"Points Guy" takes the train

The Points Guy is one of the best (IMO) online writers on airline travel and related deals. Here he takes Silver Star with his daughter Florida to DC and compares it to his wife's parallel flight on JetBlue.

Spoiler: He liked it! Slower and more expensive than flying (natch), but more comfortable, fun, and relaxing. Both similarly late (betw 1-2 hrs)

https://thepointsguy.com/news/train-vs- ... ington-dc/

Accommodation appears to be a V2 roomette. Surprise (for me): It seems a diner has been reassigned to the Star! I hadn't realized that.

It's $111.00 without the room. Versus $66.40 on United, two weeks out. The points guy had $538.00 vs. $74.40 on JetBlue.

Wow, is that fellow ever the "angle merchant" when it comes to "playing points".

Sorry, but I "can't be bothered". United "miles" I simply donate to one military welfare charity or the other they feature at their site. Amtrak points (about 17K of them), I'm waiting to learn they've partnered with a charity as then they will have a good use.

Hotel points I use; they're fairly straight forward without requiring you to stay over two Blue Moons or similar nonsense. On this note, a "Points Gal" I know was returning from LAS to ORD using AA points. She was booked with points to LAX at about 4P, thence to ORD on a 1230A "Red Eye".

Not worth it to me; but her? Well, she stepped up and tactfully (my word on that) complained to "one that counts" @ LAS. She got a 4P non-stop to ORD - and home by 1159P..

But to close back on the rails, seems as if Points Guy was perfectly satisfied with the "Flexichow", and appeared to have expected nothing more. It's "his fortysomething world" that only knows airline food and hotel breakfast bars. He never "knew it when" and would just give a "huh" to the advocacy sites imploring the return of full-service "Dining".

Finally, at least his cute kid got to take her mask off inside the Roomette.

Gilbert B Norman wrote: ↑Tue May 11, 2021 7:31 am But to close back on the rails, seems as if Points Guy was perfectly satisfied with the "Flexichow", and appeared to have expected nothing more. It's "his fortysomething world" that only knows airline food and hotel breakfast bars. He never "knew it when" and would just give a "huh" to the advocacy sites imploring the return of full-service "Dining".

Finally, at least his cute kid got to take her mask off inside the Roomette.

I think that's the real thing. Flying... gets old after a while. The only real exciting part is take-off and landing, from ground to cloud cover. Everything on the ground is hurry up and wait. Everything in the air above cloud cover is ether clouds or stuff you can now get on Google Maps' Satellite View, so you're forced to read a magazine or watch whatever you brought on board. If your laptop is small enough and doesn't have a hard drive in it, you can work a fair bit. Sure, it's quicker. But is it better all around?

On a train, your hurry-up-and-wait is really a regular wait. Your travel is on the ground and you get the see the scenery close-up. You get to see the world properly whizz by right next to you, not underneath of you where you can't see that deer across the lake. It's distracting... and that's the beauty of it. It's a nature documentary without Sir David Attenborough narrating the hell out of it -- it's live, unedited, raw, right in front of your face only separated by safety glass and metal. It's there. And it calls for your attention, even though you've taken the route before, many of a time. It'll get old eventually. Daily commuter? The call will fade. Occasional trip? That call will be as clear as day every time.

Andy Ihnatko, a well established reporter and writer, had postulated about a unit of entertainment and how much a person would pay to get their money's worth for that one unit. That is what is going on with the author of the Points Guy article, Nick Ewen. $538 for trip plus roomette for him and his daughter, verses $74.40 that was paid over how long in the past for his wife. The wife had to suffer through the hurry-up-and-wait -- a low rate of entertainment for the money. But for Nick and his daughter? Immeasurable.

From complimentary meals to a spacious roomette all to ourselves, it was an incredibly relaxing way to travel. We had no security checkpoints, no crowded boarding gates and no restrictions on the liquids we could bring on board. We weren’t forced to sit in an over-heated airport terminal with no food or drink for nearly two hours. And aside from passing a fellow rider in the hallway or the dining car, we were never within six feet of anyone.

Most importantly, however, I was able to make some incredible new memories with my daughter.

That's my point: Don't just focus on price. Add in the quality of enjoyment in the trip (or "quality of life").

STrRedWolf wrote: ↑Tue May 11, 2021 9:09 pm …..it's live, unedited, raw, right in front of your face only separated by safety glass and metal. It's there. And it calls for your attention, even though you've taken the route before, many of a time. It'll get old eventually. Daily commuter? The call will fade. Occasional trip? That call will be as clear as day every time.

I certainly respect the mature thoughts set forth by Mr. Wolf; that immediately captioned reflect upon a flying experience I had not all that long ago.

