• The DMV needs all-day bi-drectional commuter rail service between DC, MD and VA.

  • Discussion related to DC area passenger rail services from Northern Virginia to Baltimore, MD. Includes Light Rail and Baltimore Subway.
Discussion related to DC area passenger rail services from Northern Virginia to Baltimore, MD. Includes Light Rail and Baltimore Subway.

Moderators: mtuandrew, therock, Robert Paniagua

  by RandallW
 
scratchyX1 wrote: Fri May 10, 2024 1:05 pm Sadly, Camden line trains seem to be the best positioned for Virginia run throughs, for now.
I think the Camden line trains are the ones that would get the most "VA resident to MD work" business--or to put it another way, extending VRE trains up the Camden line would have more benefits than extending the VRE up the Penn line or Brunswick line.
  by STrRedWolf
 
RandallW wrote: Sun May 12, 2024 5:45 am
scratchyX1 wrote: Fri May 10, 2024 1:05 pm Sadly, Camden line trains seem to be the best positioned for Virginia run throughs, for now.
I think the Camden line trains are the ones that would get the most "VA resident to MD work" business--or to put it another way, extending VRE trains up the Camden line would have more benefits than extending the VRE up the Penn line or Brunswick line.
As people keep forgetting, there's a few problems with that:
  • The VRE trainsets are gallery cars, exclusively low-platform. Which means you can't use them where there's even one high platform and no lows -- Camden Yards.
  • VRE trains are served from the low-platform, sunk-in tracks that lead to the First Street Tunnel. To get to the Brunswick Line means blocking off every track to get from roughly track 22-plus to the lead through QN Tower, and I cannot emphasize this enough, ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE K-TOWER SWITCH. That's a massive delay all around. The Capital Limited suffers this delay, and I got to experience that late last year, as it was Superliner equipment and it could only fit on those deep tracks. Twice in a day I think is enough, and I bet they'd love to get tracks 1-2 dug deeper to deal with Superliners quicker.
  • To add a further deathblow, The FBI is moving to Greenbelt, across the station. Folks are wanting to go there from Virginia. Guess what's there? A high platform. Sure, there's a low platform next to it, but any significant load to Greenbelt is going to be going out one gallery door and up a flight of steps to get back on the platform and exit the station. That makes absolutely no sense, and you also have to deal with wheelchairs to boot. Why bring equipment that's low-platform only into a mixed platform environment?
You want run through? VRE ether gets rid of the galley cars or MARC runs through Camden or Penn line trains and folks have to transfer.
  by scratchyX1
 
STrRedWolf wrote: Sun May 12, 2024 11:24 am
RandallW wrote: Sun May 12, 2024 5:45 am
scratchyX1 wrote: Fri May 10, 2024 1:05 pm Sadly, Camden line trains seem to be the best positioned for Virginia run throughs, for now.
I think the Camden line trains are the ones that would get the most "VA resident to MD work" business--or to put it another way, extending VRE trains up the Camden line would have more benefits than extending the VRE up the Penn line or Brunswick line.
As people keep forgetting, there's a few problems with that:
  • The VRE trainsets are gallery cars, exclusively low-platform. Which means you can't use them where there's even one high platform and no lows -- Camden Yards.
  • VRE trains are served from the low-platform, sunk-in tracks that lead to the First Street Tunnel. To get to the Brunswick Line means blocking off every track to get from roughly track 22-plus to the lead through QN Tower, and I cannot emphasize this enough, ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE K-TOWER SWITCH. That's a massive delay all around. The Capital Limited suffers this delay, and I got to experience that late last year, as it was Superliner equipment and it could only fit on those deep tracks. Twice in a day I think is enough, and I bet they'd love to get tracks 1-2 dug deeper to deal with Superliners quicker.
  • To add a further deathblow, The FBI is moving to Greenbelt, across the station. Folks are wanting to go there from Virginia. Guess what's there? A high platform. Sure, there's a low platform next to it, but any significant load to Greenbelt is going to be going out one gallery door and up a flight of steps to get back on the platform and exit the station. That makes absolutely no sense, and you also have to deal with wheelchairs to boot. Why bring equipment that's low-platform only into a mixed platform environment?
You want run through? VRE ether gets rid of the galley cars or MARC runs through Camden or Penn line trains and folks have to transfer.
Or they collaborate on gear that can do either platform.
Having a high level lower platform would help.
  by scratchyX1
 
STrRedWolf wrote: Mon May 13, 2024 6:18 am
scratchyX1 wrote: Sun May 12, 2024 7:51 pm Or they collaborate on gear that can do either platform.
Having a high level lower platform would help.
It's called the MARC IV.
Exactly, VRE orders some, and then the contractors for the two agencies work out how to crew the "DMV express".
Or They see if EMU versions can also be BMU/DMU, for the added acceleration.
I'm guessing VRE run trough all the way to Camden station?
  by MACTRAXX
 
