• Athearn Dummy Locos & Blue Box Kits

  • Discussion related to everything about model railroading, from layout design and planning, to reviews of related model tools and equipment. Discussion includes O, S, HO, N and Z, as well as narrow gauge topics. Also includes discussion of traditional "toy train" and "collector" topics such as Lionel, American Flyer, Marx, and others. Also includes discussion of outdoor garden railways and live steamers.
Discussion related to everything about model railroading, from layout design and planning, to reviews of related model tools and equipment. Discussion includes O, S, HO, N and Z, as well as narrow gauge topics. Also includes discussion of traditional "toy train" and "collector" topics such as Lionel, American Flyer, Marx, and others. Also includes discussion of outdoor garden railways and live steamers.

Moderators: 3rdrail, stilson4283, Otto Vondrak

  by Desertdweller
 
This is a sad state of affairs. We need to ask ourselves how it got to be this way and what can be done about it.

Are we willing to give up some of the ready-to-run offerings for lower-priced models that involve assembly and finishing? Do we as model railroaders even want to be model builders, or would we rather have simply a ready-to use hobby? Do we want to ignore the fact that newcomers of any age are unable to enter the hobby because of high prices?

Model railroading began as a craftsman's hobby. It appealed to home workshop types, especially people who wanted to learn/maintain skills during the Depression. It actually was a depression-era hobby that appealed to unemployed or grossly underemployed men. When I got into this hobby, I joined an O-scale club that dated from the 1930's and still included original members. In those days,(the 1930's) one had better be at least an amateur machinist if one wanted to have locomotives. It was considered quite a boon in the late 1940's-1950's when locomotive kits became available. At last, someone without a lathe or drill press could build model locomotives!

You can complain about arrogant "take it or leave it" manufacturers, but they wouldn't be so arrogant if their products weren't selling so well. The best way to protest high-priced locomotives is to refuse to buy them. I think a lot of this is the fault of the model railroad press. They seem to have convinced would-be model railroaders they need to have things like onboard sound and DCC if they want to be "serious hobbyists".

Walthers has taken a kick in the head from another poster. I would not know about getting e-mails or letters from them, but I do know firsthand that their phone service is first-class. The people who take your phone orders obviously work there, and will actually check stock for items you are requesting. Walthers was one of the original old-time model railroad companies, and is family-owned.

Another company that I feel is responsive to customer needs is Bachmann. This company has not only greatly increased the quality of their offerings over the past 20 years, but actually maintains a customer service department that offers help and stocks repair parts for their locomotives. They have their own blog website where anybody's products can be discussed and questions answered.

Les
  by ApproachMedium
 
They seem to have no problem selling high priced locomotives, they keep making more and more. Judging by whats left over when I visit many hobby shops that are closing or still around they seem to have a problem selling dummy locomotives to anyone in HO these days. With low amp draw motors, in DC or DCC, there really is no reason for dummys anymore from an operational standpoint. For the few that want to just buy static display... well they are few and far between. I have purchased or gained dummy locos from others just to motor themand get them moving along with the rest of my fleet.


In other news, last november I got two Conrail dummy athearns from someone. I put the two of them on my clubs all DCC layout for our holiday show. Boy was that a fun trick. Someone would pick up a controller and go "why does that loco not move?" And I said because it has no motor. Id get some smug face, and find it later either removed from the layout, detached from its powered buddy or buried someplace in the engine terminal.
  by Ken S.
 
ApproachMedium wrote:They seem to have no problem selling high priced locomotives, they keep making more and more. Judging by whats left over when I visit many hobby shops that are closing or still around they seem to have a problem selling dummy locomotives to anyone in HO these days. With low amp draw motors, in DC or DCC, there really is no reason for dummys anymore from an operational standpoint. For the few that want to just buy static display... well they are few and far between. I have purchased or gained dummy locos from others just to motor themand get them moving along with the rest of my fleet.


In other news, last november I got two Conrail dummy athearns from someone. I put the two of them on my clubs all DCC layout for our holiday show. Boy was that a fun trick. Someone would pick up a controller and go "why does that loco not move?" And I said because it has no motor. Id get some smug face, and find it later either removed from the layout, detached from its powered buddy or buried someplace in the engine terminal.
I haven't used my dummy locos in quite some time. But, considering that one of them has bad couplers and another one has no handrails among other missing parts. Athearn dummies also don't really look that good when leading trains and I think might be prone to push-off derailments when used as leaders since the powered units are heavier. My Proto GP15-1 that works is banned from leading trains with Athearns trailing since it's so light compared to the Bachmann GP38-2s that I own and has a habit of doing this.
  by ApproachMedium
 
You must be doing something wrong. I have two SD9s, one I have yet to power and I always put the unpowered unit leading and never once had an issue, even at blue box warp speed.
  by Backshophoss
 
Most runs of engines are now "limited runs" with"Limited avaibilty" to boot,sometimes refered to as "Plastic Brass" !!
Now tack on DCC Sound decoders and watch the price go higher!
Regreatably,I belive there is only 1 factory building RR models,owned by Bachman,that splits production runs between Europe/UK and
US models.



