operator that's previously expressed interest in the corridor (hint-hint, nudge-nudge).

Back on topic, whatever behind-the-scenes agreement TCR's worked out with JR Central and the movers-and-shakers of the Japanese government still seems to be in play, leading me to assume that the deal was always meant to merely export the Shinkansen technology. It appears the JRs are more interested in marketing their technology to the States than actually running it there, and that's fine by me! This is still a win-win for both of us in the end. We get a cutting-edge train, they get a foot in the door.

My only concern is how well Renfe will adapt to this unique mix of technologies and cultural practices. They'll be operating an American railroad that was conceived by Texans, designed by Italians, teched out by the Japanese, and managed by Spaniards!

And people say the American melting pot is dead. :wink:
  by frequentflyer
 
electricron wrote:Recent Texas Central news of note:
1) October 10, 2018 — Texas Central names global railway company Renfe as its high-speed train operating partner
2) October 04, 2018 — Texas Central Reaches Another Milestone With Addition of Salini Impregilo for Limited Notice to Proceed
3) September 13, 2018 - Texas Central Partners has secured a $300 million loan which Texas Central will use to move ahead on permitting, design and engineering, as well as other preliminary work needed to launch.
4) May 04, 2018 — Texas Central, Amtrak reach agreement to link Bullet Train and Amtrak’s interstate passenger network
5) May 02, 2018 — Texas Central Names Bechtel Project Manager for Bullet Train
6) February 5, 2018 — Texas Central picks preferred high-speed train passenger station in Houston
7) January 29, 2018 — Texas high-speed train unveils passenger station in Dallas
8) January 17, 2018 — Texas high-speed train unveils passenger station in Brazos Valley
9) December 15, 2017 — Texas Bullet Train moves ahead with federal environmental report
10) October 05, 2017 —Texas Central announces design-engineering firm WSP to join Texas Bullet Train team.

Recent Dallas City Council presentation about new intermodal hub near Texas Central station.
https://dallascityhall.com/government/C ... 100818.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;


Looks like this project is proceeding along slowly, but it appears steps are being made to start building it soon.
So Amtrak gets moved out of Union? Is Union station on any historical registry? If not, I can see it being torn down, its on valuable real estate.
  by mtuandrew
 
frequentflyer wrote:So Amtrak gets moved out of Union? Is Union station on any historical registry? If not, I can see it being torn down, its on valuable real estate.
#32 alphabetically on the list, but second-oldest on the National Register from Dallas County: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_ ... nty,_Texas" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Even if it weren't on the Register it would be a valuable convention or redevelopment space. Amtrak probably will take its sweet time moving as well, so there will be passenger service to Dallas Union Terminal for quite a while.
  by electricron
 
Dallas' Union Station is owned by the city, and is used by DART light rail, TRE, and Amtrak trains.
If Amtrak decided to move to the potential new HSR station with its two trains a day service, there would be plenty of other trains to keep Union Station busy and open for business.
There would be no reason at all to tear it down and replace it with another structure.
  by CHTT1
 
There's no reason to believe Amtrak will be leaving Dallas Union Station. The linkup between Texas Central and Amtrak involves through ticketing, not an actual physical connection.
  by electricron
 
If the City of Dallas did build a new transit hub next to the new HSR station, they just might want Amtrak to move to it. Dallas does not have to lease space to Amtrak at Union Station. Amtrak doe not have to lease space from Dallas either, and could just skip Dallas and base all their operations in Fort Worth. Where about 10 years ago Fort Worth built a new transit hub and Amtrak quickly moved in. What happens in Fort Worth does not have to happen in Dallas, and vice versa.

We're discussing ifs - there's only one thing I am certain about, Amtrak will not spend an extra penny either way. Someone else would have to build every facility they will need and want at either location without any money from Amtrak.
  by Jadebenn
 
Agreed. As a former Denver resident, I would've loved to see Dallas redevelop Union Station into their central transportation hub of the area like Denver did with theirs. But I think the problem is there's just not enough space. If you want a vibrant, viable transportation hub, it needs to be in the center of a neighborhood that can support and nurture it. If there's not one already, you need to build it. Dallas Union station doesn't have the former, and the station is really too geographically constrained for the latter to be an option either.

The Texas Central Station might be off the beaten path currently, but that will definitely change if the project goes through. Developers will be foaming at the mouth to put "easy access to high-speed rail station" on their building ads. And if Denver's experience is anything to go by, that can result in a whole new section of the city sprouting up where nothing but dirt and weeds existed before.
  by electricron
 
Union Station in Dallas has already been refurbished or renewed once and Amtrak is using it.
Amtrak and Dallas are not the reasons why Texas Central needs to build an entirely new train station.
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