The end for the B&O Indiana Division?

A couple of websites are reporting that CSX will file to abandon the east end of the ex-B&O Indiana Division between Aurora and North Vernon by the end of June.

Line would remain in place from North Vernon to Seymour to allow the Madison RR to connect to the L&I at the latter point.

Not mentioned, but surely the Seymour-Mitchell section would have to be under the gun as well.

Sad to see this line go, but the line east of Mitchell has almost no local traffic outside west of Aurora except right at Seymour. CSX has been able to coast on ROW work for several years, but I have to wonder if major trackwork is due. In addition, there are several large bridges on this line that are probably due for attention.

No surpise here at all. CSX tried to do away with that line back in 1986 or so but for some reason they withdrew the application. The line also has several tunnels that are well over 100 years old. Too bad to see it go but what can ya do? were does the traffic go now that used to run the old O&M?

I suspect it goes up to to Avon to plug into the St Louis gateway blocks going west from Indy.

CSX is most short-sighted railroad in the industry today. If they severe this line, the only major east-west route in central IN will be the BEE line. It would be wiser to keep the line for slower trains or for possible lease to a short line. At least NS did that. Some other idiot mistakes CSX has made include
-Tearing up the C&O of Indiana
-Severing the Monon north of Bedford, IN
-Tearing up the B&O CFincy main east of Greenfield.

Once a line is gone, it is gone. There have been rare exceptions over the years, but CSX is NOT one of those exceptions.

I have very, very, rarely seen CSX sell off a line they no longer want.. Rip it and run is the name of the game. CSX is doing things just like Conrail did back in the 1980s all over again...

MR77100 wrote:CSX is most short-sighted railroad in the industry today. If they severe this line, the only major east-west route in central IN will be the BEE line. It would be wiser to keep the line for slower trains or for possible lease to a short line. At least NS did that. Some other idiot mistakes CSX has made include
-Tearing up the C&O of Indiana
-Severing the Monon north of Bedford, IN
-Tearing up the B&O CFincy main east of Greenfield.

Once a line is gone, it is gone. There have been rare exceptions over the years, but CSX is NOT one of those exceptions.

CSX has been this way since its beginning. They have filed to abandon more then a few miles of track, then pull it from filing, then a few years later refile for the same segment.
The C&O of Indiana had a few issues so it was more understandably removed.
The Monon south of Greencastle was a washout nightmare, and like the south end of the C&OofI was "too curvy for midwestern mainline railroading" (to quote a top Chessie official at the time)
The B&O west of Parkersburg, well, not to sure about it.

Remember this, NS tried to rid itself of the Frankfort district back in the late 80's into the early 90's. For a long while they ran only a local over it, then when hotshots from Roanoke road the line, they saw how it could be used, thus 355-356, and now its the "GRAIN MAIN".

When you talk of short sighted, one must not forget Conrail under the thumb of L.Stanley Crane. He saw more miles of mainline removed then any other railroad president of his time. He put some of CSX/Chessie/SBD moves to shame.
All one has to do is think PRR Bradford Line! He saw the traffic that moved over this line disappear, he made it go away.

It's sad to see the old O&M line facing removal east of North Vernon. This spring has been its swan song. Hosting LCL sub detours, two through freights, and a few Hoosier Sub detours due to last weeks washouts, it was averaging 6 trains in 24 hours somedays. To bad most of the moves happened after dark or were going the wrong way in good light.

I couldn't imagine living in a place such as Marion, IN, North Judson, or Bradford, OH. and go from 25+ trains daily to nothing virtually overnight. It has been bad enough losing the Monon between Greencastle and Bedford over the last ten years. Mother nature aside, CSX has no foresight. For that matter most of the conglomerates don't. "We'll sacrifice service so long as we pay a dividend."
It's a shame.

-HoosierSubFan-

Well the deadline mentioned in the earlier posts has passed. Is there any update on the status of the Indiana Division? Also I will be shooting the blades on the Hoosier Sub in early July. Does any one have any schedules or approx. times for the trains running down that way?
Thanks
Zog

I will try to give a rough rundown on action on the "Hoosier Sub":
Northbound Q564 usually leaves Louisville around midnight, which means his run on the old Monon is during 1:00am & 3:00am.
Northbound Q686 usually leaves Louisville around 7:00pm so his run is during 8:00pm & 10:00pm.
As for the southbounds, there are three (Q565, Q553, Q687) and they can run anytime. There seems to be no schedule at all, and some days they both run via Vincennes-Evansville-Henderson-Louisville rather than Vincennes-Mitchell-Louisville.
There is also the Soo Line (CP Rail) which has no set running time, and I'm not sure if they even run every day anymore. The local usually plies the tracks between Pekin & New Albany and goes on duty at 11:00am Monday through Friday, but rarely does more than run out to Wilson (MP Q305) to get his train and then works Pillsbury in New Albany.