AM,Try putting "Dummy" type coupler on the "B" end of your dummy engines,or at least cut the trip pin short.
Or try using a KD-118 shelf coupler on the "B" end of those units, should slow down the "diappearing" of those engines
  by ApproachMedium
 
Backshophoss wrote:Most runs of engines are now "limited runs" with"Limited avaibilty" to boot,sometimes refered to as "Plastic Brass" !!
Now tack on DCC Sound decoders and watch the price go higher!
Regreatably,I belive there is only 1 factory building RR models,owned by Bachman,that splits production runs between Europe/UK and
US models.



AM,Try putting "Dummy" type coupler on the "B" end of your dummy engines,or at least cut the trip pin short.
Or try using a KD-118 shelf coupler on the "B" end of those units, should slow down the "diappearing" of those engines
I would, but I sold them at Springfield back in Jan. Had no use for them.
  by jwhite07
 
They seem to have no problem selling high priced locomotives, they keep making more and more. Judging by whats left over when I visit many hobby shops that are closing or still around they seem to have a problem selling dummy locomotives to anyone in HO these days. With low amp draw motors, in DC or DCC, there really is no reason for dummys anymore from an operational standpoint. For the few that want to just buy static display... well they are few and far between. I have purchased or gained dummy locos from others just to motor themand get them moving along with the rest of my fleet.
All I can say is thank goodness I bought most of the locomotive fleet I needed back in the Blue Box days. At one point, all but two of the 18 locomotives for my freelanced railroad were Athearn Blue Box (the two exceptions were a pair of equally inexpensive Walthers GP15Ts). I was buying Athearn dummies as well, just for the cost savings. I even had a pair of Athearn kitbashed SD38-2s and four kitbashed U18Bs with Athearn frames and guts and scale-width Atlas hoods.

After I got away from the poor high school/college student years, I did do some upgrading, but still ten of the 18 are Athearn, and I still have the two Walthers ones as well. They're all motored now (except one of the GP15Ts - I took the motor out years ago and can't remember where I put it!), and I've made some improvements such as a limited amount of superdetailing (plows, horn, bell), and I replaced the sintered metal Athearn wheels with solid nickel ones and added flush-fitting lasercut windows. They'll eventually get DCC and LED lighting when I build a layout.

The real spurge came when I replaced my kitbashed SD38-2s with Kato locomotives, and the U18Bs with Intermountain ones. Even though I got a decent deal and did not pay MSRP on either purchase, the expenditure was noticed and commented on both times! :-P
  by Bigt
 
Desertdweller...I agree with you 100 percent. I will not pay the prices they are charging for the new
locomotives, simple as that. The last new locomotive I bought was an Athearn. It was nothing but one
problem after another with it - right from the box. I will say that they stood by it and took care of each
and every problem. However, when you are charging big bucks for your product, well, in my opinion, there
had better not be problems when you take it out of the box! Since then, I have refused to purchase new
locomotives. And, I agree that the manufacturers will keep producing as long as we modellers continue to
buy. If one wishes to have the high detail and performance options that are now available, fine, that is your
choice. But, the industry should not forget the rest of us either. I used the Athearn dummy units not only
for static displays, but, also for kitbashing (remember that word?) projects. It was one of the more enjoyable
aspects of this hobby, but, I certainly would not think of cutting up a body shell off one of these $200 - $300
models of today. The same goes for rolling stock as well. If I want super detail I will buy the items and add
them myself. We should have that option.

Yes, I realize times change and along with change comes new things with higher prices. But, in my opinion, the
manufacturers are ruining this hobby for us now, and those who will come in the future by this narrow minded
approach.
  by Desertdweller
 
I do not want to be comparing apples and oranges here. I have not modeled in HO scale since 1978, but do have an active roster of 65 powered N-scale Diesel units.
I also have 12 dummy units, mostly acquired along with powered units as sets.

Here is how mine break down by manufacturer:
Atlas: 2
Bachmann: 15
Con-Cor: 8
Intermountain: 2
Kato: 7
Life-Like: 28
Minitrix: 3

Most of these units are at least 5 years old. All cost less than $100 per unit.

I do remember from my HO days that Athern locos were the best deal in terms of quality vs. cost. They had heavy cast frames and trucks, powerful motors with steel frames and output shafts on both ends, all wheels were powered and picked up electricity. Perhaps by requiring the buyer to do simple assembly, the Blue Box locos could sell for what their competitors' lesser products were selling for ready-to-run.

If the manufacturers refuse to sell entry-level equipment at affordable prices, who are they going to sell to when people who can afford today's prices are dead?
Maybe they will switch to building video games?

We need to remember also that a $100 locomotive is not a model railroad. It is useless without a railroad to run on and cars to pull.

Les