Rail & Post-Indus. Economy in Maine. Return to 19th Cen.?

fogg1703 wrote:Penobscot Frozen Foods.

Their twice-baked potatoes are delicious! http://www.penobscotmccrum.com/products/twice-baked.php" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

MEC407 wrote:Their twice-baked potatoes are delicious! http://www.penobscotmccrum.com/products/twice-baked.php" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Indeed. And they are still in business at the same location on the Belfast waterfront after McCrum bought Penobscot Frozen Foods assets in 2004.

KEN PATRICK wrote:tofc is limited by truck 80k hence the failure of earlier potato moves. cofc would have had a better chance since the railcar weight advantage over truck is better apportioned.
as for backhaul? railroad billing prevents utilization of the backhaul move. think about it. what o/d pairs have return traffic that can be handled in a fashion similar to the outbound. railroad billing systems cannot handle such a move even on a partial basis. in fact changing the destination for an empty move requires management involvement. and of course unit trains are far more expensive than cofc in merchandise trains.
based on earlier posts, i think cofc could reduce transportation by 1/2. wouldn't that permit farmers to enjoy more gross profit?
lastly, composite containers? more taxpayer grants chasing a non-starter. 20' corten container $10k us, $8k venezuela, $6k south korea. composite railcar- never. the students would be better served by avoiding these 'grants' ken patrick

It was actually comissioned by Homeland Security, take a look on Page 8.
http://www2.umaine.edu/aewc/images/stor ... 202012.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Someday, I envision manufacturing of windmill parts and/or composites to be a key export in the State and to replace lost mill jobs. If anyone is interested in a tour of the facility, feel free to PM me and I will see what I can arrange. Having gone on a few tours myself, it is quite impressive.

Could potatoes be moved in hopper cars equipped with refrigeration? Is there even such a thing?

gokeefe wrote:Could potatoes be moved in hopper cars equipped with refrigeration? Is there even such a thing?

They'd be subject to way too much damage in the loading and unloading process to ship them in a hopper. The skins would tear.

Ridgefielder wrote:

gokeefe wrote:Could potatoes be moved in hopper cars equipped with refrigeration? Is there even such a thing?

They'd be subject to way too much damage in the loading and unloading process to ship them in a hopper. The skins would tear.

Even when they're already handled like this?

intermodal need not be confined aggregation ramps. the beauty is it's inexpensive to establish a truck to rail transfer. simply 200' of tangent track and alongside 100' hardpan to handle a 50ton top pick . lights etc. you don't need existing intermodal ramps . i know nothing of the current logistics but reading the posts, i believe there are sheds that house vast quantities. a simple move from shed to the nearest track . i'm surprised that no one seems to appreciate the vast margin available for intermodal.
now, as for history. i've always written that tofc is flawed with the 80k truck gateway. the current move to 107# gvw with an additional axle is marginal at best. but it does help cofc since the weight is more evenly divided. i intend on asking nbsr and pan am to look at this as well as a farmers group. to move forward is a complex undertaking. i ask that all readers herein give some thought to this . you need to appreciate that what you know about intermodal has been limited by equipment thinking. what really counts is providing a railroad with thinking outside the box. ken patrick

Ken, could I ask why TOFC is disadvantaged due to the 80K GVW, when COFC is governed by the same limit?

BTW, the proposals to increase GVW on interstates is not for 107K, but 97K with a third axle.

Bangor Daily News had an article this week on how the Maine Military Authority is being repurposed for transit bus overhauls.
http://bangordailynews.com/2014/01/16/politics/lepage-boosts-first-ever-bus-refurbishment-in-maine-as-potential-boon-for-cities-schools/

Limestone-based Maine Military Authority, or MMA, part of LePage’s executive branch, unveiled the state’s first-ever refurbished fixed-route bus at an Augusta State Airport hangar on Thursday. A fixed-route bus is the traditional carrier of passengers in most public transit systems, as opposed to a human-services bus, the shorter version that brings people shopping and to doctor’s appointments.

The 32-foot 2006 Bluebird cost the Biddeford-Saco-Old Orchard intercity bus system $230,000 when they bought it in 2006. Over the past three months, Maine Military Authority refurbished it to like-new condition, at a cost of $75,000.

Hugh Corbett, MMA’s executive director, said his agency presents an alternative to the traditional bus rotation of most mass transit authorities, in which they buy, beat and sell vehicles for scrap.

“We can service the whole Northeast,” Corbett said. “There is no other large-scale refurbishment agency like us in New England.”

Getting a fleet of buses all the way up to Limestone would require a driver for each one. I wonder if it would be cost-effective (and feasible) to bring them up by rail?

First and foremost I will say I am very happy to see MMA working on the new business lines. There are people I am serving with right now who are expecting to return home to a layoff notice due to the loss of work. Second having actually driven their refurbished products I can vouch for the very high quality level of the work. They really do a great job and it would be a shame to lose their expertise in military vehicle refurbishment. I think the question regarding rail is a very interesting one. In general most of the vehicles going to MMA were brought in on trailers, usually two or three to a trailer. Other than the fairly minor question of how and where to unload I don't see why this wouldn't work. Articulated buses in particular aren't going to be as efficient to move by truck as the Hummvees were.

Hmmmm. Hmmmmmm...... HMMMMMMMMM....... hmmm.....
Yeah, actually, it COULD work. All you need is an onload point (assuming there's offload near the Limestone facility,) and a bunch of old TTX flats, the kind which were beg put into storage not long ago. I cannot say how frequently the movements would be. It would all depend on the individual companies/transits contracting with MMA,....
...but I agree it COULD work.

Caribou to Limestone is OOS with many paved over crossings so direct rail service is out of question. I beleive much of the military equipment by rail was unloaded at PI and trucked to MMA. You could pick this thread right up with the 2011 thread discussing almost the exact same scenario. The same issues exist today, multiple rail loadings sites off of MNR and vandalism potential on open flats due to clearance restraints for auto racks north of Brownsville.

Here is the link to the 2011 thread
http://www.railroad.net/forums/viewtopi ... ne#p893222" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Rail would be a tough sell on this. The article indicates MMA's market is New England, so it's a short haul to start. Add to that the fact that it would be a two- or three-line haul, and then the equipment issue. Moving an old bus up to Maine would probably be ok on a flat car (though you'd only get two on a car), but to Mr Fogg's comment on vandalism; moving a refurb back to southern NE? You'd have to have your Safelite auto glass guy on retainer at destination, along with a 55-gal drum of paint remover.

Cowford,

My question or thought was if they do this as a special move would it be worth the savings? Especially if they move everything at once on a single train. Perhaps even dedicated run through power or some other kind of special arrangement. Seems like an opportunity here but I could see this requiring more effort than its worth. I'm assuming there aren't any height restriction concerns that would require some kind of special flat cars.

For what it's worth, new city transit buses are always delivered from the builder to their destination on their own wheels. Yes, it does take a bunch of drivers making multiple trips, but that's how the industry does it so there is reason to believe that self-propelled delivery has been established as the most economical or at least the most practical method. I would assume that the same factors would apply to buses headed to way-northern Maine for rebuilding.