Chad

Any updates on the status on this line? Has it been torn up yet?

Latest had them running detours for washouts and a derailment.
CSX has found this line for detours, just hope that they see the value in it....

I have an update on the B&O Indiana sub. While in Deshler, Ohio this past July, I heard from a railfan that CSX has been running autorack trains on it to and from Cincy. Not sure what the frequency is, but at least the line is seeing unit trains.

CSX did withdraw the abandonment petition. It's now used as an "overflow valve" for the Louisville-Cincinnati "Short Line", which is a physically fragile, mostly single-track line line. As an example, CSX suffered a tunnel collapse last year, and decided to daylight Eagle Tunnel. This project is just now wrapping up.

CSX has running rights over the Louisville and Indianapolis from Louisville to Seymour, IN. Trains use the connection in the SE quadrant of the wye to access the Indiana sub and then run east to Cincy.

At the last time I was familiar with this operation, CSX generally ran two trains a day over this routing, usually eastbound. Only very limited local service runs between Seymour and Mitchell.

This can change almost daily - to keep tabs on this, check out J E Ladrums "Railroads of Cincinnati" site - operations on the Indiana line is always a topic of primary interest.

Can someone out there tell me why CSX continues to pour money into the "short line"? How many tunnels have they daylighted? They spend way to much money on this line I believe. The line has hardly a straight section. I don't think that the line can handle the traffic. Getting back to the old B&O from Cincy to St. Louis. Why in heavens name did they rip up the line from North Vernon to Louisville? Now they run a few trains a day over one of the most under utilized lines in their system to Seymore Indiana and south to Louisville. Whats wrong with CSX moving most if not all traffic now on the "short line" to the old B&O? Also, why not shift traffic off the line from Hamilton to Indy to the old B&O line to Seymore and head north to Indy? They have trackage rights over the intire L&I. As far as the CSX line from Louisville to Mitchell I'd get rid of it. Sell it off. Run those trains on the L&I to Seymore then west on the old B&O. I just don't like to see the line from a major yard (Queensgate) to another major connection, St. Louis be torn up. Not to long ago the B&O was the shortest distance from the east to St. Louis. Just my 2 cents.

Remeber that CSX management made the decision to get rid of the St. Louis Divison many years ago when traffic levels were down and invested capital dollars elsewhere. It's been practical to keep the line around for overflow traffic - but I still fear there is no real future for the line. Sooner or later, it's going to deteriorate past the point of practical use. With the kind of dollars needed to operate a heavy-duty main line, you can't justify rebuilding a duplicate main line unless there is a rock-solid future for adequate traffic.

The Short Line is by far the most direct route between Louisville and Cincinnati - which is still worth something. There is also a sizable chunk of profitable business at Carrollton KY in the form of a huge transloading facility. There is almost NO local traffic on the entire St. Louis Division west of Aurora.

Also - the L&I would need a great deal of work to bring it up to mainline standard, as would the St Louis Division, especially in terms of signalling.

The Cincy-Indy line is again more direct than going via Seymour.

There isn't very much St. Louis gateway traffic in Cincy, and very little overhead traffic for that direction flows through Queensgate. Getting loose-car traffic to St. Louis means Avon Yard in Indy from the East and Radnor Yard in Nashville (and Louisville to a small extent) from the South. Going directly to St. Louis from Cincinnati doesn't really mean much any more.

CSX terminal facilities in St. Louis are limited, and using the belt carriers (A&S, TRRA) is painfully slow and expensive. Hence, the strategy for the past several decades is to build what are essentially long-distance transfer runs at Avon which are run through St. Louis/Southern Illinois to places like Houston, North Little Rock, Pine Bluff, North Platte, Springfield MO, etc.

The Louisville-Mitchell-Vincennes route essentially replaced the L&N St. Louis route and the old Monon mainline to Chicago by plugging them into existing mains which had a secure future. It also could serve as a viable Cincy-St. Louis main line in combination with the Short Line if CSX ever does get rid of the old B&O. Thus, it can serve several masters, and is worth keeping.

This, of course, could all change tomorrow!