Reroute the Crescent via Montgomery, Mobile for Atlanta station?

The Texas Crescent is a very good idea IMO. The few passengers from NOL up to stations including Anniston could be served by a Thruway NOL - MEI. The Meridian T&E crew then could go towards DFW instead of NOL.. The 2 items needed at ATL are a loop track at the gulch and flyover tracks at Howell. At first the flyovers would help freight CSX & NS more until passenger service from the west, north & east takes hold. All those locations have trains from BHM, Chattanooga / Nashville / CIN, Knoxville / CIN, Canton, Charlotte, Athens. All those locations need a full Zoo type flyover to get fluidity. The 2 NS and 2 CSX tracks that parallel from Howell to the gulch need two complete universal CPs to allow freights to make the different destinations to / from those locations. You have freights from Augusta, NS Macon / Savannah / Jacksonville, CSX Manchester / Jacksonville , CSX Montgomery / Birmingham.
So Howell handles trains every location south to every location north.

What about this location. It appears to have reasonable highway access. It is an old industrial area that has been recently cleared of decrepit empty buildings. I'm not sure if this land is available, but it is a nice chunk of open land in a city that doesn't have much free space.

The red box would be land for station and parking. The green line would be a new rail spur to connect south to west and east to north NS line. All of the right of way exists from Griffin av to the connection with the active rail line at Marietta Blvd NW. A connection would also have to be built from the tunnel under W. Marietta St NW to NS. All connections to all routes should be available from this layout.

DGVengineer" Thar solves the need for a loop. As well access for future CSX traffic from north. Ease of access from south for both NS & CSX freights However there is a need for a universal crossover(s) from north of station to Howell along the 4 parallel NS / CSX tracks. All traffic from the south to the NS CLT line can then pass Howell on the eastern most track. CSX and NS will need to play nice to allow all 4 tracks to be used by both RRs.

Memory has lost me. Is that area close to or on the old SOU RR passenger car maintenance facility ?

There are crossovers north of the station site from all the NS tracks to CSX to allow NS trains to go north and east through Howell Jct to the line to Charlotte & DC. Follow the tracks north from the station site on Google Maps to see the crossovers. There are no crossovers to the south to get from NS track to CSX , so if any traffic needed to get on CSX to the south, a crossover would need to be installed. I would put a platform between the two NS tracks and add another track and platform next to the station for the track that circles around to head west to NS. I'm not sure about the old SR passenger car site.

Wherever they put the station they will need room for a maintenance facility somewhere.

Well, it's "closer" but you still have a need for proper transit (beyond that of bus). May need another subway line.

Since CSX runs on NS ( old C of GA ) from East Point to Terminal station area there is already provision for all CSX trains to get on the 2 eastern CSX tracks north of the old Union Station area. The CSX trains are from BHM, Montgomery, and Manchester / Jacksonville. However the JAX trains can still the west Fulton ACL line if they so desire or traffic on the A&WP is congested..

Sorry, I got behind on responding so, enjoy the mega-post!

gt7348b wrote: ↑Fri Jul 30, 2021 1:35 pm The Decatur Belt was abandoned from the National Rail Network in 2009 by the Surface Transportation Board and is no longer available.

The RoW is still there and fairly unencroached. It's the only practical route into Atlanta from the NS. An abandonment really doesn't mean too much here. Ironically, thanks to the trail, it will remain relatively unencroached for the foreseeable future.

STrRedWolf wrote: ↑Fri Jul 30, 2021 8:17 pm

Gilbert B Norman wrote: ↑Fri Jul 30, 2021 7:47 pm *QUOTE REMOVED FOR POST BREVITY*

The cat's awake but distracted by other issues. That said, I doubt it's worth a hand-off or two. Handoffs take money.

The other thing is that you need good transit to the train station. Right now, there's not much to Atlanta Peachtree.

But I have an idea:

1. There seems to be an an abandoned lot at Perry Blvd NW and Marietta Road NW. Eniment Domain and give it to Amtrak to build a station with one provision... share it with MARTA.
2. Extend the Green Line from Bankhead to the new shared station... and further beyond to Riverside. Enhance bus transit to various industries

You get better transit service, a better Amtrak station, and better connections between the two.

That wouldn't help anything going north on the W&A and would require a MARTA extension. If MARTA rail can't run to a new station, then at least the new station shouldn't have worse transportation than the current one.

west point wrote: ↑Fri Jul 30, 2021 10:44 pm

MattW wrote: ↑Fri Jul 30, 2021 8:58 am *IMAGE SNIPPED FOR QUOTE BREVITY*

If you look at the map just due west of Atlanta airport between the 2 inside runways the A&WP sub has room for about 6 tracks with platforms if US-29 is moved to the west. What is really important is that the people mover from the airport to the common rental car terminal passes over this platform area. All that would be needed is several elevators from platforms to people mover. (about 50 feet ). As well next to the area is MARTA access and MARTA parking lot long and short term. I-85 also has access. NOTE there is real estate now for about 1 platform off main track for 2 station tracks to the east of main track.
This does not solve the downtown question but suspect that the HSR proposal has thought about it instead of Hapeville.

