• SEPTA Rebuilding for the Future Updates

  • Discussion relating to Southeastern Pennsylvania Transportation Authority (Philadelphia Metro Area). Official web site can be found here: www.septa.com. Also including discussion related to the PATCO Speedline rapid transit operated by Delaware River Port Authority. Official web site can be found here: http://www.ridepatco.org/.
Discussion relating to Southeastern Pennsylvania Transportation Authority (Philadelphia Metro Area). Official web site can be found here: www.septa.com. Also including discussion related to the PATCO Speedline rapid transit operated by Delaware River Port Authority. Official web site can be found here: http://www.ridepatco.org/.

Moderator: AlexC

  by PHLSpecial
 
Septa doesn't have money. Understandable we are in PA. This expand is just a plan like in the 1980s. All talk no funding or action. Sure some of it is ambitious can not happen without further funding. Sure Septa has no control over the zoning codes.

What can't understand is why a regional rail system can not be an all day service. The way it's present is focus on the work commuters and keep the poor people off the RR. I come from those poor areas and it's frustrating that the poor people areas should not be invested in. Septa PD and the PPD needs to secure the city so that we all can feel safe. 30 years from now I know we will still be talking about why aren't those infill stations built and why RR can't be 15 minutes for certain lines. Maybe 30 years from now we can at least loosen the zoning codes around Septa stations.

For Septa to even expand they need more yards and trainsets. With the SL6 I doubt we can order more than 240 cars.
To Sum it up Septa can't expand without dedicated funds, secured stations, commuter riders still the focus, and infill stations is just a pipedream. I don't see how any of this is going to change with the 4 other counties just refusing to expand service.
  by foxclan
 
My problem with plan 2 is that trains stop at Radnor in both directions. Outside of rush hour service anyone going to or from beyond Radnor will need to transfer to go any further. That by itself kills that option for me full stop.
  by scratchyX1
 
MACTRAXX wrote: Fri May 13, 2022 9:05 am
Scratch - High Level Platforms everywhere ($$$) and automatic doors - which in case you do NOT know the Silverliner Four cars already have - can be used to maybe speed up train stop time periods...

Have you actually ever been to Media? The area between the Orange Street ending of #101 and the Media RRD Station is very hilly - the line would have to go down hill to the station at a grade percentage the LRV cars may not be able to adequately handle - and be treacherous in Winter when the grade is icy...

Security at infill stations is going to cost major money for the Police presence and surveillance cameras that stations in questionable or high crime areas will require for riders to be confident that they are safe...
It is that simple...MACTRAXX
I knew the silverliner 4 have automatic doors, I assumed the other gear doesn't.

Media
Looking at the hill in Google maps, it's not worse than ones the Pittsburgh LRVs use, I imagine the new ones will be able to do so.
Though, orange street Is so narrow, I don't know if a track could go in..
Well, without removing street parking.

Public safety
It's complicated, more cameras and uniformed staff, septa can ask money for.
But community watch, and opportunities so that someone doesn't resort to
Robbing someone else for funds.
Bigger issue
Last edited by nomis on Mon May 16, 2022 8:17 am, edited 1 time in total. Reason: cleaned up quote
  by rcthompson04
 
foxclan wrote: Fri May 13, 2022 12:01 pm My problem with plan 2 is that trains stop at Radnor in both directions. Outside of rush hour service anyone going to or from beyond Radnor will need to transfer to go any further. That by itself kills that option for me full stop.
Yes. Why not run the same train all the way from Center City to Thorndale for the hourly run? That would deter some ridership.
  by andrewjw
 
Surely that's how it would actually be operated... just harder to illustrate that it would be a peak express then.
  by west point
 
My take it is because of obsolete parts supply. Builders use propriety parts and in 10 - 20 years no one can get parts that are no longer made. Cal Train might buy up critical parts. Very bad that all parts are made from open source. Especially electronics. P-42s beginning to have this problem.
  by PHLSpecial
 
foxclan wrote: Fri May 13, 2022 12:01 pm My problem with plan 2 is that trains stop at Radnor in both directions. Outside of rush hour service anyone going to or from beyond Radnor will need to transfer to go any further. That by itself kills that option for me full stop.
So you can respond to the plan. Remember this is a draft not a final design. Septa needs which model to use for the future. Septa can definitely extend out to Paoli.
  by rcthompson04
 
