Sir Ray wrote:After spending too much time perviewing a usenet thread about someone's fantasy Crossrail map (and posts from his many detractors), I was hoping that the Worldwide Railfan forum community could clear up some questions I have (Sorry, but after reviewing some 'offical' websites I could on these topics, I feel British Consultantcies give US Marketing Agencies and Politicians a run for their money in obscufation and misinformation 
).
So, could anyone please inform me...
What exactly is Thameslink - what rolling stock does it use and how does it operate (Underground style, Suburban Commuter rail style, Shuttle, other?) - how/from what routes was it created? When did it come into existance. Does it integrate with other systems?
What was the Thameslink 2000 plan(s) supposed to do?
I think I understand Crossrail - well, I though I did, but after reading 200 differing opinions on that usenet thread, what really is it suppose to do? And again, what rolling stock, what operations, intergrate with what other systems (somehow Milton Keynes plays a role in this whole mess 
)
East London Line - seems like a good idea, a North South route across East London ... but there seems a lot of contraversy here - also, was this commuter, tube stock, mainline, other?
North London Line and... GOBLIN? What are these exactly, and who runs them (and what is this talk of large amounts of Freight traffic on these lines).
London Airport, Olympic Sites - what plans, if any, are there to link these to rail transit (some sites say none)
Finally, I think I understand the whole Eurostar Terminal and Route, but is the current plan pretty sensible? It seems to be sending the trains across the Thames and then curving around south into St. Pancras station, as opposed to the current Waterloo station in southern London.
Thameslink:
There was a pre-existing line from Moorgate to the outer suburban lines of the Great Northern and Midland railways. I remember using it in the 1950s, as I used to commute from Aldgate to Paddington. In those days it was steam hauled.
Before the 1939 war there was a tunnel from Aldersgate/Farringdon under Smithfield market to Blackfriars. It remained in use for occasional freight trains into the 1950s but was then abandoned. The Greater London Council noticed this tunnel and agitated for it to be revived. Eventually in the 1980s it was rebuilt as a line connecting the third rail network south of the Thames with the overhead line network north of the Thames. Dual power trains were built. The change from third rail to overhead occurs at Farringdon station. The only tunnel to be restored was the western leg of a triangle, the other leg could have allowed southern trains to reach Moorgate.
The service that has survived on this tunnel route is the Bedford to Brighton via Gatwick service and an inner suburban loop via Wimbledon.
Thameslink 2000 is to increase the service to take in the Great Northern routes at Kings Cross, as well as the existing Midland routes. I am not sure what additional services would be built south of the Thames. It needs some engineering and construction. The bottleneck on this route is a complicated junction at Borough Market. Additional links from the new Kings Cross station to the Great Northern lines need to be built, as these were abandoned decades ago.
Crossrail is to connect the Great Western routes with the Great Eastern. It will take people through the city in an East-West direction. It needs a hugely expensive tunnel from Paddington to about Stratford. The details of the plan keep changing. The earliest it was proposed was probably the 19th century. Will it ever be built? The problem is the money. The government keeps putting it off. A special levy on the city banks ought to pay for it, as in Paris where an employer's tax has paid for about 7 of these RER lines. There is endless argument about what services would use Crossrail if built. One service would certainly be the Heathrow Express, extended to the City and perhaps beyond to Stratford. At present the usual plan is to go to Maidenhead, but everyone asks: why not Reading, or even Oxford?
East London
This line is certainly going ahead. It uses Brunel's original tunnel under the Thames. Since then it has been a short line, part of the Underground network but not used to anything like its potential. It became more important with the Millennium Dome, and a connection was made with the new Jubilee extension built in 2000 at Canada Water. The idea is to extend trains from its current southern terminus (New Cross Gate) to use the Southeastern third rail network as far as Croydon or Clapham Junction. The northern line would be extended to Dalston or Highgate on the North London line. Together with new services on the West London line this would make almost an Outer Circle service.
Freight
There is no freight on Thameslink, East London or any other lines mentioned here. There will be none in the future. No Intercity trains use them or will.
The West London line has some freight connecting Willesden and Channel Tunnel, and possibly from the Great Western to Southampton. There are also a few cross London Intercity trains but nothing like as many as British Rail planned. At present there is a short service from Clapham Junction (mixed third rail and overhead) to Willesden Junction. There is also a service from Watford Junction to Gatwick and beyond. This used to go as far as Rugby (via Milton Keynes) but there are said to be capacity problems on the West Coast mainline so passengers now have to change at Watford. Occasionally Branson says he would like to run a Eurostar from Watford, but that is unlikely (it would need a secure station with Immigration control).
The North London line is mainly a suburban electric line (partly third rail and partly overhead) from Richmond to Stratford (and at present to North Woolwich). There is some freight on part of that connecting the West Coast Mainline and the East Coast mainline. There is an extra electrified overhead track for freight along part of its route. At one time it was proposed that regional Eurostar services would use it. It is still possible that Eurostars from the new St Pancras station may use part of it to connect to Birmingham, but doubtful.
Eurostar
St Pancras will allow passengers from north of London to transfer easily, especially if they come from the Midlands or the North. The trains will leave London on a High Speed line and will not be slowed down by any of the third rail network they have to use at present. I will be sad because at present I could take a train from Bournemuth to Waterloo and change there (but actually, I never do). Some of them will stop at Stratford International, and possibly Ebbsfleet (though I doubt there will be many) and others at Ashford International. No domestic passengers are allowed to use Eurostar (government regulations) so each Eurostar station needs an expensive airport style immigration and security check.
Part of the new high speed tunnel from St Pancras will be used for Olympic specials. There will also be outer suburban trains from Kent. I am not sure of the details of these services but they will be needed to keep the HSL busy. There will probably be new Eurostar trains. For example, full sized French TGV trains will be able to use the new link, and also German IC trains. Will they? We shall see. The new trains would not need a third rail capability and could not use the ordinary network (because too high and wide).
