Some info about the Fremont Secondary (CSX)

Greetings, all!! This is just a question about the type of traffic control on the Fremont Secondary governing freight movements on and about the line between Oak Point and Fremont. I have heard the entire route is considered yard trackage, under the supervision of the Oak Point Yardmaster from Oak Point to Fremont. I had always thought the route was TWC (Track Warrant Control) using NORAC Form D's for movement, since the route theoretically is like Manual Block System (on MNR's Beacon Line, Danbury and Waterbury Lines), with no wayside or cab signal system in place. Is it considered yard track under the care of Oak Point Yardmaster, or is it TWC??? Thanks all!!

(Note: This will also be posted at the CSX forum as well, but was curious if anyone here, especially any NYAR employees, might know something about this)

This trackage today doesn't even warrant a page in the CSX timetable although it is referred to as the Fremont Industrial
Track and is spelled incorrectly with two r's as well. Current timetable does not mention under who's control this track falls
but I would think it would be the yardmaster at Oak Point. The nearest linked trackage under direct CSX dispatcher control
is the Hudson Subdivision north of CP-75, Poughkeepsie.
Under today's operations we have trackage that I guess considered "no man's land", it is not listed in the timetable nor is it
listed anywhere else in some cases. The trackage over Hell Gate Bridge is in day use by a yard job out of Oak Point to
Fremont to interchange with the New York and Atlantic.
Back in the New Haven days this line was double track, electrified, ABS territory and good for 40 MPH freight train speed in
each direction. We had around 4 round trips during my days, some periods more and some periods less.
With today's CSX operation the only requirement is a two way telemtry device due to the grades. There is no block system in
use of any kind, the crew is on their own. Restricted speed territory throughout.
Present track is old track 5, track 6 was oos in the last days of the NHRR due to a washout in Queens. Penn Central
officially took up old track 6 and made track 5 MBS rules although not until a fatal wreck caused by their sloppy operation
nearby.
After Amtrak took over the NEC and Market Tower (SS-4 in the NHRR days) was closed, control passed to the yardmaster at
Oak Point and no block system was in use after that time.
It is surprising to me that an operation like this is allowed to exist right next to the busy Northeast Corridor with significant
grades and heavy passenger traffic adjacent.
Noel Weaver

Unless things have changed, it is considered yard trackage under the jurisdiction of the Oak Point Yardmaster.

Jay

Noel,

Was that the collision at the East New York Tunnel?

technically its an "Industrial Track" but it is indeed under the control of the Oak Point Yardmaster.

shlustig wrote:Noel,

Was that the collision at the East New York Tunnel?

Yes.
Noel Weaver

Thanks everyone!! All this time I had thought it was like MNR's Manual Block territory, with Form D's (or in MNR's case, Form M's) governing what comes across the railroad and when. Didn't know a yardmaster can have control of such a lengthy expanse of railroad. Thanks for the info fellas, from one railfan/railroader to others!!!

So I guess the rest of the Bay Ridge is run in a similar fashion as well (albeit not controlled by Oak Point Yardmaster) from Fremont to 65th Street Yards

Hell I just learned recently that the LIRR Montauk Division between Richmond Hill and just east of LIC is manual block!!! Never knew that at all, and I even thought how could it be given I saw operational wayside signals (LIRR/PRR style 3-amber light position) at several points on the Montauk in that mentioned stretch. Manual Block does not have signals, other than maybe an "Approach Restricting", and that's when approaching signaled territory, and "Approach Restricting" signals do not relay block information. Learn something new everyday here!!

MNR's #1 Conductor wrote:Hell I just learned recently that the LIRR Montauk Division between Richmond Hill and just east of LIC is manual block!!! Never knew that at all, and I even thought how could it be given I saw operational wayside signals (LIRR/PRR style 3-amber light position) at several points on the Montauk in that mentioned stretch. Manual Block does not have signals, other than maybe an "Approach Restricting", and that's when approaching signaled territory, and "Approach Restricting" signals do not relay block information. Learn something new everyday here!! :-)

Not sure where you learned that, but the LIRR timetable shows ABS rules in effect with the current of traffic on tracks 1 & 2 between Bliss and Jay (the Lower Montauk). Manual block rules are in effect only for movements against the current of traffic. The position light signals you see are the ABS signals, they are not "Approach Restricting" signals.

Jim

By the way MNRR's#1Conductor, no CSX lines are controlled by Form D's as CSXT pulled out of NORAC & went to it's own Operating Rules on the former Con-Rail properties about 5 years ago. You would receive an EC-1, which is the equivalent of an M Form or a Form D.