PHLSpecial wrote: Wed May 18, 2022 5:39 pm
foxclan wrote: Fri May 13, 2022 12:01 pm My problem with plan 2 is that trains stop at Radnor in both directions. Outside of rush hour service anyone going to or from beyond Radnor will need to transfer to go any further. That by itself kills that option for me full stop.
So you can respond to the plan. Remember this is a draft not a final design. Septa needs which model to use for the future. Septa can definitely extend out to Paoli.
I have made my thoughts known on the subject and might go to the open house next Wednesday at Jefferson Station.

The approach I am taking is actually to talk to the people who really matter on this topic... my representatives in Harrisburg. SEPTA basically needs every vote in can get out of metro Philadelphia. If they start losing support from state representatives and senators in Chester County this is likely DOA. I think this is generally a waste of time and money as where is the money coming from for this experiment.
  by mcgrath618
 
Option 1 is the best in my opinion, as it doesn't require any of the annoying transfers in Option 2, and has plenty of room for expansion/better headways, should the funding and personnel become available.
  by rcthompson04
 
mcgrath618 wrote: Thu May 19, 2022 9:28 am Option 1 is the best in my opinion, as it doesn't require any of the annoying transfers in Option 2, and has plenty of room for expansion/better headways, should the funding and personnel become available.
I agree. Option 1 probably the best bang for the buck and something I could support.
  by mcgrath618
 
rcthompson04 wrote: Thu May 19, 2022 11:01 am
mcgrath618 wrote: Thu May 19, 2022 9:28 am Option 1 is the best in my opinion, as it doesn't require any of the annoying transfers in Option 2, and has plenty of room for expansion/better headways, should the funding and personnel become available.
I agree. Option 1 probably the best bang for the buck and something I could support.
Then vote. If you go to the planning website you can vote for your favorite.
  by PHLSpecial
 
mcgrath618 wrote: Thu May 19, 2022 9:28 am Option 1 is the best in my opinion, as it doesn't require any of the annoying transfers in Option 2, and has plenty of room for expansion/better headways, should the funding and personnel become available.
Doesn't option 1 require a bunch of double tracking in places? Or at the minimum more sliding's? Also wouldn't Amtrak get annoyed if the CHW is every 30 minutes? Option 1 I assume is the cheapest to implement because not to much addition infrastructure is need?
  by mcgrath618
 
PHLSpecial wrote: Thu May 19, 2022 3:40 pm
mcgrath618 wrote: Thu May 19, 2022 9:28 am Option 1 is the best in my opinion, as it doesn't require any of the annoying transfers in Option 2, and has plenty of room for expansion/better headways, should the funding and personnel become available.
Doesn't option 1 require a bunch of double tracking in places? Or at the minimum more sliding's? Also wouldn't Amtrak get annoyed if the CHW is every 30 minutes? Option 1 I assume is the cheapest to implement because not to much addition infrastructure is need?
All of the options require massive infrastructure upgrades. WAR is getting double tracked for a significant portion in the coming years, meaning that the only significant single-track lines are FOX and DOY (Cynwyd doesn't count because it would be rather easy to have one train go as another leaves).
  by MACTRAXX
 
MCG - SEPTA and CSX were “separated” on the Fox Chase Line around 20 years ago…
That is when the catenary was removed from above the CSX NYSL track along with
the passing siding near Lawndale being in placed in service. The original single track
segment was from Cheltenham Junction to just west of Fox Chase Station.

I am going to look over more these three “transitization” RRD options…MACTRAXX
  by mcgrath618
 
MACTRAXX wrote: Fri May 20, 2022 6:44 am MCG - SEPTA and CSX were “separated” on the Fox Chase Line around 20 years ago…
That is when the catenary was removed from above the CSX NYSL track along with
the passing siding near Lawndale being in placed in service. The original single track
segment was from Cheltenham Junction to just west of Fox Chase Station.

I am going to look over more these three “transitization” RRD options…MACTRAXX
FXC is getting double tracked eventually. It's on our radar.
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