Everyone: Good thoughts about full-time Commuter Rail service between Baltimore, Washington and
into VRE territory in Northern Virginia...CSX is or was against any added service on the Brunswick Line
in the aftermath of the February 16, 1996 head-on crash in Silver Spring: A MARC eastbound afternoon
reverse-commuter train collided with the westbound Capitol Limited at an interlocking W of the Metro
Red Line tunnel entrance - the MARC train's cab car was forward with the locomotive in push mode.

https://wikipedia.org/wiki/1996_Marylan ... _collision

I remember that CSX forced MARC to end any service after that point outside the weekday prime direction
commuter trains between Martinsburg, Brunswick, Frederick and Washington: AM Peak eastbound and
PM Peak westbound...28 years later would CSX now allow Brunswick Line MARC service additions?

MACTRAXX
  by STrRedWolf
 
MACTRAXX wrote: Mon May 13, 2024 5:56 pm I remember that CSX forced MARC to end any service after that point outside the weekday prime direction
commuter trains between Martinsburg, Brunswick, Frederick and Washington: AM Peak eastbound and
PM Peak westbound...28 years later would CSX now allow Brunswick Line MARC service additions?
Only if they expanded capacity with extra rail laid down. Unfortunately you'll still have a bottleneck south of Silver Springs, as there's no room to do it.
  by scratchyX1
 
STrRedWolf wrote: Mon May 13, 2024 7:19 pm
MACTRAXX wrote: Mon May 13, 2024 5:56 pm I remember that CSX forced MARC to end any service after that point outside the weekday prime direction
commuter trains between Martinsburg, Brunswick, Frederick and Washington: AM Peak eastbound and
PM Peak westbound...28 years later would CSX now allow Brunswick Line MARC service additions?
Only if they expanded capacity with extra rail laid down. Unfortunately you'll still have a bottleneck south of Silver Springs, as there's no room to do it.
The service expansion plan has flyovers and turnarounds at either silver spring or rockville, with folks using metro rail to continue journey.
Silver Spring would be pricier, as It would require much bridging . But it would also have connections to the Flash bus "BRT", and purple line LRT.
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  by Robert Paniagua
 
WMATA should have taken over commuter rail operations in the DMV area back in the late 70s to serve the outer suburbs that are now served by MARC and VRE. Would have been nice to see the silver and brown stripe with the M logo on the commuter trains too. And I feel it it were done earlier that waiting longer, it would have been better
  by scratchyX1
 
Robert Paniagua wrote: Wed May 29, 2024 9:37 am WMATA should have taken over commuter rail operations in the DMV area back in the late 70s to serve the outer suburbs that are now served by MARC and VRE. Would have been nice to see the silver and brown stripe with the M logo on the commuter trains too. And I feel it it were done earlier that waiting longer, it would have been better
I didn't think there were commuter trains on RF&P back then. And there was "electric commuter railroad" to dulles on W&OD in the original plan, but there wasn't the budget to acquire it, at the time.
  by Sand Box John
 
Robert Paniagua
WMATA should have taken over commuter rail operations in the DMV area back in the late 70s to serve the outer suburbs that are now served by MARC and VRE. Would have been nice to see the silver and brown stripe with the M logo on the commuter trains too. And I feel it it were done earlier that waiting longer, it would have been better


WMATA taking over the commuter rail service, serving the Washington area would require the revision of the WMATA compact to include the counties in Maryland and Virginia and maybe even *Wast Virginia served by the commuter rail operation. To prevent the revised WMATA compact from become like SEPTA, board member representing the counties and municipalities served only by the commuter rail operations, would need to be excluded from voting on matters Metrorail and Metrobus.

* Adding West Virginia to WMATA compact would require an act of Congress to make them part of the compact.
  by CNJGeep
 
STrRedWolf wrote: Sun May 12, 2024 11:24 am The Capital Limited suffers this delay, and I got to experience that late last year, as it was Superliner equipment and it could only fit on those deep tracks. Twice in a day I think is enough, and I bet they'd love to get tracks 1-2 dug deeper to deal with Superliners quicker.
Superliners absolutely fit upstairs. From time to time they'll put one there to film company propaganda with.

29 normally leaves off 8 Track to avoid exactly the problem you're describing at the start of rush hour.

30 usually arrives on 15 Track, although it does go lower level from time to time if the shove to the wye needs to be expedited.
  by STrRedWolf
 
It must of been one of these days when I came home from Chicago. I remember them waiting for a berth and then having to swing all the way over and down, which I rightfully assumed was the default case because Superliners.

Still, you get the idea. It has to swing out and block all the traffic.