Siemens Venture Single Level Cars for CA/IL/Midwest

rohr turbo wrote: ↑Fri Feb 12, 2021 4:55 pm

Ridgefielder wrote: ↑Fri Feb 12, 2021 2:43 pm ...there are plenty of Boeing 737's and such from the 1970's that are still flying.

Actually no 1970s era 737s have flown in US scheduled passenger service since 2008 (Wiki). Possibly a handful might still be flying in 3rd world countries. Mechanical systems eventually wear out and need replacement, especially if passenger lives are at stake.

My general point is that stuff like rolling stock or airliners has a multi-decade lifespan in the private sector, too-- Amfleets wouldn't have been replaced 2x over since 1975 even if they were owned by, say, Kansas City Southern.

As for public sector well... ponder the B-52.

Ridgefielder wrote:

eolesen wrote: ↑Thu Jan 28, 2021 2:04 am Sure, it's a testament to Budd, but private industry would have already replaced their equipment at least twice since 1971...

I'm not too sure about that. To look away from the rails for a moment-- there are plenty of Boeing 737's and such from the 1970's that are still flying.

Uh, no. Pressurization cycles their toll on aluminum over time, and airplanes with over 50,000 cycles get painfully expensive to maintain.

Not too many 40+ year old jets still flying... even Travolta's 707 has been grounded for the past four years.

Anything built before 1985 is likely not going to be Stage 3 noise reg compliant and there are perfectly good 25 year old airplanes available for less than the cost of reengining a tapped out airframe.

Comparing that to a railcar... the wear and tear from being in service seems to be pretty much limited to the draft gear, wheelsets and brakes.

Sent from my SM-G981U using Tapatalk

Your B52 example is unique. High hours indeed but very low cycles relative to age because they didn't fly daily let alone 3-5 flights a day.

Sent from my SM-G981U using Tapatalk

Plus manufacterers are getting better at matching the lifespan of components to the lifespan of the vehicle. So when a vehicle hits its 15 - 20 year end of life , most components are worn out .

Ah, the wonder that is planned obsolescence.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

Eight single level coaches spotted behind a UP GEVO recently.

Is Siemens meeting promised deliveries ? Have to wonder if the world wide shortage of computer chips will cause delays either now or in the future ?

This Sacramento Bee report may shed light as to why none of the 137 Venture cars they are building for three different State rail passenger agencies have been placed in revenue service:

Fair Use:

In September 2012, California’s transportation agency announced it was leading a multi-state partnership to buy more than 100 new passenger railcars, each one assembled on American soil. Funded in part by the Obama administration’s economic stimulus plan, the cars would start arriving in late 2015.

Instead, the project has gone badly off the rails.

Nine years after the contract was announced, not a single car has gone into service. The original manufacturer couldn’t make cars that met crashworthiness tests. And now the second manufacturer — the Siemens assembly plant in Sacramento, which took over in 2017 — has been wrestling for months with a plumbing-fixture problem that rendered the cars unfit for passengers.

The issue with Siemens: Excessive levels of lead have been found in some of the cars’ restroom water supplies, discovered during routine testing last November, said Caltrans spokesman Christopher Clark

Wouldn't it be great if these foreign-owned rail equipment builders could "have what it takes" to be Budd and simply state "here is what we will deliver in this time frame, and here's what it will cost you. We don't know what a Change Order is. So if you want your cars, it's take it or leave it".

No wonder the Amfleets have been the most successful procurement Amtrak has enjoyed to date.

Lead in the potable water ? If Siemens used copper pipe sound like the joints were not properly soldered ? If my plumbing friends would have done the work they would have used crosslinked PEX that used steel pipes for encasing the PEX. PEX withstands freezing very well as it expands and then contracts to original size and shape. No soldering and just use quick on fitting or can use compression fittings.

Lead in the line ... me thinks it might be an issue with the fresh water holding tanks rather than the joints in the water lines. If it was merely the piping to the fountains or sinks, you would think it could be swapped out.

A shame that these cars are further delayed. Turn off the fountains and hand out water while you figure out a fix. (BTW, never drink airplane water from the onboard tank--not lead but other nasties).

From:
https://www.epa.gov/sdwa/use-lead-free- ... king-water

Section 1417 of the Safe Drinking Water Act (SDWA) establishes the definition for “lead free” as a weighted average of 0.25% lead calculated across the wetted surfaces of a pipe, pipe fitting, plumbing fitting, and fixture and 0.2% lead for solder and flux. The Act also provides a methodology for calculating the weighted average of wetted surfaces.

The Act prohibits the “use of any pipe, any pipe or plumbing fitting or fixture, any solder, or any flux, after June 1986, in the installation or repair of (i) any public water system; or (ii) any plumbing in a residential or non-residential facility providing water for human consumption, that is not lead free.”

The exemptions are:

The SDWA includes several exemptions from the lead free requirements, specifically for plumbing devices that are used exclusively for nonpotable services, as well as a list of specific products: toilets, bidets, urinals, fill valves, flushometer valves, fire hydrants, tub fillers, shower valves, service saddles, or water distribution main gate valves that are 2 inches in diameter or larger.

So how can there be lead in the drinking water?????

Where are they getting the water from to fill the tanks? Is that too obvious?

Wonder if Brightline tests their water for lead?

Lack of transparency means we will probably never know why there is too much lead in the water of these train cars. We will just have to trust the manufacturer and train operator when they state the water is safe to drink. Yeah, you have to be kidding us. Meanwhile. others will now fell free to opine why and what needs to be done to fix it. Lack of transparency usually leads to conspiracies, and no one will ever trust drinking any water on these trains that they did not bring onto the trains themselves. Now is the time to give the specific details so we can evaluate if their fix works or not. Why did a test result made in November take until June to become public? Did it really take 6 months to discover where the lead came from? How long will it take to fix the problem? Is there any pressure to clear this problem at all? We should not have to rely upon speculation from those who really do not know why.

Gilbert B Norman wrote: ↑Wed Jun 02, 2021 5:30 pm Wouldn't it be great if these foreign-owned rail equipment builders could "have what it takes" to be Budd and simply state "here is what we will deliver in this time frame, and here's what it will cost you. We don't know what a Change Order is. So if you want your cars, it's take it or leave it".

No wonder the Amfleets have been the most successful procurement Amtrak has enjoyed to date.

That was before MTA Maryland came and said "We gave you these specs, and you bid for this price. Now you say it's this new inflated price, take it or leave it. We're going to the judge to force you to the original contract."

And then they convinced a judge to force Budd to build the subway cars to order.

Budd got out of the business after they delivered the cars.

bostontrainguy wrote: ↑Thu Jun 03, 2021 7:30 am Where are they getting the water from to fill the tanks? Is that too obvious?

Wonder if Brightline tests their water for lead?

And is the plumbing / tanks different from the Brightline cars?