“Skyline” Light Rail = Honolulu

They passed the ballot proposition to build (and I quote) a "a steel wheel on steel rail transit system". Possibly the most technology-specific question I've ever seen on a ballot.

Were there aever any streetcars in Hawaii in the past?

Abdul Alhazred wrote:Were there aever any streetcars in Hawaii in the past?

Yes. Honolulu had a streetcar system, actually three different systems over the years around the turn of the last century, starting with a horse (mule) car operation, superceded by electric streetcars running up until 1941, some trackless trolleys until 1958, with gasoline, diesel, etc. buses to the present time.

Recommended reading (if you can find them) R. Melvin & R. Ramsay, Hawaiian Tramways; M. Simpson, J. Brizdle, Streetcar Days in Honolulu.

Different elevated fixed guideway systems including monorail have been discussed in recent years. The initial route as last envisioned would be from western suburbs (Ewa; Waipahu) to just east of downtown (Ala Moana Center) with the next extension towards University of Hawaii which is a little further east (northeast).

Do I need an Hawaiin rail fan forum? LOL. Lots of news today:

http://www.the-dispatch.com/article/201 ... rintpicart

But sometime this spring, a $5.3 billion project is scheduled to rise from the Kapolei farmlands that offers powerful evidence of how much this island, a symbol of Pacific tranquillity, is changing. A 40-year battle to build a mass transit line appears to be nearing its end. Barring a court intervention, construction is to begin in March on a 20-mile rail line that will be elevated 40 feet in the air, barreling over farmland, commercial districts and parts of downtown Honolulu, and stretching from here to Waikiki.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/01/04/us/ha ... =me&ref=us

The two-track line —a 30-foot-wide span, with 21 elevated stations — is designed to accommodate an increasing crush of commuters and tourists while encouraging new growth and development, particularly on this undeveloped part of the island. The Honolulu rail project, scheduled for completion in 2018, seems certain to change sharply the nature of much of the south side of the island, as well as downtown Honolulu.

Mostly the same stuff verbatim: http://www.contracostatimes.com/rss/ci_ ... source=rss

And the official site: http://honolulutransit.org/

neroden wrote:They passed the ballot proposition to build (and I quote) a "a steel wheel on steel rail transit system". Possibly the most technology-specific question I've ever seen on a ballot.

I think the reason it was so specific was because opponents of the project tried to get their own ballot proposition requiring a "bus-only" transit system or something like that.

What they have plan to build in Honolulu isn't light rail. It's more akin to elevated heavy rail than light rail for several reasons, (1) 100% grade separation, (2) 100% third rail, and (3) 100% fully automatic. The only way one might suggest it's more akin to light rail is the relatively short length of the trains and correspondingly the short station platforms.

electricron wrote:What they have plan to build in Honolulu isn't light rail.

Thread retitled.

Subways or any other transit...This in a city that spends 200,000,000 on one subway station
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/01/04/us/ha ... =me&ref=us

I'll agree the New York Times is biased and opinionated. Surprisingly, for a newspaper that takes pride at being fair with its reporting of the news, this specific article fails to mention the 2008 referendum where the rail line won 53% of the vote. Maybe the transit line didn't win by a supermajority, it did win a majority. But at least the newspaper should acknowledge that the referendum for the train passed.

Friday's Wall Street Journal reports "the project's in trouble":

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000142 ... 81118.html

Brief passage:

• HONOLULU—The leading mayoral candidate in Hawaii's capital wants to derail plans for the state's first urban rail system, just as major construction is set to begin.
  
  For 40 years, city planners have pushed for a rail system here to alleviate traffic on Oahu, Hawaii's most populated island. In 2008, city voters endorsed a 20-mile elevated system now estimated to cost $5.2 billion. Construction on the project's elevated portions is scheduled to begin in March.
  
  But former Gov. Ben Cayetano's unexpected entry into the Honolulu mayor's race could throw a wrench into what would be one of the largest transit projects in the U.S., at a time when other rail projects around the country are also under fire.
  
  Mr. Cayetano, a Democrat, says he joined the race in January specifically to kill the project. If he wins, he says, "I will pull the plug on rail." It isn't clear if he could actually kill the project if elected, though he certainly could create obstacles.

Sure looks likes Former Gov. Cayetano, and now a Honolulu mayoral candidate, is from the same mold as are his "mainland colleagues" with names such as Kasisch, Scott, and Walker.

One big difference: this fellow is a Demmie; anti-rail can X party lines..

The mayor alone doesn't have the authority to kill the project, which has already passed a public referendum and received the approval of the city council.

It can only be killed by a majority vote of the city council.

Does anyone with a good understanding of Hawaii politics want to explain why Cayetano is so firmly against the rail project? I understand that some in the area see the train as a symbol of Honolulu growing up from a small town into a large metropolis, something some people don't want to see happen.

M&Eman wrote:Does anyone with a good understanding of Hawaii politics want to explain why Cayetano is so firmly against the rail project? I understand that some in the area see the train as a symbol of Honolulu growing up from a small town into a large metropolis, something some people don't want to see happen.

Over $4 Billion to build, Millions of $ yearly to operate and maintain. Anytime that much money is at stake, you'll find opponents.

(not to be answered in the next 60 seconds)

Does the mayor of Honolulu travel regularly to and from work in obedience of traffic laws and unaccompanied by flashing lights and sirens?

Or for that matter does the governor of Hawaii, which Ben Cayetano was formerly.

(I was going to pose the same question regarding former Massachusetts governor J. Swift, who lived in western Massachusetts.but I did not come upon a discussion suitable for injecting said question.)

This is interesting.

When I was visiting Ohau, I thought how it seemed that a light rail was missing. The population is pretty dense, the island is not all that large, and there are well defined tourist destinations.

You also have large amounts of military in barracks style housing, and tourists.

Sounds like a good mix