During August '19, returning from what likely will be my final trip overseas (next opportunity during '22, I'll be 81yo; too old to consider such) journey, the flight was vectored over Greenland. Having never seen Greenland, I was glued to the window with a (dreadful; inconsiderate) open window shade.

Well, until I got "jumped" by a less than tactful Attendant. "...your're disturbing others trying to watch their movies".

I really could care less about in flight movies, and the headphones are only of use to me "in the unlikely event" that the Captain offers what United calls "Channel 9," or air to ground communications. So I took my jacket, held it behind me, and watched the scenery fly by (mostly glaciers) on a crystal clear day.

I mentioned the incident to the "very Senior" United Attendant I know as a friend. She said the words to me she would have used, and that went down "so much sweeter". She also asided: "I know that girl; just as soon not fly with her".

Gilbert B Norman wrote: ↑Tue May 11, 2021 7:31 am
But to close back on the rails, seems as if Points Guy was perfectly satisfied with the "Flexichow", and appeared to have expected nothing more. It's "his fortysomething world" that only knows airline food and hotel breakfast bars. He never "knew it when" and would just give a "huh" to the advocacy sites imploring the return of full-service "Dining".

This article is telling on the dining front - from my observation on the Silvers when I've had flexible dining is that its mostly long time railfan customers and employees that complain about it - most of the newer and more casual riders (by that I mean - people riding the train to get where they're going or to try something different that aren't rail enthusiasts) I've talked to seem fine with it. While I certainly enjoyed my recent steak on the Auto Train, I do find many of the complaints about flexible dining vastly overblown. It's certainly comparable to airline first class and is far from inedible. I have a couple of them I actually found tasty. The salad could be a little bigger, but you also get a roll and the dessert blondie/brownie and all in all I didn't feel hungry after any of the meals I had. I think improvements on the two nighters are warranted - and according to Amtrak they are coming - but I think the end result will be traditional dining only on the Auto Train, the two nighters, and perhaps the coast starlight. The rest will be a single food service car with perhaps alterations to flexible dining. Amtrak is still indicating they plan to convert the VL2 diners to a single food car.

As an example on my recent Silver Meteor trip I was socializing with two passengers in the VL2 diner/lounge. Both of them commented that they thought the food was good and it was an employee who grunted and commented how it was so much better before.

lordsigma12345 wrote: ↑Wed May 12, 2021 7:57 am This article is telling on the dining front - from my observation on the Silvers when I've had flexible dining is that its mostly long time railfan customers and employees that complain about it - most of the newer and more casual riders (by that I mean - people riding the train to get where they're going or to try something different that aren't rail enthusiasts) I've talked to seem fine with it.
As an example on my recent Silver Meteor trip I was socializing with two passengers in the VL2 diner/lounge. Both of them commented that they thought the food was good and it was an employee who grunted and commented how it was so much better before.

People never complain about lacking something they had never experienced before. But they surely will if they had experienced it.
Amtrak today if you are lucky, serves a flat iron steak, not the ribeyes and prime ribs they had in the past. Please do not suggest they quality of the food is just as great as it once was. You too would miss prime ribs and would complain as well.
What is so bothersome to me is the trend to serve processed foods vs fresh foods. I would rather dine on fresh vegetables off the produce shelves than frozen and canned vegetables packaged in some factory. I would rather dine on fresh baked breads right from the oven than on pasta out of some packaged box or plastic bag with added preservatives. A freshly baked cake straight from the oven that day vs a cake encased in plastic wrapping full of preservatives again. You can tell the difference, and that is what Amtrak used to serve decades ago.
Imagine how tasty McDonald's hamburgers would be if they had cooked them weeks ago and encased them in plastic and just reheated them right before serving them after shucking the plastic wrapping. Golly, Amtrak does not even shuck the plastic wrappings on some, or should I say most, of the food items.
Amtrak might as well install gedunk vending machines and call that the diner quality food. Because the food we are getting from the boxes is no fresher than the food available from any vending machine.

It's basically the same stuff you can get at Costo or Sam's Club. It's good, but it's not to the standards of old.

I think that's the real thing. Flying... gets old after a while

I traveled with my wife, child, and mother from Boston to Lancaster PA this past weekend. My 13 year old, who is not a railfan in any way, declared that it really was the best way to travel. That was a pretty good statement, considering that (courtesy of my business travel) he's flown First class more often than not for his domestic travel.

electricron wrote: ↑Wed May 12, 2021 8:32 am Please do not suggest they quality of the food is just as great as it once was. You too would miss prime ribs and would complain as well.

