Phoebe Snow

Oh, yeah, leaving Binghamton on a Sunday they would announce PA was dry and to order up before you get across the border. The Erie had another problem going into PA at Great Bend, leaving at Gulf Summit, go back into PA at Narrowsburg and back to NY at Sparrowbush; they were opening and closing the bar every hour or so.

And collecting and paying taxes on drinks...and food...aboard trains in NY varied from county to county, even town to town; the wait staff had to know their geography when you ordered. Soup in Broome County, entree in Tioga and dessert in Chemung: three different taxes on the same check!!???

Off the subject, but The Supreme Court cleared up an airline industry issue sometime in the 1950s when one or two of the Midwest states (which were dry) prohibited airliners flying over them from serving alcoholic drinks. It was ruled that such regulation (or prohibition) was interstate in nature and subject to Federal regulations -- which allowed it. Today, airlines beg you to pay $5 for a beer or other drink.

But, a train: could it be argued that it was or wasn't on the ground in the county or state? In our state, the county will tax you a building as part of the property and school taxes. But, if you have a caboose on rails, it's not a building and therefore not taxable.

Just one more way for lawyers to make money off of us with.

Oh, it lasts, ok. When running fan trips I would have to pay taxes per county on food and railroadiana! New York is very, very tax conscious.

My hat is off to you. I always thought organizing train excursions was a tough endeavor -- first with the roads, the insurance, the food, then going with the risk of attracting ticket sales.

The last ones I rode were the Reading #2122, a DL&W to Slateford Junction via the Old Main Line then back to Hoboken via the Cut-Off and Boonton Line. One on the Erie up to Lackawaxen (about 1960 or so). Then one on the Long Island on RDCs out to Montauk Point one Sunday in November 1960. They rotated everyone on the train for five minutes or so up with the engineer.

Thanks for your insights!

I remember seeing the eastbound train coming into Mount Morris in 1961 with an 8400 series F3 leading the E8 and the F3 had the same triple horn mount over the engineer's roof as the ex DL&W E8s did. BTW, is there any special reason why the Lackawanna chose this most unusual horn arrangement for their E8s and some F3s? This was in June 1961 and I saw the westbound train with Erie Alco PAs racing it westward toward Buffalo.

AndyB wrote:The "original" Phoebe Snow still runs.

OK, I admit, it is in 1/4 scale, but it is the original and with "F" units.
The train operates on the layout of The New York Society of Model Engineers See: www.modelengineers.org
For a photo of tavern/lounge see: http://modelengineers.org/Web%20Pics/Picture%20014.JPG

The model was built prior to the Phoebe Snow and put on dispaly at Lackawanna Stations to publicize the coming of the new train. It was later given to NYSME to run on the Society's layout in the Hoboken Terminal. The entire train still runs, a testament to the model builders of that time.
Before anyone says anything about the Tavern Lounge photo, Yes, the roofs of the Tavern Lounge and Dining Car are not fluted. Anyone knowing the construction history of the train knows why.

The Society also has a 1/4" Scale model of White's busines car. Also tail signs from the Tavern - Lounge, the business car and the Lackawanna Limited are on dispaly. Visitors always welcomed.

The New York Society will be open for the next three weekends.
See: www.modelengineers.org for times and directions.
The Phoebe Snow will be running>