LIRR C420 Preservation: Dakota Southern Railroad Engine 213

RG: Interesting news about the potential availability of former LIRR C420 #213...

Making inquiry with the Dakota Southern is a good first move provided that they are willing to talk.
Would the DS accommodate anyone interested to visit the location where #213 is stored?

Are there recent pictures of #213 in DS service? Any more description about #213's internal condition?

I agree that the largest expense will be moving this unit 1500 miles (estimate) to the East Coast provided
that an arrangement can be made. A place to store #213 at least temporarily would be necessary.

#213 should be in the LIRR middle 1960s gray and orange color scheme eventually in service or as a
static display (provided that service restoration is not possible) for a museum or tourist railroad.

New York State homes for #213 should be another option for preservation. A Hudson Valley venue or one
in proximity to ALCO's home of Schenectady should be at least considered if it is not possible to return
#213 to Long Island at RMLI or OBRM.

Let's see what happens with the initial inquiry - DS should at least know that there is interest in #213.
MACTRAXX

Has either RMLI or OBRM shown interest in having this unit? Even if funding becomes available do they have room for it? I think the first move should be to talk to them.

El Crabberino- I don't think either LI museum has expressed interest in it simply for lack of funding. I think if RMLI was offered the unit, they might have room in Greenport, if not Riverhead. RMLI has to get daily operation funds in place, but the larger picture is to maintain what is already onsite. This is a bit mike painting the George Washington Bridge. The biggest fish to fry is getting the rest of the G5s to Strasburg and to have it start making real money - which it will, probably by the barrel. 213 would make a super display at OBRM, but realistically, will they have room on one of the turntable radials?
I think getting the locomotive to any other location is certainly do-able, and Connecticut leaps to mind. Possibly Port Jervis (?). Does the MTA have a secure yard location for a modern appliance Diesel?
Securing the loco first, then getting it moved by rail seems like the first two logical moves to me. But, is anyone listening at Dakota Southern? I've emailed twice an no response yet. That doesn't mean they aren't going to talk, just that I've not heard anything. Perhaps another group already has their teeth into the purchase? Lots of people are talking about saving her.

Friendly storage doesn't have to be in NY... there are museums in MN, WI and IL who own their own property and might be willing to hold it if BNSF is willing to move it.

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Not to be mean here, but seriously there is no room anywhere out here for this locomotive to be held, unless you have some private owner willing to hold it on their property here on Long Island, nor even if restored due to PTC can not run out here.

Work the problem, Neil. Even if it never sees the LIRR again, it can be displayed in Long Island paint.

The Dakota Southern was taken over by WAMX or Watco. The DS is now the Ringneck and Western Railroad.

RGlueck wrote: ↑Sat Jul 17, 2021 8:21 pm Work the problem, Neil. Even if it never sees the LIRR again, it can be displayed in Long Island paint.

A LIRR diesel wouldn’t be in the collection policy of most museums off of Long Island. The only possible exception might be a nationally focused museum but realistically a C-420 isn’t likely to spark a lot of interest.

Richard, never said it can’t be restored in LIRR Paint! Just don’t have any room anywhere out here unless someone private can hold it, nor can run on LIRR rails anymore!

belpaire wrote:

RGlueck wrote: ↑Sat Jul 17, 2021 8:21 pm Work the problem, Neil. Even if it never sees the LIRR again, it can be displayed in Long Island paint.

A LIRR diesel wouldn’t be in the collection policy of most museums off of Long Island. The only possible exception might be a nationally focused museum but realistically a C-420 isn’t likely to spark a lot of interest.

You'd be surprised what museums might be willing to do with the right money. IRM has a growing collection of ALCOs... no C420s at the moment (they do have a C424), but if one were to be acquired by a group willing to pay for the track space, anything is possible.

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Do you really think that people from LI are going to donate money to have an engine go to an out of area museum? You'ld be hard pressed to raise the money to have it come to the island.

Nobody has room for it on LI, so you can eithet try to save it and store it out of state temporarily, or see it scrapped.

Once it's scrapped, the options to preserve a LIRR C424 become even more limited.


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If a private company or buyer wished to purchase the locomotive, I think the LIRR/NY&A/empty-A would move it as it might any freight car. There would be a price, of course. Whether there is a desire to own it, accept it, store it is a realistic other side to the story. So let's say there is no room. The next feasible thing is to look for a benevolent group willing to store it off the Island, in perhaps NY, Conn., NJ, Pa.
Then what? Well, you weld something over the stack, you wash it, lube it, paint it and make it look like a well cared for museum artifact. You attend to the care of the locomotive display on a regular basis, similar to what happened to Big Boy 4014 in Pomona, California.
Every answer isn't going to fall in your lap today. Here we're talking about preservation, and that's all.

Or you can take the first tactical step and give up.

Everyone is so hot and bothered over the 213. Does the buff community have the money where their mouth is?
Is there fan or fans with a solid 25-30k they’re willing to drop on this engine as a donation? This would
Cover the purchase cost, shipping compliance work so it can be shipped by rail. And the rail shipping it self?

One thing I have noticed and learned over the years is the buffs we want everything but we don’t want to financially contribute to the projected at hand.
Perfect example is the failed 39 project.
Mismanaged from the start and was on and over for the better park of 36 years, same with 1361.
Locally there is a very negative stigma in rail preservation due to the lack of anything that was promised ever coming into fruition from the older generation of preservationists that were in the decision making positions.
This is my private option and I hold
No I’ll Will toward anyone. It is what it is. We can only proceed forward and learn from their mistakes and successes. “History repeats it self IF YOU DON’T LEARN FROM THE PAST”.

PM me if your willing to offer 25-30K for a donation.
There is several interested parties in 213 and the owner isn’t accepting request to donate the engine

Rail preservation on Long Island is littered with good intentions and lack of action, which began with all the donated cars to LIST in the early 1970's with no clear plan for scope of work or fundraising. Some of those cars formed the basis for RMLI, but many were donated elsewhere after LIST realized it bit off more than it could even attempt to sustain.

As for the L1 213: Unless there is a spare 30k from someone's trust fund, don't expect to see this engine near the NYC area anytime soon. And no, LIRR/NYAR will not move it gratis, and since the engine is over forty years old major freight carriers can refuse to interchange it.