What LIRR branches utilize DM locos?

Good morning Forum Members,

One of my students asked me a good question and I realized I didn't have the answer! Please help me here.

What LIRR branches have DM engines in service? (Oyster Bay, Port Washington and Port Jeff???????????)

Where does electric service begin on each line?

Thanks for sharing the knowledge,
de Don, n2qhvRMLI

The 500 series of engines are the dual mode engines. Depending on daily needs they can be used anywhere, but sometimes not in electric mode if the trains manipulation does not call for an electric trip in their daily cycle.

There are certain trains in each of those diesel territories that are expected to run into Penn on all those branches. Those trains will always have 500's. Roughly half of the diesel engine fleet is dual mode. So depending on repairs and inspections you may find a 500 being used in a non dual mode capacity.

Third rail starts on the Port Jefferson line in Huntington, The Main Line in Ronkonkoma, the Oyster Bay line in East Williston, The Montauk branch in Babylon. Unless planning has changed there are hopes to electrify all the way to PJ, but that's a few years away.

BMC,

Thanks buddy! I didn't realize half the fleet were DMs and I didn't know they run them on the non-electrified branches. You learn something new every day! I'm gonna look for the 500's here out East. I'm interested to get an eyeball on the pick-up shoes. Living my life outside electric territory, I've been sheltered

Thanks again,
de Don, n2qhvRMLI

Unless there is a major shortage of engines in the equipment pool, you'll never see a 500 series engine east of Ronkonkoma.

Jay

That's true .. the KO to Greenport scoot cyle will have a 400 series engine 99.9 % of the time.

But never say never .... :wink:

I believe each of the diesel branches has at least one round trip with the dual modes (minus Greenport to Ronkonkoma). I believe there is one round trip to and from Speonk (peak direction), one round trip to Oyster Bay, and I believe at least one round trip to Port Jefferson, although there may be two round trips on that line.
You can tell which ones are using the dual modes by looking at the timetables. If the train goes direct from diesel territory to Penn, without any notes indicating a change at Jamaica, Huntington, Babylon, etc, then it's a dual mode. You only need to look at the peak trains, as that's the only time the dual modes run direct. Any other time 500 series engines are on a train, they just run diesel.

As far as I known:

OB has 1 each way

PJ has atleast 2 each way

Montauk has 1 from Montauk eastbound, and 1 westbound to atleast Patchogue

The West Hempstead Branch should be a diesel branch, considering it's lower ridership compared to the other branches.

LegoX,
i agree, and just said that to somone yesterday that the WM branch should be a diesel line. during the day they have a 6 car MU scoot between Valley and WM no need for that its a wast of equpt, there shoul be a DE w/ Cab Car or a DE w/ A C3 and Cab Car.

and to back up what some one posted eariler about the DM's being used as a stright diesel, I just Seen DM 504 w/ C3's and Cab CAr 5007 passing Valley on Atlantic 2 in the lower half of the 4pm hour. I think it was was ran on Atlantic 2 to Valley the switched to Montauk 2 there after west bound passes or to get a head of a Babylon train?

NIMBYkiller wrote:As far as I known:

OB has 1 each way

PJ has atleast 2 each way

Montauk has 1 from Montauk eastbound, and 1 westbound to atleast Patchogue

No dual modes go direct from/to Montauk

Here's a list of the trains that run dual mode:

Montauk branch:
Westbound: 6:21AM Speonk to 8:23 Penn
Eastbound: 5:10PM Penn to 7:13 Speonk
(no dual modes between Westhampton and Montauk)

Oyster Bay:
Westbound: 6:16 AM Oyster Bay to 7:30 Penn
Eastbound: 5:50 PM Penn to 7:06 Oyster Bay

Port Jeff:
Westbound: 5:44AM PJ to 7:20 Penn
Westbound: 7:35AM PJ to 9:23 Penn
Eastbound: 4:19PM Penn to 6:05 PJ
Eastbound: 4:49PM Penn to 6:36 PJ

Greenport:
Nothing. Not even a direct from Jamaica.

Actually, about the only way to cut costs on the WH line is to close it. The big 'cost' with electrification is the initial costs, which were eaten by the PRR eons ago. De-electrification generally doesn't save any money.

I think you'll ultimately see WH killed off. It's got a very low ridership, and it really doesn't serve any logical purpose ever since the Mineola / CLP/ West Hempstead connecting track was torn up (and it won't be comming back anytimne soon). Right now, of the three lines slated for killing, it's the cheapest to run, in per passenger costs.

WH line costs about 2.5 million a year to run, for 3000 daily pax. OB is 7.1 for 6000 pax, the scoot is 1.6 for 200 daily pax. I bet the OB line could be made a lot cheaper with a cut back to Glen Street (either tear up, or better yet, do it Septa style, just stop running service beyond GS and put bumpers there and an interlocking between GS and Sea Cliff to cross trains. Maybe straighten the tracks if it's cheap enough.

Out of curiosity, I believe that I heard once that LIRR only uses about 1/4 of its DE/DM30s and C3s. Can anyone confirm this? I mean, it would be reasonlable to use 3/4 or even 2/3 so you have a safety margin for maintainance, break downs, etc, but 3/4 is ridiculous. So anyone know?

i find that tough to believe. with the number of trains, times the number of branches, i think more than 25% are assigned at any given time. They may not all be in motion at once...

"I think you'll ultimately see WH killed off. It's got a very low ridership, and it really doesn't serve any logical purpose ever since the Mineola / CLP/ West Hempstead connecting track was torn up (and it won't be comming back anytimne soon)"

It does serve a logical purpose. It's the only north-south line connecting central and southern nassau county. The WH-Mineola ROW would be very easy to re-open. Even Nassau County has plans to re-open it as part of a hub service. And they also plan to use the WH for the same service.


As for DM use, I think I read here that it was only 10 out of 23 are used.

The WM line is only useless bescause there is nomore connection on the to the CRR and to mineola/OB

WM-CLP is a must, (nimbys say will be elimited just re grade and run trains) letem complain, just say to them that this mistake taken by the MTA to tare up track was wrong on there part and we need it back..
we did not relise that we distroyed the branch by doing this.
WM-CLP then the CRR east be re built. it would be more cost effective for persons to take a train east as not all will have to go to zone 3 and pay the wrongfull (hidden) backtracking fee that included in the ticket.

but hey. in 30 yrs from now LIRR may only be a memory for us. when it consist of only a few lines and all rail trails.