I agree, but I don't think US-29 needs to be affected, it looks like Main St could just be closed and the station go in between the existing CSX tracks and MARTA's tracks. This might actually be the best bet. Without needing to condemn more than a public road, a large station complex can be built here and there's easy access to transit. However, the problem is access to Savannah. The CSX line south goes entirely the wrong direction and to get to the NS line would require a backing move to East Point unless some of those industrial properties can be condemned to make the south leg of a WYE connection (like along Hamilton Ave).

west point wrote: ↑Fri Jul 30, 2021 10:51 pm Just west of Stone Mountain on the Ga RR had a industrial spur that went north to close to the Blue line freeway. At same time the SAL also had a industrial spur that almost aligned to the GA RR spur. Were just separated by about 600 yards and the Stone Mountain freeway. Expensive rail bridge over freeway only problem. However both spurs have been shortened now.

I'm very familiar with that area, I grew up along this line (Conyers, grandfather lived in Decatur). I don't really see the need for this, not to mention the complexity, even as you mention in getting over US-78. The Abbeville line through Tucker can connect with the Georgia Road between Emory and East Point on the Parkline (Inman Belt on the map I posted). That's still a very much active route, maybe even more active now than before since CSX seems to like to route trains out the Abbeville via this line to avoid a large grade through Emory.

west point wrote: ↑Fri Jul 30, 2021 11:48 pm I do not get to the gulch anymore. At one time I observed that by demolishing part of the car parking garage and using property of both Union station and Terminal station a station could be built with a loop track going around with about 10 station tracks inside with a line also extending to the south for SOU, C of GA, A&WP lines as well. That would be very similar to how Richmond Broad street station was once built. Some provision for track(s) could go east out the Ga RR as well. Now have no idea if that station design is even possible, That way no backing for passenger trains. What would also help both NS and CSX is for all 4 tracks from Howell to new station be common use . That would allow flyovers at Howell CP to be built much cheaper not cheaply.

*SNIP*

I don't think there's enough room for a loop. I agree about the station though, I think that's a good area for it and with the right configuration of WYE tracks, train could come and go any direction.

Anthony wrote: ↑Sun Aug 01, 2021 3:13 pm

MattW wrote: ↑Fri Jul 30, 2021 8:58 am *QUOTE SNIPPED FOR BREVITY*

The reroute is a good idea, but there is a way to preserve service to Birmingham while simultaneously rerouting the Crescent as you suggested. That is to add a new section of the Crescent on the existing route as far as Meridian, MS, where the train would then turn west and run to Dallas and Fort Worth, via Jackson, MS and Shreveport, LA, similar to the old Crescent Star idea. The only difference would be: Instead of the train splitting in Meridian, it would split in Atlanta. Service between NOL and Meridian would be preserved through a new corridor train between those two cities, which would be timed to connect with trains on both ends if possible. Yes, there would still be a backup move in Atlanta required, but the train would have to be switched there regardless to allow for the splitting and combining of the two sections. It wouldn't take too much more effort to run the DFW section back up from the downtown Atlanta station to the existing Crescent route to continue to DFW.

I like that idea! I don't think a backing move for a splitting train would be too bad. If the train is configured like the Lake Shore or Empire Builder, a locomotive can just tie on to the back of the train and run forward to BHM and onward. It means the coach passengers are now riding reverse though.

dgvrengineer wrote: ↑Sun Aug 01, 2021 7:59 pm What about this location. It appears to have reasonable highway access. It is an old industrial area that has been recently cleared of decrepit empty buildings. I'm not sure if this land is available, but it is a nice chunk of open land in a city that doesn't have much free space.

The red box would be land for station and parking. The green line would be a new rail spur to connect south to west and east to north NS line. All of the right of way exists from Griffin av to the connection with the active rail line at Marietta Blvd NW. A connection would also have to be built from the tunnel under W. Marietta St NW to NS. All connections to all routes should be available from this layout.

This whole area, specifically the area outlined in red is being redeveloped. This line is also now a trail and unlike the beltline, there's no room to share it. There's also the issue at the top of the image of connecting to the NS line to go to BHM, the line under your green line is CSX's line through Fulton County to Union Point and goes under NS in a tunnel. Also as StrRedWolf points out, this takes you farther from rail transit. I also disagree about there being good highway access at this location.