I don't claim it's as great as it once was, and you are right the flat iron is my "highlight" of Amtrak food as I am a relatively new rider so I never had it when it was ribeye. But many of the most outspoken railfans on this issue (including on certain other boards) have stated the flex food is inedible and trash can worthy and way worse than even domestic first class airline food which I cannot agree with. It's not as good as traditional dining, but it's good enough for an overnight train ride at least for me (and it seems others.) Is it super healthy food? Not going to claim it is - and I think some improvements could be made and I can understand being disappointed in the downgrade but it's not inedible and certainly not stopping traveling by train over. (again at least for me.)

lordsigma12345 wrote: ↑Wed May 12, 2021 2:12 pm I don't claim it's as great as it once was, and you are right the flat iron is my "highlight" of Amtrak food as I am a relatively new rider so I never had it when it was ribeye. But many of the most outspoken railfans on this issue (including on certain other boards) have stated the flex food is inedible and trash can worthy and way worse than even domestic first class airline food which I cannot agree with. It's not as good as traditional dining, but it's good enough for an overnight train ride at least for me (and it seems others.) Is it super healthy food? Not going to claim it is - and I think some improvements could be made and I can understand being disappointed in the downgrade but it's not inedible and certainly not stopping traveling by train over. (again at least for me.)

That's my thinking as well. For straight overnight trains, the FlexDining food does the job. For double-overnight, you really need the full kitchen.

In terms of flavor... well, if I remember correctly, airline food has to be formulated differently due to the different pressure and environment of the flight. The senses that detect flavors are diminished at high altitudes. So by and large, anything on the ground will taste better than up in the air. Comparing train food to airline food is more apples to oranges.

lordsigma12345 wrote: ↑Wed May 12, 2021 2:12 pm

electricron wrote: ↑Wed May 12, 2021 8:32 am Please do not suggest they quality of the food is just as great as it once was. You too would miss prime ribs and would complain as well.

I don't claim it's as great as it once was, and you are right the flat iron is my "highlight" of Amtrak food as I am a relatively new rider so I never had it when it was ribeye. But many of the most outspoken railfans on this issue (including on certain other boards) have stated the flex food is inedible and trash can worthy and way worse than even domestic first class airline food which I cannot agree with. It's not as good as traditional dining, but it's good enough for an overnight train ride at least for me (and it seems others.) Is it super healthy food? Not going to claim it is - and I think some improvements could be made and I can understand being disappointed in the downgrade but it's not inedible and certainly not stopping traveling by train over. (again at least for me.)

I honestly can't remember the last time I got offered anything other than a packet of nuts or crackers on a domestic flight. It's probably been >10 years.

The point is-- and this goes for a lot of other features of modern rail travel-- you can't compare it to what it was in the past. You have to compare the present service and amenities on Amtrak to the present service and amenities on current airlines or buses running competing services in the United States.

Yes, the food on Amtrak doesn't stand up to what was offered in the dining cars of the Super Chief or Merchant's Limited of 1965. But the food on Delta doesn't exactly measure up to the food on Pan Am circa 1965 either.

Memories get a bit rose tinted. I would say some of the meal's in the good old days weren't that good either.

STrRedWolf wrote: ↑Thu May 13, 2021 6:51 am
That's my thinking as well. For straight overnight trains, the FlexDining food does the job. For double-overnight, you really need the full kitchen.

In terms of flavor... well, if I remember correctly, airline food has to be formulated differently due to the different pressure and environment of the flight. The senses that detect flavors are diminished at high altitudes. So by and large, anything on the ground will taste better than up in the air. Comparing train food to airline food is more apples to oranges.

That's my feeling as well concerning dining car service. Any train serving three meals or more should have full dining service available. That would mean the Silvers and the Crescent get full dining back. The Cardinal when it goes daily would also get full dining back. The Capital Limited and Lake Shore would keep the current setup. The western long hauls should get full dining back once the Covid-19 restrictions are lifted with the exception of the CoNO.

As for airline food I've always found it to be bland at best. Yes, it's probably the altitude and dryness that does that. My wife and I when we do fly usually eat at Chili's or some other airport restaurant before the flight. I have heard airlines are starting to catch on to this and are now asking you if you want food. I've also seen people bring food onto the plane .... the chicken bone limited at FL35 .....

STrRedWolf wrote: ↑Thu May 13, 2021 6:51 am In terms of flavor... well, if I remember correctly, airline food has to be formulated differently due to the different pressure and environment of the flight. The senses that detect flavors are diminished at high altitudes. So by and large, anything on the ground will taste better than up in the air. Comparing train food to airline food is more apples to oranges.

Very interesting. I've traveled from New Jersey to New Mexico several times over the past 20 years, by SW Chief. Stayed in Santa Fe, altitude 7,200 feet and Taos, almost as high. The food in the restaurants was incredibly delicious, altitude not withstanding. I now wonder if the chefs compensate accordingly? Airline passenger cabins are usually pressurized to 8,000 feet equivalent, only 800 feet higher than Santa Fe.